Author Topic: Bad communication between community and devs -> community manager needed!  (Read 3628 times)

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Offline Meow

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I thought this was what Meow was suppose to do yet I don't see him anywhere but IRC which isn't very helpful.

Don't wanna hijack this thread but felt like clearing that up, what I did for a long time was trying to solve all the problems players had when they came up.
From time to time I posted stuff I read on IRC which wasn't on the forum at that point so it might have looked like new info for ircless people or I just posted generic lines to calm down threads that went out of control.

Now I hardly get time to be around and it's just much easier to reply to a few lines on IRC than reading through the whole forum, I still try to reply to all PMs.

So basically what chadz said, the team as a whole won't miss good ideas and if there are important news someone will post them.


Meow probably got all the compassion and kindness drained out of him by the community. In his place I would've regularly started referring to people seeking my help as "retarded cunts" or "whiny 5 year old girls with pigtails". In fact, I already do that and I'm not even forced to deal with them.

:mrgreen:

Offline Nessaj

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On a more serious note, several gaming companies have gone away from CM's.

An example is EVE. Before none of the devs were allowed to talk to the gamers directly on the forum.
That policy was changed. Most of the CM department was fired and now devs communicate directly with the gamers.
This has in many great ways developed a tighter bond between the gamers and the devs. You just accept more shit, when you can talk to the guy who coded it himself and you foten realise they don't do bugs and bad stuff because they hate you.

EVE is also special :D

Any company that allows their player base to fully control the environment of the game themselves is per definition awesome.

Either way though, the less CMs have to be parrots the better, IMO the part of coordinating community requests and such (e.g. forum posts and PR) shouldn't be assigned to a CM or a part of a CM's task.
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Offline dodnet

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-1
TL;DR.

Sorry Joker, you may have good ideas, but that walls of text from you make me skip all your posts. I believe you could have written that in 5 sentences - everyone else can do it  :mrgreen:
The logic of war seems to be that if a belligerent can fight he will fight.

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Offline sF_Guardian

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TL;DR.

Sorry Joker, you may have good ideas, but that walls of text from you make me skip all your posts. I believe you could have written that in 5 sentences - everyone else can do it  :mrgreen:

How do you know if you DR?
I don't want to give a feedback to molly neither i want to ban him,I wanted to give advise high authorities to take his admin rights.Panos you monkey wrench where would u put this topic enlighten me you cancer fuck.

Offline Micah

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... and you foten realise they don't do bugs and bad stuff because they hate you.
you naive little thing  :mrgreen:
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Offline Tristan

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Offline Joker86

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Well okay, I see where you are coming from.

My impression was just that the developers don't answer things because they can't read everything, and they can't always see a valid question which is in post #455 on some random topic, which actually deserves receiving an answer.

When we don't say something, it's not because we are too "lazy" to post on the forum. It's either because we don't know at this point, or we do know and don't want to communicate it yet.

I fear this is a basic problem. You created the "cRPG: status and plans" topic in the announcement forum, and when I saw it I was really tickled, but when I read it I was rather disappointed. Yes, it actually contained the stuff promised in the headline, but I was also hoping for some general, more basic plans and philosophies. Like the questions I mentioned above: what should be more important for success? Skill or teamplay? How far do you want to go into the realism direction? How close will you stick to unrealistic but skill demanding gameplay? What is the way you balance items? Do you have a certain background in mind, which cultures/time periods are okay, which are not? Why? Do you try to force the players to behave like in a real battle (e.g. shoulder to shoulder with your teammates?) or are battles only a basic background for indipendant fights? Are you planning on adding "secondary" skills which help in battles, like in SP where charisma or intelligence also play a (minor) role? What is the targeted relation of the influence of skill and character stats on your success? 50-50? 40-60? 90-10?

If those questions could be clarified, a lot of arguments in this forum could be prevented, because everyone tries to interprete your intentions his way, and that's why his opinion is the right one. If everybody knew what the developers would want to achieve, there would be not much room left for discussions.

If you don't really know it yet: then discuss it! Put things clear, I think your work can only benefit from it.


And when I have some real info, I have to take the time to explain it to the community manager and make sure he does understand it so he doesn't misquote me.
And how would that be easier or faster than me posting it directly?

It is not, of course. And if it is a more complicated matter, it's best you post it yourself. It would still be faster because you don't need to read through the entire forum to find the question worth an answer, the CM does it for you, all you have to do is to answer it.

It's really just a guy in the middle that takes away community interaction.

Which interaction?  :P

I think, at least the suggestions which are declined deserve an answer and a short explanation. If someone makes the effort to write a suggestion, then he deserves an answer, I think.

Edit: and if you think the forum is the wrong medium for those things: then I think this ought to be changed, because messages on IRC channels don't last, and if some info is given 99,9% of the playerbase won't get to know it, as it will disappear. You need a medium which is more "sustainable", like a forum. That way you can also refer to older statements. You can't always rely on community members picking up the information in IRC and posting it somewhere in the forum.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2012, 03:20:00 pm by Joker86 »
Joker makes a very good point.
î saved for eternety (without context  :mrgreen:)

Offline Kajia

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+1
When we don't say something, it's not because we are too "lazy" to post on the forum. It's either because we don't know at this point, or we do know and don't want to communicate it yet.

