Propinions on shielder/archer hybrid build(s)

[Dooz]

The emphasis is on melee, with archery as supplemental harassment.

I suppose my main question pertains to PD and WPF, and how those would best be distributed for maximum efficiency. I plan to use the cheapest bow/arrows available even if I end up with higher than 1 PD.

Total weight of armor/weapons: 30.6

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 18
Agility: 18
Hit points: 65
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 6
Power Strike: 6
Shield: 4
Athletics: 6
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 1
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 6
One Handed: 133
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 103
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 15
Agility: 21
Hit points: 60
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 5
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 4
Athletics: 7
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 1
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 144
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 103
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 18
Agility: 18
Hit points: 55
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 6
Shield: 4
Athletics: 6
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 6
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 6
One Handed: 131
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 101
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 15
Agility: 21
Hit points: 52
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 4
Athletics: 7
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 5
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 131
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 121
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

Which of these builds (or otherwise) would best fit the mold for what I'm looking for?

-edit-
Added a couple of builds after discussion.

[Jarlek]

Hmmm, this interests me. Not sure what would be best but this is what i came up with for myself. Time to make another alt!

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Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)
Strength: 15
Agility: 21
Skills to attributes: 2
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 5
Athletics: 7
Power Draw: 5
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 135
Archery: 117
For this build you wanna use LIGHT ARMOUR and LIGHT SHIELD. This is to make the most of your athl but also to keep accuracy at it's highest. I suggest a buckler or elite cavalry shield. Nothing above 6 weight at least. For armour you should go light, not a total adjusted weight above 8.0. For weapons, jeez, I dunno. I don't know about the bow but maybe Horn bow for full set and normal "bow" for making money set? One quiver at least, arrows if your gonna spam and bodkin if your not gonna stay that long firing. For the 1hander I got some suggestions. Your gonna have some problems against tincans with your low PS and PD. The bow will be useless. I say take a mace. They are fast, does good damage, does blunt AND have knockdown. The maces are VERY good and some of them are also very cheap. The Winged Mace is my favourite in cost/effeciancy (and looks) but the iberian one is good too.

Personally I wouldn't take any Ironflesh. It's the first you should sacrifice for other skillpoints (in this case PD)

[Digglez]

with effective armor weight of 20+ your archery wpf will be down below 70..and just about useless. wasting all your time switching back and forth between weapons because you wont be able to hit anything but short range

[Jarlek]

with effective armor weight of 20+ your archery wpf will be down below 70..and just about useless. wasting all your time switching back and forth between weapons because you wont be able to hit anything but short range

Yeah, as I said have low armour weight like 8-ish. Basically just cloth to not run around nude. This would also make you faster with the 1h, although that's not really a new thing xD

[Dooz]

So it's only the armor weight that affects a drop in wpf, and not the rest of my weapons weights as well? Because if so, I actually clock in at under 20 with just the armor (16.8 to be exact). Where would that leave my archery wpf? Also, like I mentioned this will mainly be used as a melee shielder, only pulling out the bow opportunistically, so it's not gonna be a constant waste-of-time switching back and forth........ I hope.

Zapper, thanks for the input.  I actually already have my armor and weapons picked out, and not necessarily based on what would be most effective, but more going for a certain style/look (Armenian hillman warrior). I'm wearing the Byrnja, with Nordic footman helmet, leather gloves, and plated (leather) boots. I'll be using a balanced Langes Messer with a Knightly Kite Shield, and like I said the cheapest bow/arrows available.

So where does that leave me? Certainly I don't expect to make a dent in tin cans with the archery, or even in melee 1v1 I reckon. But can I at least harass lightly armored enemies? What would/should the tactics of one of these builds equipped as shown be?

A couple of builds taking into consideration the higher priority of PD over IF. The thing that worries me about these is the lower overall HP of course as a result of the drop, but just how significant is a 5-10 point shift? Does that translate to one extra slash being able to be absorbed? More, less?

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 18
Agility: 18
Hit points: 55
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 6
Shield: 4
Athletics: 6
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 6
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 6
One Handed: 131
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 101
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 15
Agility: 21
Hit points: 52
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 4
Athletics: 7
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 5
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 131
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 121
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

[MrShine]

My honest opinion is not to do it: you'll end up being bad at range and do poor damage up close.

Having said that I prefer an 18/18 option like this:

(click to show/hide)

    Strength: 18
    Agility: 18
    Hit points: 53

    Skills to attributes: 2

    Ironflesh: 0
    Power Strike: 6
    Shield: 5
    Athletics: 6
    Riding: 0
    Horse Archery: 0
    Power Draw: 6
    Power Throw: 0
    Weapon Master: 6

    One Handed: 110
    Two Handed: 1
    Polearm: 1
    Archery: 128
    Crossbow: 1
    Throwing: 1

You'll need to wear light armor to avoid affecting your wpf totals, and I strongly recommend you take a blunt or pierce type weapon for melee. 

