2 weapons dominate 2h/pole.

[Son Of Odin]

Why Thomek doesn't lobby at all dear SoO, where did you get that impression?

Ehhehahaha! Nowhere... Nowhere at all..

Wow I think those statistics will bring long shitstorms nevertheless... Balance between pole & 2h is optimal now for what I feel. 2h will always have the advantage in 1vs1 and many other things. Poles have more variety and different weapons for many situations. Calling polearmers hiltslashers is just lame considering how many 2h are doing it.

1h maybe needs some love? Although when someone masters 1h build, he is annoyingly powerful. It's just not everyone's cup of tea I guess... 1h is absolutely the best for infantry commander because you don't need to be focused on manual blocking all the time.

[Teeth]

Polearms are definitely the better weapon class as far as battle goes. This comes mostly from long 2h experience and then doing some polearming.

[Nehvar]

The fuck, my mind is completely fucked from multiple directions.

Heavy lance damage on foot, the hell?

Why are there so many horse crossbowmen on NA, doesn't it suck equus africanus asinus dick?

There are a lot but that number is probably mostly from one guy (ROHYPNOL).  Horsebows can be very effective if you're at his skill level.  I have no experience with the build so I can't say more than that as to why they're doing better than horse archers.

Why not the long twohanders NA? Although I knew this from the few times I've duelled on NA, only longswords and HBS.

I'm surprised by that number as well.  I run with a HBS 18/24 build but most of the two-handers I meet are using a Sword of War or a Danish Greatsword.  Since these numbers only encompass one month it could be due to a lot of the top two-handers goofing off this past gen.  I know of several skilled Danish users, in fact, that used other weapons this last gen.

Does NA actually know how to stab with 1h? So much long espadas.

Yes.  Our shielders are really dangerous with those murder-stabs too.

The katana 3rd and 2nd, really didnt see that coming.

Weaboos everywhere.  Not at all surprising considering the number of katana-toting spamurais I've run into lately.

[Thomek]

Lobbying.. Just for your information, I think Katana is perfect right now. If anyone think it's OP, please make a thread about it. This is also not about me not being able to handle greatswords, I have zero problems with that.

What I do have a problem with is the lack of variety of weapons used from our diverse armory.

Just take a look around you when you spawn on EU1. All 2h are wielding either danish or german greatsword. All polearmers are wielding a GLA.

It's that simple, and that's all I'm pointing out.

IT'S BORING.
IT'S A PITY SINCE WE HAVE SO MANY OTHER WEAPONS AVAILABLE.

Now, how to fix it, I don't have a great answer. I slight nerf in damage (1 or 2 points)  together with a much more agressive price curve regarding weapon length would be a start. I'm weary of a speed nerf since they are already quite slow weapons. (Perhaps a small speed increase would even be in place if one nerfed the damage) IMO since a 2h or pole is all you really need, those weapons could be priced much higher. If you wish to wear heavy armor, grab a longsword. There is currently no price-dilemma for greatsword-users (like all other classes have) as the optimum armor + build in the EU metagame is already very much affordable.

[Kato]

Yes, but nerf top weapons is not solution, maybe little buff for midtier swords would be nice.

GLA on other hand is one of the worse of top polearms and we on EU can be only happy, that people use it for style instead of using lame weapons like bardiches, broken weapons like fauchard and glaive or all around better poleaxes.

[Thomek]

GLA is not crap at all.

It's used for HILTSLASHING, since at a certain threshold of PS it almost never glances with it's 45 damage unloomed. Add in polestagger. The damage enables dependable hiltslashing at a much lower PS level than other weapons (and thus more agi, wpf and athletics facilitating backpedaling and back-jump-slashing while hilt-slashing polestagger...)

That axe should be looked into IMO.

One could argue the German Poleaxe is better, but it requires 1 more PS to get to the same damage lvl and is 1 point slower. The only thing it has on the GLA is 6 more range and stab damage.

About nerfing/pricing not being the solution..
The alternative to nerfing the top weps is to buff ALL the non-top weapons, including 1h and pole. It's just a crazy amount of work and the likelyhood of breaking balance is gigantic. Would be fun and create lots of whining for us whiners to whine about in the forums though.

[Son Of Odin]

Yeah I think katana is fine now too . Well I see many Danish Great Swords around, but it doesn't bother me one bit. Maybe it's because it is one of the most loomed items in the game if not the most loomed one. Nerfing the great swords would suck because it also hurts the balance between 2h and pole. When it comes to polearms, I see a great variety. People use many different ones and yes GLA has it's dedicated users. I remember it being loomed in big numbers as well (just look at the marketplace).

I don't just see the problem here. I use long war axe on foot because it's a decent weapon and it fits my style well. If it wasn't for looks, I would probably use long hafted blade (I could use it on horseback in a tight situation as well), glaive, great long barchide or some poleaxe. Not to speak about warspear and other cheaper ones. All great weapons and have their purposes and playstyles. Some weapons are more popular than other ones but isn't it fun to play with some not so used one and kick ass just because you can?

(click to show/hide)

GLA is not crap at all.

