Archers rework no?

[Leshma]

some archers are imposible to dodge when you come close to them it is just pure luck you're able to dodge the arrow, and you won't catch them anyway.
In native archers can kill infantry with melee weapon while being slower.
And that's how, I think, it should be :\

Well, yeah. They can't miss you from one meter distance. I wasn't talking about that.

Just in case you think I'm some my old friendcher lobbying here, I'm not.

Twohander with 18/24 build and 175 wpp in 2H here. Whole point of that build is hunting archers. And they still are easiest targets on the battlefield, most of them. When longbow was only pierce bow it was a lot easier catching archers. Now, horn bow builds are everywhere and they often have 8 ath like me...

[Miwiw]

The vast majority of 2h don't use shields not because they are lazy/proud 2h elitists. It's just not a good idea at all. Doing so cripples their speed. Iirc putting it on your back slows one down even more than in hand. Shield 2h also suffer the same problem as shielders : it doesn't really allow you to kill archers, and won't protect you against two (or more) decent archers. In the end they are better being faster and having an easier time dodging arrows (2h and polearms don't require a lot of PS to inflict damage and avoid glances, unlike 1h, so they are free to get more agi).

Seriously and to be honest, if 1 player fights two other guys he is actually meant to die and there is nothing bad or unfair about that as they are 2 people and therefore have more chances to kill 1 guy. The 1 player can only kill both of them if he is better skilled than those 2 or if both of them do mistakes which causes their death.
The shield protects them from arrows, they can use the shield and sacrifice some speed at the same time. That is something you have to think about, either see the chance you get shot or sacrifice speed and save HP from some shots. A shield does not guarantee victory, neither distance for an Archer does.

People choosing a heavy STR build choose HP and DMG instead of speed, therefore they cannot chase a high AGI player. They chose to play like that, at the same time they could get a hybrid build like 18-21 and get more ATH to be able to chase other players. There is always an advantage and at the same disadvantage about builds people choose.

Also see Leshma's posts. Perfect example for being able to adapt to the current system (Archer's kiting).

[Shadowren]

Archer is balanced atm. No need to be nerfing them again. Last time a nerf happened i could take over 30 arrows and the time after that when they where buffed i got 2 shotted in full plate.

So long story short being an Archer in game is balanced   

[Leshma]

Well, Kafein is almost right about "good" players being good at blocking but bad at dodging. But truth is they aren't that good. They are great duelists, that's for sure. Most of those pro duelists can't win against lancer cavalry, suck at dodging arrows, aren't much of a battle players.

But they are still able to make serious impact on outcome because of their exceptional dueling skills.

That's why I'm pro hybrid. Best players are those who can play equally every class, players like Chase/Muffin/Gurnisson. Not some 2H hero Phyrex wannabe who recently bought Vaegir Warmask and Black Plates armor or most likely Kuyak...

Strong hybrids are the only way to show everyone how really good some players are. And those who are only skilled with 2H will be crushed, which is something they deserve.

[Arrowblood]

i think im the only archer who is not playing with athletics or with ps, whats wrong with me im just shooting?

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Dear Leshma, my old friendchers can have good melee and my old friendcher capabilities if they choose not to my old friend out and run, but, why would anyone choose to risk their lives when they could just run forever knowing no one will ever catch 'em, let me show you a fun little build.

Slichs
30
18/21
6PS
4ATH
6PD
7WM

WPF:
2h/1h/pole: 55
my old friendchery: 160

Now, here you can fight in melee slightly weaker than regular melee chars, but, would you do that when you could...

my old friendcher
30

15/24
5PD
8ATH
8WM

173 wpf

...Run forever?

Do so that PD lowers your effective ath if you have over 3 ath if possible, scaling so it lowers it very slightly at 4, as in, 4=3,75, then, at 5, 5=4, then at 6, 6=4,75, then at 7, 7=5,5, and so on, I personally do think bows need a damage buff, a tiny accuracy buff, and along with that accuracy buff they need an angle nerf so you gotta aim way higher for long range shots, along with the effective removal of kiting.

