Buff alternate mode damage

[Digglez]

So whats the point of having the alternate damage modes if they do less....far less...far far less damage than normal mode?  I have yet to see a situation (using damage calculator) where the alternate mode would actually be useful.

Could we actually BUFF the pierce damage on them so they might do more damage vs 55+ armor?

[TurmoilTom]

I've seen dudes use the blunt end of the poleaxe or steel pick to get knockdown, switch the original mode and then hit them while they're down... But I can't imagine it happening all that often. Honestly, I've never really found a decent use for the alt-modes.

[Penitent]

It's just there for flavor and variability.  If it improved the weapons too much (by making some weapons too versatile) it would mess with the balance of weapon choices.  So the alt mode has to be slightly inferior to retain proper balance in my view.

[Wraist]

It's just there for flavor and variability.  If it improved the weapons too much (by making some weapons too versatile) it would mess with the balance of weapon choices.  So the alt mode has to be slightly inferior to retain proper balance in my view.

He's thinking of the warhammer, which does 30ish blunt+kb in normal, or 26 pierce +2speed in alternate. The only two weapons I know of where alt mode might be worth it are the bec and poleaxe [maybe elegant] as it gives a kb chance.

Anywho, I use the alternate mode of the warhammer, and I was thinking of suggesting something similar so...

[Digglez]

He's thinking of the warhammer, which does 30ish blunt+kb in normal, or 26 pierce +2speed in alternate. The only two weapons I know of where alt mode might be worth it are the bec and poleaxe [maybe elegant] as it gives a kb chance.

Anywho, I use the alternate mode of the warhammer, and I was thinking of suggesting something similar so...

nope, referring to stuff like Broad 1h & Iron War axes, German poleaxe, Military hammer/pick.  Havent used poleaxe yet but I'm sure it falls into same category

[Zerran]

The military cleaver used to have a decent alt-mode for pierce... then it got removed. 

[Patoson]

The worst is the secondary mode of 2h, which turns them into polearms (WTF) with less than 30c swing damage.

[Ptolemy]

Protip: If the alt-mode is the better mode, it's no longer the alt-mode, the weapon just defaults to the wrong mode.

[Wraist]

The worst is the secondary mode of 2h, which turns them into polearms (WTF) with less than 30c swing damage.

However, it deals a lot more pierce damage. When I last checked a MW GGS has 35 pierce in alt mode [several months ago], which [I think] is as much as a Masterwork Awlpike. It's significantly better than some of the others alt modes

[Herr_Thomas]

However, it deals a lot more pierce damage. When I last checked a MW GGS has 35 pierce in alt mode [several months ago], which [I think] is as much as a Masterwork Awlpike. It's significantly better than some of the others alt modes

I can confirm this, in a tight melee it actually works pretty well, so long as you have someone with you who can keep you from getting spammed since your swings are useless and you lose ~5 speed.

[Zerran]

Protip: If the alt-mode is the better mode, it's no longer the alt-mode, the weapon just defaults to the wrong mode.

It isn't supposed to be better all around, it's supposed to be useful in key situations (for example, a cut weapon changing to pierce to deal with very heavily armored opponents.)

Currently, the damage reduction is so great though that it's never worth it to change to alt mode.

[Leshma]

Another good idea.

While polearms have somewhat decent alternate mode and onehanders have solid alternate 2h mode, most twohanded weapons have shitty alternate mode.

I really don't see why, for example, longsword (HBS or bastardsword) don't have same stats in 1h mode like arabian cavalry sword (knightly arming sword).

Also, onehanded weapons which don't have alternate mode should get it. Every onehanded sword or mace can be used twohanded. No reason to insist on such high specialization.

[XyNox]

One of the main problems with this is probably the input command for changing secondary modes. It only changes to sec if you are not mid swing and there is no icon on the hud for it. When mid fight you have to make sure you are not attacking, then look at your stance to find out if sec is active and then you can continue fighting. By that time the surprise effect is long gone.

Pressing x at any time should get the secondary active. If you press it mid swing it should apply for the next swing so you dont have to actively monitor it. Then I would be willing to learn how to use this system to my advantage but as of now its destroying the flow of the fight too much.

[Digglez]

One of the main problems with this is probably the input command for changing secondary modes. It only changes to sec if you are not mid swing and there is no icon on the hud for it. When mid fight you have to make sure you are not attacking, then look at your stance to find out if sec is active and then you can continue fighting. By that time the surprise effect is long gone.

Pressing x at any time should get the secondary active. If you press it mid swing it should apply for the next swing so you dont have to actively monitor it. Then I would be willing to learn how to use this system to my advantage but as of now its destroying the flow of the fight too much.

if you use heirloom pack you can notice a change in the icons in the bottom right of UI.  Go from the color/texture of heirloom back to base when you are in alt mode.  Dunno if it helps with non-heirloom weapons, but its a start.  Would be pretty easy to just inverse the icon for alt mode as well

[Nehvar]

I agree.  Some weapons, like the langes, have a decent alt-mode already but most weapons have terrible alt-modes that you would never use.  The alternate mode of a weapon needs to be balanced against the primary mode.  Otherwise, what is the point?