Author Topic: Massive multiplayer strategy games and their metagame. Can something be done?  (Read 13981 times)

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Offline Nebun

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+2
4x bigger would be perfect!
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Offline Elmokki

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+1
Yes, attrition would be a decent thing to implement for armies of over 100 or so units close to each other and away from a (friendly) town

Offline Erasmas

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x4 map is to much. x2 would be enough... I do not think there is enough players/factions  to take it all, and the troops transfer will be horrible. But, in general +1.
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Offline Vovka

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x5 map ^^
x10 speed with horsies
 :P
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Offline Nessaj

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+1
Well since the map is split between NA/EU it is basically only x2 the map size for each region. I'd personally say go x8 so there's x4 for each region.

There should be a bunch of neutral fiefs left for newcomers etc to use then, for a long time, which would definitely encourage more to groups of players to give Strat a shot.
The fact that there could be areas totally unaffected by big alliances (or any people in general) is just a major plus.
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Offline Tristan

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+2
Well since the map is split between NA/EU it is basically only x2 the map size for each region. I'd personally say go x8 so there's x4 for each region.

There should be a bunch of neutral fiefs left for newcomers etc to use then, for a long time, which would definitely encourage more to groups of players to give Strat a shot.
The fact that there could be areas totally unaffected by big alliances (or any people in general) is just a major plus.

Very true indeed. I find it rather odd that we absolutely need every part of the map owned by players. Just screws over new clans.
And add attrition... very important on a big map. A large clan should NOT be able to cover everything!
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Offline Elmokki

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+1
4x size map means double width and double height (2x * 2y) = 4xy where x is width and y is height of current map and xy is the area of current map. So basically map width and height are 100% higher.

2x size increase is about 41% increase on width and height of current map (sqrt(2)x * sqrt(2)y) = 2xy

For measurement 3x map size would mean 73% higher length and width and 5x would mean 123% higher.

It's hard to say what's actually a good idea. What also matters is wether it'll just be a zoomed current map or something else. If you draw a new map with more water than the current one the effective area gain is obviously smaller.

I for one think medieval europe would be a very awesome map, though it'd lead to endless disputes about historical accurate of place names and whether some place should be in the map or not. Also if that happens, please just skip adding the northernmost parts of Europe. English channel, Gibraltar and the straits between Denmark and Sweden (and possibly Stockholm <-> Turku) can just be handled with a new terrain type. Those don't really require a REAL navy to cross in real life either, but forces arranging some sort of a transport.

If you insist on keeping the NA/EU split a fantasy map might suit better though. It'd be fairly stupid to see pretty much any sort of a split in Europe map.

« Last Edit: December 04, 2011, 11:29:59 pm by Elmokki »

Offline Sphinxer

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A bigger map would help.

Next map will be 4 times bigger, 4 times more locations.

It's just delaying the inevitable ... Carebears will just offer more villages to their members / bitches and they will have even less reasons to attack each other since there will be plenty of villages.

Less villages = forcing wars between the big factions
More villages = Big Factions will pick even more on smaller factions to conquer easy villages

Offline SoA_Sir_ODHarry

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ye less Place=moar War

and how bout too get some Zendar towns where neutral peeps  not bothered by Clan politics which throw not welcomed peopel out of their fiefs, Bandits can hide and smaller Clans can craft and gain forces to have moar influence.
They could be simpel Mountain fortresses almost impossibel to take for any Clan.
also AI could start some expiditons when the too big clan allys choke the game and give clanless mercs some moar fun at strat
and some big caravans so there constant battel events because obviously many would try too raid them.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2011, 12:32:21 am by SoA_Sir_ODHarry »
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Offline Harpag

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-1
I think you should consider more slots in locations with 100% efficiency of crafting / recruitment, instead a larger map.
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Offline Tristan

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+1
I think you should consider more slots in locations with 100% efficiency of crafting / recruitment, instead a larger map.

Would serve the opposite goal. Instead of forcing larger clans to spread out and suffer from corruption they can instead focus and centralize.
More spots would not make clans open their arms to neutrals. It would just cause their members to produce trade goods at 85% instead of 69%.

More villages with fewer spots would combined with corruption and attrition to armies would give smaller clans a chance and give people in no clans a chance to find a village where to work.
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Offline Slamz

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Just brainstorming...

"Culture wars".

Every clan has to pick a culture.  These can be from the single player game.  Nord, Vaegirs, etc.  This is not the same as picking a "team".  If my clan is Nord and your clan is Nord we can still fight each other.

Each culture gets different, unique bonuses.

Culture is on a sliding scale, 1 to 100.  The higher your culture is, the better your unique bonus is.

Culture goes up 1 point per day.

If you interact with any culture other than your own, it goes down 4 points.  Nord trades with Vaegir, both lose 4 points of culture.  If ever your culture hits 0 while interacting with another culture, you will switch to their culture and start gaining points in it daily.  e.g., Nord with 1 culture point trades with Vaegir who has 50 culture points -- Nord clan is now a Vaegir clan.


So you would not have a big clan splinter into several sub-clans in an effort to get multiple cultures, because swapping troops, goods, gold, etc, between them would keep undermining their culture.  Eventually some dominant culture would likely emerge in which case they might as well just all be in the same clan again.

A small Nord clan that is genuinely its own clan and rarely interacts with other clans would therefore have something unique to offer: the Nord bonus.  They are "true Nords" and as long as they keep their interactions with others to a minimum, they will stay that way.  If some mega-clan overran them and incorporated them into a big Vaegir alliance then the Nord clan would slowly end up switching to Vaegir, losing the thing that made them different.


Maybe, for example, Nords are the best throwers and one of the top shielders.  Every 20 points of Nord culture grants them +1 shield skill (in strategus battles), +10 throwing wpf and +1 PT.  Or maybe only Nords can craft huscarl shields, and the higher their culture is, the cheaper they are and the faster they can make them.  (Rhodoks meanwhile might be shield/spear/crossbow specialists.)

So a big clan might want a casual alliance with a small clan in order to get some useful diversity on the battlefield, but the small clan needs real separation in order to retain their Nord culture and therefore their Nord bonuses.  And by retaining real separation, it might be easier to maintain real splits in the larger coalitions as any sub-clans within the group would have to maintain a large degree of independence if they wanted to maintain their separate culture.

Other cultural influences might include proximity to other fiefs, members of your clan working in a fief from another culture, bonuses for working in a fief from your own culture, etc.
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Offline Dehitay

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+2
Well since the map is split between NA/EU it is basically only x2 the map size for each region. I'd personally say go x8 so there's x4 for each region.
I feel obligated to point out that it would be x4 for both regions of the map if the map itself was quadrupled in size. The mathematician in me can't let this go uncorrected.

Offline Mechanix

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I agree with Ganner. Need a mechanic that makes people want to defend the villages. Half the problem is no pay or reward but the bigger problem is diplomacy. If you see the same people signing against you every time boom reason for hostile relations. If the people fighting are nameless villagers you can speculate based on play style who you are fighting but can never really be sure.

If the map is 4 times bigger you will have to figure out a way to make people move faster with or without goods/crates. The rates now are insanely slow. Add more area to cover and I think you will bore the active people to death. Open up the trade radius a bit as well.

Agree!

But I think we need a mechanix.. not a mechanic.
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Offline Vibe

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I doubt increasing map size would help much. The carebear alliance (UIF) is so big they would claim 3/4 of the map again.