Author Topic: New item: Long Pike  (Read 4505 times)

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Offline Cyclopsided

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New item: Long Pike
« on: March 28, 2011, 09:48:45 am »
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EDIT: THREAD LOCKED; Due to game engine this is not possible. The hitbox would originate too far form the player, while preventing spin thrusting it would open up other exploits such as stabbing right through your team/entities and object. We are stuck with short pikes.


Currently the pike in game is extremely short for an actual pike. I don't want to change that weapon as it is balanced for a decent role in game.
However, I think a long Pike should be added. I do not have a model for this, if one is pre-existing somewhere or if someone is up to making an extended Pike model I would be grateful. It should also be rather simple, I think. If it comes down to it, I will learn modeling and make it myself if it were to be acceptable.


Here are my proposed stats for the weapon. Third draft. Add in your thoughts and we can adjust this to ideal.
Price: ~5000
Weight: 3
Requirement: 10
Spd rating: 70
Weapon length: 350, First draft was 500 which was far too long in hindsight
Thrust damage: 25 Pierce
No swing. No overhead. Thrust only.         Reason: No ridiculous overhead shit with it this way. With how collision detection works, it can't have overhead.
Can not be used with shield.
Can not be used on horse.
Unbalanced.                                            Reason: To prevent retarded feinting with thrusts.
Can not be sheathed. You drop it instead of put it away.  Something like with how ladders are used in siege. This should not be capable for someone to pull out of their pocket, to prevent it from being abused by random non-dedicated characters for use against horses.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2011, 04:35:39 am by Marathon »
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Offline Casimir

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2011, 10:10:39 am »
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IMO the current pike is more than capable of fulfilling any role which this weapon would.

I also think a weapon that long might look abit silly when coupled with the m&b polearm animations.

More variety is however always good so i wouldnt say no. Its just wether its really needed now that the LoC is gone
Turtles

Offline Cyclopsided

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2011, 10:22:48 am »
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IMO the current pike is more than capable of fulfilling any role which this weapon would.

I also think a weapon that long might look abit silly when coupled with the m&b polearm animations.

More variety is however always good so i wouldnt say no. Its just wether its really needed now that the LoC is gone
Well, This isn't intended specifically for an anti-cav role. Also, it could be shorter like 400 length? 500 length was just a first draft I made but it may be too long, which is why I need the input.
And I don't think it would be awkward with the pole arm thrust animation at all.

I really want the input like this, and I don't think the pike fills this support role that this would fill. This would add a new niche to gameplay that is possible; separate from the pike's role as a generic support/anti-cav secondary weapon.

EDIT: Changed original post to 400 weapon length from 500 as that would be a bit too long in hind-sight. 400 Seems better for a Long Pike in this game.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2011, 10:45:33 am by Marathon »
Also, I have declared myself #1 NA hybrid thrower
Formerly known as Marathon.
As an NA admin, I am the most laid back and concerned with the ~fun of the game~ above all other factors. I've also been super inactive since Summer 2012. University takes most of my time, but I still find some time to play when i can.

Offline Dravic

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2011, 03:58:45 pm »
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Give us Lance of Compensation back, if you add this. Deal?

Lance should be longer, too, but no thrust at all and low dmg. For couching purposes!

Offline Christo

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2011, 04:15:48 pm »
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Nah, compare the Pike with the Great Lance. I think it's a fair match.

Btw, will the pike lose it's overhead attack, for real? If yes, I will cry.  :cry:

It's not even a pike, but a longer spear.

LEAVE PIKE ALOONEEE! Q_Q
« Last Edit: March 28, 2011, 04:17:07 pm by Christo »
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Offline Magikarp

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2011, 05:18:51 pm »
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Nice troll post.

400 range, lol.
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Offline Cyclopsided

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2011, 05:29:05 pm »
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Nah, compare the Pike with the Great Lance. I think it's a fair match.

Btw, will the pike lose it's overhead attack, for real? If yes, I will cry.  :cry:

It's not even a pike, but a longer spear.

LEAVE PIKE ALOONEEE! Q_Q
No, I am suggesting a new weapon -- not changing the old pike.

Nice troll post.

400 range, lol.
This is not a troll post, are you up to being mature enough to add constructive criticism?

You are aware if someone uses this in single combat you would just block down once while walking forward and after you get anywhere close; they CAN'T attack you since you are closer than their minimum distance.
Also, I have declared myself #1 NA hybrid thrower
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As an NA admin, I am the most laid back and concerned with the ~fun of the game~ above all other factors. I've also been super inactive since Summer 2012. University takes most of my time, but I still find some time to play when i can.

