The Throwing "Lance" and why I can't be Leonidas

[H3ADSH0T]

TL;DR VERSION: Most throwing items are too short, and there is no reason why they are so slow in melee. Make spears throwable

I've brought this up for discussion before about a year ago and was met with pretty staunch opposition. Nevertheless, I thought it would be worth at least mentioning having not even looked to see if y'all have been talking about it lately.

My award winning argument:

C-rpg has forsaken me in the form of no available spartan-esque helm beside the barbutte, I cannot wear a bad ass cape and still have my rippling pixel pecs shine in the sun and even more recently I cannot wield a huscarl, warspear, and 1h weapon to re-enact my highly dramatized personal re-enactment of 300. Slots are a knavery, but I digress.

The Throwing "Lance" is shorter than the typical spear which COULD be and WAS thrown.

Now I know what you're thinking. "H3ADSH0T you 1337 speak spelling scrub, no respectable spear user would want to part with his spear". Well to you NAYSAYERS I say this:

(click to show/hide)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/rosieboo/Zidane_leonidas.gif

Even if we dismiss the idea of throwing a typical spear like the Warspear, consider something for throwing like the Pilum. From, granted, wikipedia: "The pilum (plural pila) was a javelin commonly used by the Roman army in ancient times. It was generally about two metres long overall,". NOW FOR COMPARISON!

Reference item:                                                             
                                                                                       
Longsword
weapon length: 106 (4 feet from what I can tell)
weight: 1.8
difficulty: 10
speed rating: 98
weapon length: 106
thrust damage: 23 pierce
swing damage: 36 cut
slots: 2
Secondary Mode

Reference Item:

War Spear
weapon length: 150 (about six feet)
weight: 1.5
difficulty: 11
speed rating: 95
weapon length: 150
thrust damage: 28 pierce
swing damage: 18 blunt

Reference Item:

Throwing "Lance"
missile speed: 17
weapon length: 120 (just under 5 feet?)
weight: 1.5
accuracy: 154
difficulty: 7
speed rating: 80
missile speed: 17
weapon length: 120
max ammo: 1
thrust damage: 60 pierce
slots: 1
Bonus against Shield
Secondary Mod
slots: 2


So the Warspear, a more or less accurate depiction of a spear which could be thrown is duel-able, longer than this throwing "lance" (not to mention throwing SPEARS) and actually viable. So after this wall of text my actual goal shall be announced. Why not consider looking at items for their potential throwability? I have often found that as a melee combatant I am at a loss if I need to finish off a foe or engage before getting into melee. I would like the option with my hoplites to use the warspear or any spear for that matter -and- throw it if I so chose. Literally nothing stands in the way of this bar the fact that none of the throwing items are particularly realistic as it is. All that I am suggesting is a slight buff to versatility in items like these. I was surprised to find after returning to C-RPG that you can turn items with a pick component around to use them as piercing, I think we can make the same progress here. Anyone with me?

Also to squeeze in one more idea that is mostly unrelated. Reading about the Pilum encumbering shield users and making their shield unwieldy (when one is sticking in it), or forcing them to waste time pulling it out, could have real promise in C-RPG. What if thrown weapons started to slow a shield?

[H3ADSH0T]

Selfish bump for no feedback and plenty of views

[Gurnisson]

If you think the throwing lance has 80 speed in its melee mode you're way off. It's the speed of chambering the throw, not its speed in melee mode which is very high

[Jarlek]

If you think the throwing lance has 80 speed in its melee mode you're way off. It's the speed of chambering the throw, not its speed in melee mode which is very high

Last time I checked the melee speed for throwing lance was 100.

That being said, need more throwing weapons and making most of the spears (AND TORCH ) throwable would be nice. +1

[H3ADSH0T]

I hadn't the slightest idea of how to tell what the melee speed was. In any case I think that all of the pole type thrown weapons are all misrepresented in length and in usefulness beside being thrown. I don't think versatility is such a bad idea.

[Leshma]

That being said, need more throwing weapons and making most of the spears (AND TORCH ) throwable would be nice. +1

Why? What do you see in throwing, I really wanna know?

I've been a thrower when it was super OP and I think that throwing is the lamest thing ever, even worse than kiting archers.

It's good for trolling people and inducing rage, I can agree on that. But I'm 26 years old and therefore play this mod for different reasons, not because I'm "bored" kid like many members of this community.

[Ronin]

I don't really know but the reason might be this scene:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjb7JUbNNrw (at 2:40 or something)

[BlindGuy]

It's good for trolling people and inducing rage, I can agree on that. But I'm 26 years old and therefore play this mod for different reasons, not because I'm "bored" kid like many members of this community.

Im a fair bit older Leshma, and even I can see that being able throw ALL weapons would be a GREAT THING. This being said, you only get one, and the heavier/larger the weapon, the worse it should travel in the air, and if you have no PT or throwing wpf, your gonna be lucky to hit anything...

BUT it would give me SO much pleasure to throw my sword after that my old friend with the bow who ran off even though I have an heirloomed shield he is never going to break with his hornbow, and is just delaying.

[Aleskander]

Really?
The only buff the throwing lance needs is for someone not be able to survive 2 of them

[Ronin]

Well the point here is to not necessarily buff throwing weapons. It is to make them more realistic as I see. I think, this deserves a support. +1

[Player_01]

Though a little bit of the information on the melee-ability is off, I agree with better representing the weapons visually and adding versatility. Even if there isn't an option to add throwing to other weapons, a good trade off would be to make current throwing weapons more melee-viable. +1

[Ronin]

Well the throwing lance is already very viable in melee mode as it is. I'm just coming from a server beating some guys with my throwing lance. So no more buffing is needed. It is a bit better then the shortened spear already. Considering both 2 weapons are one of the best 1 slot polearms, the melee power for it is enough. So no unnecessary buff is needed in my opinion, but making them more realistic is something we should support.

[zagibu]

You can make them longer, but then you also have to make them 2 slots.

[Uumdi]

Throwing lance is exactly the same as a Shortened Spear in melee, except with +1b damage on the swings, if I remember right.  102 speed rating, 120 length, 26p 16b.


Not that that means anything aside from the fact that its a really badass and usable melee weapon too (for 5 times the upkeep, haha), but I agree, if any weapons should be throwable, it should be the spears.  Warspear, 150cm = 1.5 m = 4.92 feet = very appropriate.

I don't think it breaks the balance at all to lower the upkeep dramatically on throwing lances.  The ammo count balances them out.


I hope your idea gets implemented, but it would be a ton of work, the devs would really have to think its a badass idea.  People will want to throw some 1h axes as well, and the sword and mace users will want to throw their shit too, haha.  I look forward to the end of the round stupidity of everyone tossing their swords at a horse xbowman, hahah.

Throwing spears would be a major step in the right direction though.

[H3ADSH0T]

Glad to see their is some more support for this idea this time around. I'm after this change for plenty of reasons and believe that promoting versatility and giving us more choices is what makes our warfare more believable. As for being able to throw -anything-, who knows if that will ever happen .

Really?
The only buff the throwing lance needs is for someone not be able to survive 2 of them

I agree and offer that we all survive and absurd amount of things we shouldn't, yet this is the nature of the mod.