EU1 These Days.

[Teeth]

Melee is the most basic fighting mechanic in crpg. Why play a pure meleer when you can be an archer or a horseman as well?

Point and click shooting, that's basic. Riding around, point and click stabbing, that's somewhat basic. The 4 directional blocking/attacking combined, with teamplay, awareness, kicks, feints, stun, chambers and even kickchambers, that is by no definition simple or ordinary gameplay.

The melee system is interesting and unique to the extent, that I see no reason to waste time with the inferior gameplay that is archery or cavalry. It is far from as satisfying as the melee combat.

[tizzango]

I thought everyone went archer to prepare for strat 4? cuz archers do very well at strat opening phase when everyone has peasant gear and weak shields?

boom.

[camperus]

Archer is hard to play, harder than 2h at least for me. Really i dont understand so much rage against archers, the problem is the cavalry (u dont need so much skill to stay top on score with my old friendvalry).

[Tibe]

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Look at what the shortcuts are. Ask yourself again why there's a lot of cav and ranged out there.

You know what, this badly made sketch is  the most accurate interpitation of C-rpg ive ever seen in my life. I exactly ran trough that sketch the entire time of my Crpg playin time. Currently im stuck in the endless fight part of the sketch.

But yea...been avoiding EU 1 and C-rpg overall for a while now. Rangednerf is way bigger than before. Cant really get into proper melee these days and im quite sad.

And did someone acctually mention archery being hard. Well yea...mybe at first. But once you get MW bow and MW arrows with a good archer build  you'd might as well type /god in some console. Cause than archers do about as much dam as a freaking arbalest. Even if lacking any type of aiming skills, that alone would guarantee you a top at the scoreboard if you ran from fights like a coward and shot pointblank.

[Grumbs]

When you die in a melee fight you can say "**** missed that block, wasn't aware of that guy, overextended, used wrong attack direction, misstimed the attack etc." With ranged its more about how well the other player judged his shot. The way to counter ranged is to simply avoid the entire class or hold a shield. Its not really fun gameplay for anyone except the guy shooting. With cav the player at least has to put himself in some risk in order to do some damage. I can be more aware by using tilde key, jump out of his way, look like i'm not aware of him and spin around with a stab that stuns his horse. Sure they can also have some cheap ways to kill, like bumps or some lance kills but it doesn't compare to someone playing a virtually different game to everyone else. Ranged guys test their own skill, and even then you can fail over and over and yet the one time you hit you score a kill or do some damage/stagger a player. Its very one sided skill rather than player vs player. I wouldn't mind just having more player skill based counters

I don't want to be disrespectful to archers/crossbow men though. We have some very skilled players, its just that they feel out of place sometimes, and we just have so many of them. Also for the random archer/crossbow guys, when you have nearly half your team shooting then they will hit something regardless of skill

[Adamar]

Point and click shooting, that's basic. Riding around, point and click stabbing, that's somewhat basic. The 4 directional blocking/attacking combined, with teamplay, awareness, kicks, feints, stun, chambers and even kickchambers, that is by no definition simple or ordinary gameplay.

The melee system is interesting and unique to the extent, that I see no reason to waste time with the inferior gameplay that is archery or cavalry. It is far from as satisfying as the melee combat.

You dont "click and shoot" in ranged. Its way harder to hit and kill people with a bow than with a gs. And I meant basic melee as in, everybody does it, shitty ranged killscore a side, why shouldn't we shoot and ride as well?

[Riddaren]

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Look at what the shortcuts are. Ask yourself again why there's a lot of cav and ranged out there.

I wouldn't say that any class is easier than another.
They all got their pros and cons. You just have to adapt and play it the best possible way.

But for some reason and even though you are one of the best players, atleast as a polearmer, you just have to go berserk against cavalry on the forums.
Of all votes you have done on my post it's like 1 upvote and 99 down votes. Can't think of any player hating cavalry more than you.

It's a shame that someone with so much hate for other classes is a game admin.

[Paul]

Point and click shooting, that's basic. Riding around, point and click stabbing, that's somewhat basic. The 4 directional blocking/attacking combined, with teamplay, awareness, kicks, feints, stun, chambers and even kickchambers, that is by no definition simple or ordinary gameplay.

