The Longbowman

[Leshma]

According to some pictures I've found scattered over the internet, this is the example of the longbowman, although with better protection than some others I've found:

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Problem with this outfit is that it weights 14.5 in total (2x1.3 for helmet; 10.6 for body armor; 4x0.1 for gloves; 0.9 for boots). That's 4.5 above WPF limit which is 10 at the moment.

I'm aware of the fact that this set, fully loomed, has 48 body armor, 37 head armor and 39 leg armor. But, no one asked balancers to put such high armor ratings for these items.

Anyways, this is probably the heaviest equipment an archer would wear. Compared to the heaviest equipment knights wore (79 body armor rating), that's quite a noticeable difference. More than 30 armor points which is huge.

[Ronin]

My proposal is to make this setup viable for ranged classes but also to separate upkeep for ranged, cavalry and infantry. So that an archer with this setup pays the same price as knight in full plate armor.

For only armor or all equipment combined? In either cases, it doesn't make much sense though.

[Leshma]

It's kinda unfair that archers have plenty of ugly items to choose from while infantry get all the good armors.

[Ronin]

But why you think a knight in full plate set and an english longbowman should pay the same upkeep? Higher weight decreases their wpf and movement speed already. Even without these, why you want to make archers pay more money?

[Adamar]

You also see longbowmen represented with mailed brigandines, but the devs dont want archers to wear proper armor. Even my scale armor is making me lose money, which only encourages lighter kiting builds.
I already suggested several times that the accuracy penalty should be considerably reduced. I personaly dont see any ballance issues with archers wearing proper medium armor, so why not take this step?

[Banzai!!!]

To look like a proper longbowmen I would actually change that helmet to this:

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But the trouble is that I am only first gen and so money is a bit of an issue and Im having to wear these items just to make money as an archer:

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I agree that accuracy needs to be less affected by weight but to propose that someone wearing your armour setup would be paying the same amount as someone in plate armour is insane!!! All this would achieve is that archers like myself who are only gen 1 and have little money would now be wearing less armour and so would be kiting even more which is what people are complainging about the most.

So YES to archer penalty being reduced but NO to archers paying the same amount of money in medium armour as to infantry in plate armour!!!

[Penitent]

That armor is viable for archers already!

The longbow man in history did not wear armor that did not impede is movement at all.  He wore armor that is a balance between protection and weight. He sacrificed some flexibility for adequate protection.  He likely wore as much protection as possible while maintaining the ability to shoot.  The armor you posted is just that!  Magnificent in its design and functionality.

[Adamar]

 IRL chest, head, and leg weight doesn't affect your aim at all, because you're standing straight. Unless we're wearing some heavy gautlets or maille hauberks with long sleeves, the accuracy penalty isn't justified at all. What it does is encourage kiting and make the game less fun for all, archers included.

[Penitent]

IRL chest, head, and leg weight doesn't affect your aim at all, because you're standing straight. Unless we're wearing some heavy gautlets or maille hauberks with long sleeves, the accuracy penalty isn't justified at all. What it does is encourage kiting and make the game less fun for all, archers included.

Head and chest weight can affect your aim.  Try shooting a bow with a heavy backpack on (weight on your back and shoulders, the muscles used to draw the bow) and a metal football helmet on.  You won't shoot as good as with nothing.   Trust me!

I actually think that gloves would reduce accuracy less than body armor, since the hands do little of the aiming.

It's possible for leg weight to make it a bit harder to establish foot position (also important in aiming a bow) especially when running around, but this would be a much lesser effect compared to body armor weight and head.

[Adamar]

First you pull the bow, with the arrow already pointing into the general target area, while you position you body. The final motion of actually aiming and releasing the arrow is a really small one. So, again, I dont see why body weight would affect you precision.

edit: unless you have some significant weight in your left hand generating inertia, that will indeed affect your aim.

[Penitent]

First you pull the bow, with the arrow already pointing into the general target area, while you position you body. The final motion of actually aiming and releasing the arrow is a really small one. So, again, I dont see why body weight would affect you precision.

edit: unless you have some significant weight in your left hand generating inertia, that will indeed affect your aim.

Ok, imagine this.  You are on a battlefield with your friend.  You have chosen to wear a tunic and trousers, while your friend dons knee-length chainmail coat.  You are running through the battefield, trying to get in to position.  You are blocked by enemy infantry and double-back.  You run though a thicket, dodging branches and leaping over small logs and clambering over fallen trees.  You wade chest-deep into a river to cross it, and then sprint up a 60 ft hill where you can get a good view of the enemy formation.  You both grab an arrow and begin to draw your bows.  You're sweaty, your breath is labored.  Your heart is pounding to the point you can feel your pulse in your eardrums.  Your muscles burn with fatigue and your hands shake slightly as you pull the full weight back of your 90lb bow and complete your aiming just before you release your arrows.

Who will have a more steady aim in his back, shoulders, arms, and hands as they draw and aim? Who will have a steadier stance in their legs?  You or your friend who wore the knee-length chainmail coat? 

I think its one more reason to have armor not affect aim so much, but have armor effect stamina and stamina effect aim.   But with the game we have, it's not such a bad representation.

[Miwiw]

The friend would have stumbled when getting up the hill, falling down into the river and drowning. 

I actually dont have anything to say to the topic, it is already lovely that the penalty was lowered and archers can have up to 10 weight without a problem. Most will still wear less, especially low weight hand and head armor.

[Adamar]

Yeah, stamina, right. Nice scenario, but we're talking about archery, you usually dont need to run to get to the enemy.

[Teeth]

Maybe the archery system should be changed so that being a bow armed peasant that runs away all the time is not the way to go.

[Miwiw]

They are roleplaying though. What else should a peasant do than running away. However for that, their damage is quite too high then. Real soldiers, including archers, stand their ground (in cover behind friends or on a hill...). That is something most ppl miss tho.