Also, if it's possible I'd like to see damage of an arrow being higher the further the target is from the shooter.

[Farrok]

The vast majority of 2h don't use shields not because they are lazy/proud 2h elitists. It's just not a good idea at all. Doing so cripples their speed. Iirc putting it on your back slows one down even more than in hand. Shield 2h also suffer the same problem as shielders : it doesn't really allow you to kill archers, and won't protect you against two (or more) decent archers. In the end they are better being faster and having an easier time dodging arrows (2h and polearms don't require a lot of PS to inflict damage and avoid glances, unlike 1h, so they are free to get more agi).

when you charge against two or more archers alone you shouldn`t  have it easy to rape them...its the same with melee against 2 or more...still when you have the skills you can even win that.
even me can win against several noobs its funny everytime stupid 2h spammer noobs come against my archer when i shoot to backstab me and then run in fear when i draw my cute little pickaxe xD or most of the enemy team want to kill me and hit their teammates more than me

though i agreed that most of the time you are better of without shield as melee...i use a buckler or a elite cav shield(against archers) sometimes but most of the time i put away the shield against archers to dodge or against katanaspammers or other fast spammers because i would be too slow otherwise.

[Adamar]

Zlish, most kiters only run because they have no real melee build, so they're gonna die. Fighting is funnier than running, but you must have a decent survival chance or you might as well just take the hit to get it over with, as sometimes they do.

[Dalfador]

Archery's been nerfed enough. I had to switch to another class just because it took 5 longbow shots to kill someone in mail. Pick on a class your own size, bub.

[//saxon]

yes im playing as a archer atm closing in on lvl 32 and its very hard man, just play it for 1 gen or even make a skip the fun char il lend you 20k and you play archer from the skip the fun and just see how difficult it is. Cav is my worst, worst, WORST enemy now its horrible and i get cav coming for me all the time, they are NOT afraid. but hey archery is fun brings a new look to cRPG when your first trying it out like me.

[XyNox]

Slichs
30
18/21
6PS
4ATH
6PD
7WM

WPF:
2h/1h/pole: 55
friendly archery: 160

That was my last build. 90% of the time the enemy just runs away trying to stay at the edge of his 2h blade after they notice that you can block and feint. Fuckin 2h kiting my old friends !

[Haboe]

I have no problem with archers atm...
Get a shield (even the weakest no requirementshield) and you can block arrows...

Im a dedicated shielder, one of the pro's of being shielder is that you wont die from ranged where all them lolstabbers will take damage. Nerf archers and you nerf shielders...

they dont do a lot of damage anyway... they are unrealisticly accurate though, so if you nerf them, nerf accuracy not damage. Medium-heavy body armor can take a few hits, which i dont think is op. + headshot should kill with normal head armor...

[bagge]

From my experience, I can survive up to 6 or 7 arrows if I'm standing still (or moving from arrows for negative speed bonus) and being on the same level with an archer. I'm talking about average archer, not guys like bagge with 180+ wpf in archery and MW equipment (bagge holds bow ready for some time to get bonus damage).

Tsk, I've put some melee wpf so I'm not anywhere near that archery wpf

[bagge]

Some might say "cav kills archers", but the thing is... cav doesn't want to go kill archers, because they are afraid for their horse to be ravished.

Bullshit.

Most cavs are patient and waits for an opportunity to backstab you, which means you are dead, sir.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

That was my last build. 90% of the time the enemy just runs away trying to stay at the edge of his 2h blade after they notice that you can block and feint. Fuckin 2h kiting my old friends !

Greatswords are gay, greatsworders are gay, btw: with 4 ath and some lightish armor they shouldn't be able to 100% backpedal you to death, and, jumping usually catches these motherfuckers off guard.