Offline Magikarp

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2011, 05:33:25 pm »
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No, I am suggesting a new weapon -- not changing the old pike.
This is not a troll post, are you up to being mature enough to add constructive criticism?

You are aware if someone uses this in single combat you would just block down once while walking forward and after you get anywhere close; they CAN'T attack you since you are closer than their minimum distance.
Art thou serious?

Ye give everyone access to such a long polearm, that cavalry will be completely useless, even more than it is due to pike spam already!

...
Don't mind the fish.

Offline Christo

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2011, 05:47:25 pm »
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I know you suggest a new weapon, but what do we use a Pike against? Cavalry, and infantry backup.

Check the longest Great Lance, it's almost as long as the Pike, maybe a bit shorter.

In melee combat, it can annoy the crap out of your foes if you are in a group.
A longer pike is not needed imo.

But still, the no overhead for the current pike is just dumb, it would reduce the usefulness of that weapon to shield+spear's.
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Offline Sean_Drew

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2011, 05:49:34 pm »
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Hm .... i think the actual pike is long enough against cav.  :rolleyes:
Sorry , my english is bad ... ;-) I do my best :-)

Offline LordRichrich

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2011, 06:00:33 pm »
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300-350 max length IMO. Any longer and it will simply be unusable imo.
Give it more pierce, say 30 - 33 BUT it can't be used to block. For freaking obvious reasons. Make it truly a support class

Offline Cyclopsided

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2011, 06:03:30 pm »
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Art thou serious?

Ye give everyone access to such a long polearm, that cavalry will be completely useless, even more than it is due to pike spam already!

...
That would require all of them using the long pike to not have another weapon... you have to drop it not like a pike which can be sheathed.
No, this is not a case of "everyone has it and cav is useless" scenario.
Hm .... i think the actual pike is long enough against cav.  :rolleyes:
If someone wants the plain pike as a secondary with a primary use against cav, then he can use that. This would function as a dedicated weapon -- and not necessarily vs cav. I was primarily thinking of it's use as a support pikeman infantry.

I know you suggest a new weapon, but what do we use a Pike against? Cavalry, and infantry backup.

Check the longest Great Lance, it's almost as long as the Pike, maybe a bit shorter.

In melee combat, it can annoy the crap out of your foes if you are in a group.
A longer pike is not needed imo.

But still, the no overhead for the current pike is just dumb, it would reduce the usefulness of that weapon to shield+spear's.
Again I am not suggesting the removal of overhead for the current pike.
And if it is seen that the weapon is not needed, then it will be not needed. Is there any way you would change it?
I am just proposing this idea of a longer pike that is thrust only; but can't be used as a secondary so it won't be abused vs cavalry.



300-350 max length IMO. Any longer and it will simply be unusable imo.
Give it more pierce, say 30 - 33 BUT it can't be used to block. For freaking obvious reasons. Make it truly a support class
This is the kind of constructive response I am looking for.
However; I don't think it can have that much pierce damage. I have it doing 25, one less than the regular pike for a reason as it is longer. Also, what exactly is this obvious reason it should not be able to block? I must be missing it. For game balance, that doesn't really make sense and with how it is animated as it would look fine with blocking.

I thought about 350 or 375 length, but if it is under 325 length the weapon will flat-out be pointless to have thrust only, if it is only 300 length it would not only be logical to have an overhead, but it would also not have it's own role in the battlefield as the regular pike could fill it. 350 weapon length could work, and is completely realistic.
350 weapon length vs 400 -- with 350 it is slightly more usable in single combat, and takes a little away from teamwork and coordinated combat. 350 would still be fine though as a support weapon.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2011, 06:28:09 pm by Marathon »
Also, I have declared myself #1 NA hybrid thrower
Formerly known as Marathon.
As an NA admin, I am the most laid back and concerned with the ~fun of the game~ above all other factors. I've also been super inactive since Summer 2012. University takes most of my time, but I still find some time to play when i can.

Offline Joxer

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2011, 06:34:29 pm »
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Pike would be perfect if the hitboxes weren't bonkers  :twisted:
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Offline gazda

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2011, 06:52:36 pm »
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i personally would like to leave this pike with over head attack and all its current characteristic and add another 290-315 lenght pike with only thrust attack, plus add lance of compensation for cav
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Offline MrShovelFace

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Re: New item: Long Pike
« Reply #14 on: March 28, 2011, 11:20:53 pm »
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not only would a pike longer than the current one be realistic, it would also look cool. The long pike as it is called looks awesome in other mods and widely evades the problem of rediculously long weapons that other weapons have.

Long spears are needed too because atm

our spears are pretty much just WOODEN STAFFS WITH POINTS
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