The melee system is interesting and unique to the extent, that I see no reason to waste time with the inferior gameplay that is archery or cavalry. It is far from as satisfying as the melee combat.

This kind of attitude makes me sick. Both cav and ranged have their own skill levels, while melee in battle is more about hack and slay than dueling deepness. Instead of actually seeing that the true deepness would lie in combined teamplay of cav, inf and range; one just elevates one's own playstyle above they others.

[Riddaren]

One more thing Gurnisson:

That picture says cavalry and archers are the least aware players.
Who are these cavalry players and archers?

From my experience I find the best archers extremely aware. Can't say the same about the best melee players.
There might be a bunch of bad cavalry players but to be a good one high awareness is a requirement.

If any class, it must be polearm that requires least awareness.

I begin to understand why you hate cavalry and archers so much.
Looking forward to try you out.

This kind of attitude makes me sick. Both cav and ranged have their own skill levels, while melee in battle is more about hack and slay than dueling deepness. Instead of actually seeing that the true deepness would lie in combined teamplay of cav, inf and range; one just elevates one's own playstyle above they others.

Totally agree.
I'm getting so tired of players thinking their own way of playing takes most skill while all other classes and playstyles are either OP or easy mode...

[Silicium]

Point and click shooting, that's basic.

What does this have to do with cRPG? If cRPG was like this you would see the avarage archer getting some 20+ kills. If an archer excell at what he's doing that's because he trained for it and knowing wen to synchronise a shoot from the distance hes target is.

Have seen you play and shoot you many time's, you don't even try to dogde ageisn't archers you just charge head on then finnally jump and get killed , no wonder you whine so much.

Riding around, point and click stabbing, that's somewhat basic

I will agree with that, but their are some other builds that make cav harder but not everyone as the time or the patiance to do that.

The 4 directional blocking/attacking combined, with teamplay, awareness, kicks, feints, stun, chambers and even kickchambers, that is by no definition simple or ordinary gameplay.

You think that this dosen't apply to other classes? hell you don't even master half of the stuff you mentioned

The melee system is interesting and unique to the extent, that I see no reason to waste time with the inferior gameplay that is archery or cavalry. It is far from as satisfying as the melee combat.

that's your opinion, in ma case i found being an archer far more challenging, having no wfp in 1hander and managing to kill a full geared polearm/2hander/shielder is better then just having to run around as infantry and doing the same thing over agein.

[Teeth]

This kind of attitude makes me sick. Both cav and ranged have their own skill levels, while melee in battle is more about hack and slay than dueling deepness.

Melee in battle goes beyond duelling in deepness, duelling is only half the skill. Maneuvering, picking your targets, helping the right people is what makes every round of battle so interesting. Ofcourse the battle awareness thing can be found in cav and ranged, but not to the same extent. Due to ranged not having to get close, and cav having supreme maneuverability. While melee has to get in the face of their opponents while not being faster than them.

My overall point with my earlier post is, that the melee combat in this game is what makes it truly unique and what has kept most of us playing all these years. I'm not saying that archery and cav don't require skill, that type of gameplay is just closer to what you can find in other games and that is not why I'm here.

Instead of actually seeing that the true deepness would lie in combined teamplay of cav, inf and range;

I am well aware of this and that is why I am praying on my knees that the clan battle scene of cRPG would come alive again. That is when the dynamics between infantry, ranged and cavalry decide the outcome. Organized small battles are the best thing this game has to offer.

[Ad1no]

[Renegat]

For me melee is easy mode on EU1. Always top section of scoreboard

So in your opinion, melee is now easier because they always top the scorboard? But toping the scorboard is now about doing points per damages, and points for damaging someone is giving according to your class : I headshot someone who had full life : 6 points maybe. I kill someone who had full life as a 1h/2h/pole/lancer : at least 8 or 10 points.
So of course melee always top the scoreboard if they get more than ranged for doing same damages :s But that will never proof melee are ez mod ...

low ranged pressure even with many archers around, biggest impact on round outcome.

Are you often playing on eu1 or even crpg? Cause my feeling about that is totally different :s

Actually playing an archer and doing well is challenging - doing it as melee, either cav or on foot is not.