[Hirlok]

I had a shield archer in the beginning. He sucked hard, and that was BEFORE they nerfed the shit out of archery and hybrids...
Not recommended. If you want to harrass people, take an one slot xbow or some throwing shit like most of the skirmishers do... otherwise it will be YOU being harrassed, a lot ;-)

[Dooz]

Oh poo. I was afraid of such things. In any case, I'll likely use STF to try out one of these builds for a little bit and see how they feel. If indeed it does nothing but hinder both melee and ranged, rendering me a useless pile of equipment, I'll stick to one or the other next gen.

If anyone else has had any positive experiences with hybrids, let it be known!

[Jarlek]

My honest opinion is not to do it: you'll end up being bad at range and do poor damage up close.

Having said that I prefer an 18/18 option like this:

(click to show/hide)

    Strength: 18
    Agility: 18
    Hit points: 53

    Skills to attributes: 2

    Ironflesh: 0
    Power Strike: 6
    Shield: 5
    Athletics: 6
    Riding: 0
    Horse Archery: 0
    Power Draw: 6
    Power Throw: 0
    Weapon Master: 6

    One Handed: 110
    Two Handed: 1
    Polearm: 1
    Archery: 128
    Crossbow: 1
    Throwing: 1

You'll need to wear light armor to avoid affecting your wpf totals, and I strongly recommend you take a blunt or pierce type weapon for melee.

This wont work at all. The 1h wpf is too low for use with a shield.

@Dooz: Remember that gloves are x2 weight and helmet is x3 (or is it the other way around?)

[MrShine]

This wont work at all. The 1h wpf is too low for use with a shield.

@Dooz: Remember that gloves are x2 weight and helmet is x3 (or is it the other way around?)

I thought shield didn't effect wpf, only overall run speed. 

And you're right about gloves & helmet weight unless that's changed in the most recent patch.

[Jarlek]

I thought shield didn't effect wpf, only overall run speed. 

And you're right about gloves & helmet weight unless that's changed in the most recent patch.

They dont affect wpf but their speed rating affects you. But that's not the main problem. Using a 1h and shield or just a 1h is very different. Your more, dunno how to put it, sluggish with a shield, no matter which. Without one it is much more easy/fluent to feint and stuff, and it is also generally (or at least feels so) much faster. Your gonna be ok if you use a 100 speed shield, (which would not slow you down) and maybe down to 95 (a bit slower) but I wouldn't go further down than this.

[Dooz]

@Dooz: Remember that gloves are x2 weight and helmet is x3 (or is it the other way around?)

So a helmet with a weight listed at 1 is actually 3? I hope I'm missing something, otherwise I don't get why this would be the case. But thanks for the tip! 

[Vackeno]

The WPF Penalties for Helmet/Gloves are 2x/3x worse than WPF penalties for chest.

Also, FYI, I have 7 PD on my toon. I last played prior to the slot changes and big archery nerf. I was playing today with the nomad bow and regular arrows (cash farming) and on very heavily armored enemies the shots were hitting them but not doing enough damage to even do the 'damage stun' effect. With a weaker bow and lower PD, I imagine you'd hurt slightly less than a bumblebee.

[Jarlek]

So a helmet with a weight listed at 1 is actually 3? I hope I'm missing something, otherwise I don't get why this would be the case. But thanks for the tip! 

For the wpf decrease, yes. Can't remember if it's also multiplied for speed reduction. Check the thread about it if you wanna check it out too. Basically it's because they want helmet and gloves (which ways much less than armour for realistic/logical reasons) to still be an important part of the weight factors.

[Dooz]

So I've decided I likely won't be going with this as a main next gen. At least not until I thoroughly try it out in stf, but there is another build I need to try first and I'll probably have retired at week's end before I get a chance to try another one. In any case, I think I decided which build I'd go with if I were to, and it's a slight wpf variation of the third one in the first post. With an effective armor weight of 17, this would leave me 100 wpf in 1h, and mid 90's in archery. And really, the only difference as compared to a pure shielder build of 18/18 is the lower HP, and somewhat lower wpf, but from what I've come to understand, those are the two least significant things (at least when it comes to already being over 100 in wpf).

(click to show/hide)

Strength: 18
Agility: 18
Hit points: 55
Skills to attributes: 2
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 6
Shield: 4
Athletics: 6
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 6
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 6
One Handed: 121
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 118
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

Thanks again for all the input. Learned a few new things along the way, and I'm pretty happy with this final build as the one to shoot for. Hopefully with it I can take out unsuspecting lightly armored targets from range, or at least weaken them before going in for the kill, and still hold my own in melee about as well as I would if I weren't carrying the bow and arrows. I'll report back when I get around to actually fighting with this.