Author Topic: Constructive Feedback/Bugs  (Read 1879 times)

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Offline priest

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Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« on: January 05, 2011, 07:36:14 pm »
+1
I am posting these in general discussion rather than bugs because there's more feedback involved.  Most of the bugs I have found have also already been brought to the attention of the devs.

Starting out, keep this thread constructive, well thought out and flame free, I welcome discussion, debate, and compromises but frown upon straight flaming.  I enjoy the game even after the patch, let that be said first.  The issues with the patch that I've found come from personal opinion and by no means intended to spark the idea that they are game breaking changes. That being said lets begin.

Archery
I do not mind a "nerf" to archers but i feel as if the bows have been taken our of the players hands a bit in the patch.  I feel that the animations are just fine, they don't feel too slow at all (and this comming from a horse archer).  They look cool, they feel realistic in a sense, and I enjoy them just fine.  However, coupled with the damage decrease i feel it is a bit much.  I've played a good 5-7 hours with a critical mind (not just for fun, being quite aware of what I, and the people around me, were doing).  The damage decrease is a bit much for a game, that by looking only at the kills per round, was already dominated by melee and crossbows.  This is now opinion that I believe if you are to slash the damage dealing power, the older animations should be used.  If you keep the animations, increase the damage back up a bit. 

Xbows
The idea that these were nerfed that hard at all is insane.  They still one shot me on a consistent basis and i doubt everyone that does so has the sniper xbow with 150 WPF.  They are just fine, don't need to be rebuffed, and i honestly never felt the reason for a nerf to begin with.  High damage coupled with the shot speed of a snail balances itself.

Team Horse Bumps
A great idea in theory but I have found the application of such has fallen short.  As a cav player myself I have found little difficulty in steering away from bumping my teammates.  I keep myself aware of their locations and weave in an out as necessary (aided by the fact i have a high maneuverability with the sarranid horse).  The same cannot be said for a lot of my teammate cav players with itchy forward movement fingers.  Since cav can spawn in the middle of infantry, many people wind up leaving spawn at around half health.  FF horse bumping isn't a huge issue, nor game breaking, but we need to raise awareness to careless cav players before bans begin to be thrown out excessively. 

Upkeep
Now for what i believe, is a bug.  The upkeep system seems to work out just fine in theory but after doing some testing and really paying attention to numbers, I don't think it is working as intended.  I am lucky enough to have nice round numbers to work with on my expensive items such as the 20k sarranid horse.  The horse costs around 4k to repair which brings upkeep costs at around a 20% value, just fine if you ask me.  With the new xp and gold system I think this will work just fine, my issues now come to how the system is functioning currently.  It seems to me that items break far too frequently.  I don't know if this was intended but paying attention to the upkeep of my items I've noticed that they tend to break on the upwards of 65-80% of the time.  This is a change that will not only hurt the rich folk in plated armor, but the newer player such as myself.  They will wind up stuck in the same dilemmas that the well geared players have even in medium gear.  Again, i don't know how the system was intended but to me it seems like an excessive and possibly not working as intended. 

Another aspect of the system that may be bugged is that: upkeep seems to disallow actual monetary gains on losing rounds making the upkeep seem worse than it needs to be.  From my testing it seems that if something is repaired, any money that is gained does not offset the upkeep value.  I don't know if there is a coding issue that you cannot lose and gain gold at the same time or not, or if the system is just not working properly at the moment but there is definitely something there that isn't quite right.  I think this is something should should be looked into asap, or explained that it is working as intended at least. 

Misc. bugs
If I apply my horse to my spawn inventory on the site, it shows up in game just fine.  If I do not do so, it does not show up in game for use and thus, unavailable.  It is an heirloomed sarranid horse (heavy sarranid, 4 riding req. which i meet).  Not sure if this is related to the issue many are having with the availability of their other heirloomed items.

There is also an issue it seems with the in-game stat allocator (default "c" button).  It seems to always reflect my attribute stat values as well as WPF values from the website correctly.   The problems seem to fall upon skill point values.  I have personally found that sometimes my skill points from the character i retired show up.  I am a HA with points only in riding, HA, and Weapon Mastery, yet my retired values from Power strike, Iron Flesh, and athletics sometimes are shown in the in-game screen along with my true skill points.

Sometimes throwing animations can hang halfway through and get stuck and you need to begin it all over again to release the weapon, as a non-thrower I don't know if this is a new issue or was always an issue.  Just my experience with throwing my free rocks while naked yesterday.

I will add more to this list as I find more bugs or more issues that I feel should be discussed (keyword here).  I think to properly discover bugs or issues with the game we need semi-comprehensive patch notes so that we can pin point things that are or aren't working as intended, otherwise there will just be more for the devs to discover on their own or sift through the QQ posts.

I cannot stress this enough:  I am in no way shape or form whining.  I like the patch, for the most part I like the changes.  Without change things become stale and I like where cRPG is going and will continue to enjoy the game for months to come.  Thank you for reading the entirety of this post and I hope we can begin an intelligent and constructive thread.

And thank you chadz and the rest of the dev team.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2011, 01:45:29 am by priest »

Offline priest

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2011, 07:46:03 pm »
0
I would also like to add, separate from my main post, that people please do not confuse game balance with real life.  As an example i add this youtube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yorHswhzrU (real stuff starts at around 1:40) which depicts an archer who shows how an archer could indeed fire quite quickly (even more so than the older animations allowed).  This by no means is an attempt to prove that the game should allow this, only to point out that we cannot call for balance to reflect real life because the two should always be separated.  We must remember this is a video game.