If your goal is to top the scoreboard, then yes it's "challenging" to play ranged. But it's not challenging to do well as a ranged, as you said. Archers have not been nerfed (as far as i know) and they even got a very slight buff thx to the jump/shoot thingy. But if your goal is to have fun, as an inf, it's not that easy. Personally, i prefer having 30 for 3 deaths kills and a shit score than 1 kill for 6 deaths and toping the scoreboard ... But it might not be the case for everyone i guess.

Ps :

A hard head makes for a soft ass.

hahahaha

[Teeth]

What does this have to do with cRPG? If cRPG was like this you would see the avarage archer getting some 20+ kills. If an archer excell at what he's doing that's because he trained for it and knowing wen to synchronise a shoot from the distance hes target is.

Not sure what your point does to my point. I'm saying melee combat is what truly sets this game apart to the extent that playing archery or cav feels like a waste to me, personally. I'm not talking about balance of archery.

Have seen you play and shoot you many time's, you don't even try to dogde ageisn't archers you just charge head on then finnally jump and get killed , no wonder you whine so much.

No I don't, I can't be arsed to kite an archer for more than 20 seconds, so that's why I jump at them to close the gap they leave. Otherwise they will just keep on running. If the archer makes a mistake, it means that I get a very satisfying jumpkill, if he doesn't I die. I don't care, cause in these situations it's either keep following him and dodge, or turn around and get shot in the arse. I prefer the death or glory way out.

I haven't whined about the strength archery in ages, only about the mechanics which can be fixed so easily, but retards keep on retarding.

You think that this dosen't apply to other classes? hell you don't even master half of the stuff you mentioned

Nice, take a stab at me, thats the way to discuss something. It does apply to other classes, when you are bored of kiting or get dehorsed. The time that you spent shooting and kiting or on a horse, are not as enjoyable to me as being an infantryman on the floor. Again, opinion.

that's your opinion, in ma case i found being an archer far more challenging, having no wfp in 1hander and managing to kill a full geared polearm/2hander/shielder is better then just having to run around as infantry and doing the same thing over agein.

Yep that was my opinion, this is yours. Still it is a fact that the melee combat system is what sets this game truly apart. Ofcourse archers and cav are a part of this, but that's not for me.

[Lansamur]

that's your opinion, in ma case i found being an archer far more challenging, having no wfp in 1hander and managing to kill a full geared polearm/2hander/shielder is better then just having to run around as infantry and doing the same thing over agein.

Pretty much this. Archery is the most challenging class cRPG has to offer. Being a Kuyak-Greatsword hero isn't hard, same as abusing speedbonus as agi-whored swashbuckler (without the buckler).just point and right- or leftclick as you please, then hit "S". Chambering isn't that hard either as you make it out to be. I taught someone to chamber in less than an hour, and his playtime in cRPG was about 3 hours beforehand.

Teeth, you're favoring one class, which you are just specialising in, and completely leave out the notion that archers always need to carry sidearms for melee. Cav needs sidearms, cause Lances aren't all that great in closerange melee on the ground when their horse is dead. Please, next time you're going to start melee-propaganda again, at least try to think beforehand of your arguments. Hybrids will always be weaker in comparison to specialised and making the most out of one single-skill builders. Thus, it is actually a lot more challenging and skill-reliant to play 2 classes at once and still excelling at them, managing to actually top a scoreboard or 2.

Additionally, I guess the actual numbers of ranged players are still about even to earlier times. I certainly haven't felt a difference to before. cRPG-playerbase will ALWAYS whine about ranged, archers especially, cause they never bother to actually think about suitably countering them, either with a shield or by doding them.

PS: Ad1no, do you know Paul? I guess not. One of the best 1h-ers ingame (without shield, mind you), and him probably also having played pretty much every class as an Item-balancer. You just don't know, cause he uses unknown alts.

PPS: Renegat: Really? Archery not nerfed? That has to be... the first patch since the last 20 that it has not been nerfed in any way. Get real.

I like the new score system, as it actually shows who is a teamplayer, and who is just a killstealing bundle of sticks intent on just getting the last hit for his e-peen.