It's used for HILTSLASHING, since at a certain threshold of PS it almost never glances with it's 45 damage unloomed. Add in polestun. The damage enables dependable hiltslashing at a much lower PS level than other weapons (and thus more agi, wpf and athletics facilitating backpedaling and back-jump-slashing while hilt-slashing...)

That axe should be looked into IMO.

One could argue the German Poleaxe is better, but it requires 1 more PS to get to the same damage lvl and is 1 point slower. The only thing it has on the GLA is 6 more range and stab damage.

Oh shut up about hiltslashes... 2h player cannot pull that crap on polearmers in the forums. l2p

(click to show/hide)

[troll]ps. I want katana to have new stats since all the ninjas around seem to use it. I want to see more variety in ninjas and them using other weapons too.[/troll]

[Thomek]

[troll]ps. I want katana to have new stats since all the ninjas around seem to use it. I want to see more variety in ninjas and them using other weapons too.[/troll]

lol.. ok so I am a bit guilty of that situation myself. They are allowed to use other weapons.. Just not anything better than katana. And hafted blades of course.

About hiltslashing, yes everyone is doing it, me too, and that's fine. Nothing to be done about it. Just the GLA is perfect for it with it's insane damage coupled with decent speed and range.

[Son Of Odin]

About hiltslashing, yes everyone is doing it, me too, and that's fine. Nothing to be done about it. Just the GLA is perfect for it with it's insane damage coupled with decent speed and range.

Just like any top tier 2h weapon...

[Thomek]

No, not just any top tier 2h. The danish has 40 base damage and requires about 11% more damage composed of PS/STR/wpf to match the GLA.

I have a fix suggestion for the GLA.

Step 1.
Ask Tor what the optimum build for a hiltslashing GLA user is. Note down the STR requirement.

Step 2.
Make the STR requirement for GLA that number +1

(I have a feeling you would end up with a number like 19)

[Son Of Odin]

(click to show/hide)

No, not just any top tier 2h. The danish has 40 base damage and requires about 11% more damage composed of PS/STR/wpf to match the GLA.

I have a fix suggestion for the GLA.

Step 1.
Ask Tor what the optimum build for a hiltslashing GLA user is. Note down the STR requirement.

Step 2.
Make the STR requirement for GLA that number +1

(I have a feeling you would end up with a number like 19)

Seems like someone got mad after Tor kicked his ass? Your suggestion is probably a sad trolling attempt considering you suggest number 19 which is more than any polearm has now and for the fact you basically want to nerf only one player.

[Thomek]

Bring some arguments Odin.

[RandomDude]

Well personally im amazed that more 2h dont use the flamberge. It's such an epic weapon in so many ways. It's the only weapon with an awesome wavy blade. Highest cut dmg. Longest right swing reach. One of the few weapons to use polearm and 2h animations (i think?).

Sure there's about 1 million cons to go against it but cmon... it's the only real mans sword around.

I think people just see 2hs owning with greatswords and automatically think it's the best weapon to use. For me you have to base the weapon on your build and vice versa.

No point having a short reach weapon if you're too slow to hit people because they move in and out of your attack range too fast. Stuff like that.

If there should be equalness in weapons ( to add variety) then the prices and upkeep should be the same for the different "tiers" of weapons. Not sure how else to diversify the weapon usage. The fact is that a lot of people have big bank accounts and upkeep isnt an issue for them so why penalise the poorer/newer(?) players.

Also there's plenty of good 2h weapons that people with 1/2 a brain use (and are also good players). Mauls for anti-pikes/1h. Morningstars for anti armour. They get used sometimes but greatswords can pierce armour too so a lot of people just stick with them.

Shortened military scythe is a great weapon. I use it because it's used by the antarian faction in the SoD mod, but you can kill with it as easily as a greatsword. Plenty of times I get a good K/D with it - as often as with flamberge.

It's cheap, good dmg, not as long or fast or good stab (it uses polearm animation) as greatsword, but it's a good weapon. In battle or siege most weapons are viable, it's when you want to duel someone or you're in a 1v1 situation, that you want a greatsword.

[Son Of Odin]

Bring some arguments Odin.

So your suggestion really is to ask Tor what build he uses and balance the great long axe after that? I think I don't need to have any arguments with you about that part.

On a more serious note: I feel that having GLA requirement set to 19 str would be really harsh move. Then the only weapon having higher strenght requirement would be the 2h great maul which is 20 str. GLA users would have to use only certain builds and it doesn't seem fair to me when we think of the qualities this weapon has. There is so many other polearms that are better and wouldn't need that much str to be used. Using GLA wouldn't be a viable option anymore especially considering it's price. Then the other thing is that increasing the requirements with 3 str points is pretty big change for people who have heirloomed this certain item and maybe sticking up with their build to get higher levels. GLA is pretty cheap loom in the market and after nerf, it would be ridicilously cheap so getting another weapon to replace it would be hard.

[Xant]

Katana is OP, I have a fix suggestion for it. Make it +4 str, it's too good at hiltslashing. I asked a Ninja who hiltslashed me what the optimum build was and that's what he said, needs to be +4 str req.