Offline FICO

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2011, 07:48:10 pm »
0
regarding stuck animation for throwing. it is an old issue it seems (i posted that on other forum)
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Offline Kophka

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2011, 07:48:29 pm »
0
Several great points here.

On the archery, I agree. With the elimination of carried over wpf, and uber high levels, archery probably wouldn't ever be near the threat it was before patch. This is if everything had stayed the same. I do love the nocking animation, but the hunching forward thing is simply hideous.

Xbows seem alright. I'm going to try my 100 prof light xbower out today, and I'll modify this if needed.

Horse bump FF is horrendous. It's tough enough on the more open and balanced maps of EU, on the NA box/maze maps, it's going to take cav right out of the game. Many cav are watching where they go, but foot people are not. They'll run right in front of cav that would have missed them if they had just kept in a straight line, instead of suddenly veering off into the cavs path.

And the sticky throwing weapons bug is still in place, but it's a Native bug, I'm not sure if our guys can fix that.

Offline Babelfish

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2011, 08:51:32 pm »
0
Horse bump FF is horrendous. It's tough enough on the more open and balanced maps of EU, on the NA box/maze maps, it's going to take cav right out of the game. Many cav are watching where they go, but foot people are not. They'll run right in front of cav that would have missed them if they had just kept in a straight line, instead of suddenly veering off into the cavs path.

Horse friendly-fire is probably my favorite part of this patch, its so delicious to watch my enemy (who i was engaged in melee with) go down with me, when a horse decides to help by bumping <3

Offline Tristan

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2011, 01:48:15 am »
0
Good thread, and overall I agree with you.

I got some additional points. With the current workings of autobalance and multiplier something ain't good:

a) Either one team pawns the other wins for four rounds, then balance then the other wins for four rounds. One team gets a lot of multiplying then loose it. SOmehow.. that just seems not good.

b) Either team equals and then you have no effect of multiplier

problem. You still need a reward for winning, but maybe multiplier should be less, both winning and loosing team pay upkeep only winning team less chance to destroy items.

Summary and my suggestion:
Both teams pay upkeep. Winning team less. Less effect of multiplier.
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Offline priest

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2011, 01:53:01 am »
0
Good thread, and overall I agree with you.

I got some additional points. With the current workings of autobalance and multiplier something ain't good:

a) Either one team pawns the other wins for four rounds, then balance then the other wins for four rounds. One team gets a lot of multiplying then loose it. SOmehow.. that just seems not good.

b) Either team equals and then you have no effect of multiplier

problem. You still need a reward for winning, but maybe multiplier should be less, both winning and loosing team pay upkeep only winning team less chance to destroy items.

Summary and my suggestion:
Both teams pay upkeep. Winning team less. Less effect of multiplier.

I don't think that both teams paying upkeep would be a good idea.  Another thing i thought about (mainly since i don't really know just how difficult this code really is) is not to have upkeep every round loss, but at map loss.  I do agree that the auto-balance still needs some polish as well.

Offline AngryScotsman

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2011, 01:53:34 am »
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With regards to horse bumping; there is nothing wrong with it. Ideally the cavalry should steer clear of friendly infantry and flank enemies like they are supposed to. Ideally cavalry works as a unit to smash into enemy ranks, like they were used in medieval combat. However, ideals are anything but present in CRPG with the clusterfuck deathmatch it is.

Offline Kophka

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2011, 02:09:02 am »
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I don't think that both teams paying upkeep would be a good idea.  Another thing i thought about (mainly since i don't really know just how difficult this code really is) is not to have upkeep every round loss, but at map loss.  I do agree that the auto-balance still needs some polish as well.

Actually, I support that as well. Equipment damage on map loss makes a lot more sense than on round loss.

Offline Tristan

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2011, 02:34:11 am »
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The problem is that because of the great importance the multiplier has, flunctuations are gonna be great. SOme people makes tons of gold. I no less that 15k today with a toon because I was on winning team a lot.

As we do not play an infinite amount of times, some people will get screwed, others make gold.

 What is needed is less difference between loosing and winning and it will be allright!!!.

This could be done by making the base price higher and multiplier significantly less.
AND this could still be balanced to match 20k worth of average equipment.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2011, 02:39:48 am by Aemaelius »
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Offline priest

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2011, 07:02:18 am »
0
There are alot of different ways in which upkeep can be changed, hard to pin down a specific way.  I think we should make a replica crpg mod for the future and add it to the dev servers (cRPG2 or something) for future patches, kind of like a PTR in Blizzard games.  We should then have a group of around 40-80 people part of a test team.  Just a thought.

Offline Helrekkr

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2011, 08:46:16 am »
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Actually, I support that as well. Equipment damage on map loss makes a lot more sense than on round loss.

Except if you get autobalanced back and forth between the teams, it wouldn't make much sense.

Offline Halk

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2017, 03:18:00 am »
+1
There are alot of different ways in which upkeep can be changed, hard to pin down a specific way.  I think we should make a replica crpg mod for the future and add it to the dev servers (cRPG2 or something) for future patches, kind of like a PTR in Blizzard games.  We should then have a group of around 40-80 people part of a test team.  Just a thought.
Sounds good to me
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Offline njames89

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2017, 12:16:12 pm »
+1
Your horse may not be showing up due to you owning too many items.  There is a maximum number and above that items start to dissappear.

I agree with most everything except the upkeep and team bumping. If you use a horse it should be expensive and if you are a shitty horseman you will hurt your teammates. As infantry using top notch gear it is still easy to make money.

Edit: dammit halk you got me good you filthy necro

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Re: Constructive Feedback/Bugs
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2017, 12:50:28 pm »
+1
God damn noobs... ffs :D
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