Either way, all you would get from a "community manager" is someone saying "I don't know" on any question you ask him. I can code a bot for that if you want.

And when I have some real info, I have to take the time to explain it to the community manager and make sure he does understand it so he doesn't misquote me.
And how would that be easier or faster than me posting it directly?

It's really just a guy in the middle that takes away community interaction.

Why do you think the "big gamestudios" have someone like that? Because they don't give a shit about the community themselves. I do.

good.


and what joker said:
give more immediate answers
how it usally goes: someone posts an idea, then people like it or throw shit at him, and at one point you react, but in most cases all hope is lost (or so it seems) because the idea was just flogged to death or simply abandoned because the text was too long or whatever.


Edit: and if you think the forum is the wrong medium for those things: then I think this ought to be changed, because messages on IRC channels don't last, and if some info is given 99,9% of the playerbase won't get to know it, as it will disappear. You need a medium which is more "sustainable", like a forum. That way you can also refer to older statements. You can't always rely on community members picking up the information in IRC and posting it somewhere in the forum.

this exactly!
maybe you can make the suggestion board a suggestion-only board, with discussions being in a different thread. this would help keeping the spammers/trolls/lobbyists (OP or not) at bay and still be lasting and public. this would treat the ideas with due respect for there is no 'falling into the void of the forum time-line due to reposts'

if there is something to discuss there should be a discussion thread too, but a separate one. if someone has something to say, like honestly, he will quote and post; but if he's just a troll and flamer, he might just don't care anymore, because his attempts are not as a direct 'insult' as they are now.


I fear this is a basic problem. You created the "cRPG: status and plans" topic in the announcement forum, and when I saw it I was really tickled, but when I read it I was rather disappointed. Yes, it actually contained the stuff promised in the headline, but I was also hoping for some general, more basic plans and philosophies. Like the questions I mentioned above: what should be more important for success? Skill or teamplay? How far do you want to go into the realism direction? How close will you stick to unrealistic but skill demanding gameplay? What is the way you balance items? Do you have a certain background in mind, which cultures/time periods are okay, which are not? Why? Do you try to force the players to behave like in a real battle (e.g. shoulder to shoulder with your teammates?) or are battles only a basic background for indipendant fights? Are you planning on adding "secondary" skills which help in battles, like in SP where charisma or intelligence also play a (minor) role? What is the targeted relation of the influence of skill and character stats on your success? 50-50? 40-60? 90-10?

If those questions could be clarified, a lot of arguments in this forum could be prevented, because everyone tries to interprete your intentions his way, and that's why his opinion is the right one. If everybody knew what the developers would want to achieve, there would be not much room left for discussions.

If you don't really know it yet: then discuss it! Put things clear, I think your work can only benefit from it.

absolutely! you speak my mind dude!

devs, I see it this way: your mod is a community project, we help you develop a game by playing it and giving feedback - just tell us where you're going.
on a bigger level I DON'T ACTUALLY CARE if you nerf this or delete that, doesn't matter!! but give us some philosophy to work with and we'll help you figure it out!

enlighten us, please? :D


if this would happen I would even seriously think about helping out with stuff (2D, 3D, animation), but I cba to join the crew of an aimless wreckage floating on a deep pool of haters and fools (which it is not obviously, that's just my most pessimistic impression, there IS hope ... *orchestral melody*).

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Offline LordBerenger

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Sign me up for community manager. I will report your needs, community!
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Offline Micah

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Sign me up for community manager. I will report my needs, community!
here, fixed it for you =D
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Offline bosco

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Would be a start to have a thread in the Announcement section that contains info on new versions... right now you usually have to go through the bugtracker to see what has changed.

Offline Zisa

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giggle worthy thread.

http://mwomercs.com/media/video/dPoqjslGcO0

skip to the 1 minute mark for the part that makes me laugh every time I think of it...
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Offline Swaggart

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Thanks a lot!

I got a similar site for you:

http://higherpayingskills.com/2011/12/improve-concentration-attention-span/

Seriously, folks, if you are not able to read any text which is longer than three sentences, I would really recommend you to limit your participation onto the spam forum, because some matters can not be discussed with one liners. I don't fucking care if you didn't read or not.

I was being serious and not trolling in any way. What you wrote can easily be condensed into two paragraphs. That will make your posts much more appealing to read. While this is a forum and not quick messaging service you can't blame people if they don't want to read walls of text that are needlessly long.

No need to be testy.

Offline Nessaj

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+1
giggle worthy thread.

http://mwomercs.com/media/video/dPoqjslGcO0

skip to the 1 minute mark for the part that makes me laugh every time I think of it...

FORUM USER KILLER

HAHAHA!

Good name for a Mech.
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Offline chadz

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+1
I fear this is a basic problem.

Not for me, for me it's the ultimate freedom.