Why is everything getting balanced except Crush Through?

[Heroin]

But the fact that you can push your stats in cRPG brings a high risk of such weapons becoming OP, as players can skill to minimize the negative effects, to benefit of the superior positive effects.

This is true with almost all weapons in the game, depending on your perspective. For instance, plate users may consider my build OP. I one-shot people in plate fairly regularly on both the battle and duel servers with my german great sword. And with 21 agility, and over 150 wpf, I'm not slow either. Some may consider that OP. My point is, we ALL get to customize our builds. Some are going to be better than others, and some are going to be optimized to do something other people consider "cheesy". That is the game we play.

[Engine]

To make things balanced, and to let those weapons work as intended, I would recommend to make no CT weapon under difficulty 21.

Word up. I'm with you.

Crushthrough sucks.

[Konrax]

Having a high strength requirement wont hinder pure strength builds that use barmace for example.

There needs to be some sort of hard cap on chance to crush through an enemies block.

Maybe something like shield armour stat (22 Armour = 22% can not be crush through cap)
For weapons make it the damage stat (35 Damage = 35% can not be crush through cap)

That would add a dynamic element to want to use slashing type weapons for manual blockers, and give a reasonable chance to not be killed after every overhand swing.

These weapons would also maintain their specific edge against shield users.

[Kalbuth]

Newbie PoV : isn't it possible to simply make CT only work on shield, not on block / chamber, and with hard cap on crush %age? Or taking into account shield user shield skill?
like CT %age = 0.1*(attacker PS / defender Shield) (ie equivalent PS and Shield skills on both sides gives 10% chance of CT)

[Ganon]

Having a high strength requirement wont hinder pure strength builds that use barmace for example.

There needs to be some sort of hard cap on chance to crush through an enemies block.

Maybe something like shield armour stat (22 Armour = 22% can not be crush through cap)
For weapons make it the damage stat (35 Damage = 35% can not be crush through cap)

That would add a dynamic element to want to use slashing type weapons for manual blockers, and give a reasonable chance to not be killed after every overhand swing.

These weapons would also maintain their specific edge against shield users.

My point is exactly that pure strength builds with barmace are not OP at all because they're slow as fuck. They cannot block then reply to an attack, a balanced character can attack before the response, because they're that slow (try it out). They also have very low athletics and movement speed. I even did a higher agi build this retirement because my character being that slow was limiting my gameplay, so i say these things because i tried them out.

[Gorath]

My point is exactly that pure strength builds with barmace are not OP at all because they're slow as fuck. They cannot block then reply to an attack, a balanced character can attack before the response, because they're that slow (try it out).

I did try it out on the duel server when we had this debate in voip.  You absolutely can counterattack with a barmace every time as a str build.  M&B combat mechanics combined with the speed of the weapon make this so. 
Maul               spd rtng 86           length 70
Mallet             spd rtng 84           length 71
Great Maul     spd rtng 80           length 68
Bar Mace        spd rtng 92            length 96

Sword speed with sword length.  Yeah, something is pretty fuxord here.

Of course crush through is a gay mechanic anyways for 2 main reasons:
1)  It crushes through chamber blocks (and manual blocks) even though it's supposed to be an "anti-shield/turtle" option.  Yeah, uh huh.
2)  It's a mechanic based around the idea of removing a players RMB.  Mechanics like that in a pvp game are moronic.  If we're going that route I want a weapon that removes your wasd keys.

[Noble Crassius]

Polearm stagger removes all your keys lol. but on topic yeah by those stats bar mace looks OP to me 

[Ganon]

Barmace does not crush through heavy weapons manual blocking. And as a dev stated, the weight modifier for manual blocking will be increased. Also about your claim that a str character cannot be spammed to death, we need a video I know how slow it is and how fast proper spammers are, they can swing 3 times before he swings again lol

[Xant]

Barmace goes through my krautsword like buttah

[Vexus]

Just remove crush through form barmace and iron mace and leave the short weapons able to crush.

[UrLukur]

I did try it out on the duel server when we had this debate in voip.  You absolutely can counterattack with a barmace every time as a str build.  M&B combat mechanics combined with the speed of the weapon make this so. 
Maul               spd rtng 86           length 70
Mallet             spd rtng 84           length 71
Great Maul     spd rtng 80           length 68
Bar Mace        spd rtng 92            length 96

Sword speed with sword length.  Yeah, something is pretty fuxord here.

Of course crush through is a gay mechanic anyways for 2 main reasons:
1)  It crushes through chamber blocks (and manual blocks) even though it's supposed to be an "anti-shield/turtle" option.  Yeah, uh huh.
2)  It's a mechanic based around the idea of removing a players RMB.  Mechanics like that in a pvp game are moronic.  If we're going that route I want a weapon that removes your wasd keys.

Any hit remove wsad for short amount of time. So Barmace not only remove rmb but wsad too. Not to mention one or two or three hit kill.

[Sean_Drew]

Hm .... i think there should be a weapon against every weapon.

And so must be a crushthrough , that counters Shield 1h ...

The thing is .... crushtrough weapon should be very slow .... like the Long ( ? ) Maul .... which weapon speed is 70.

I use it against shielders , that attack my archer.

But the first hit must be a hit .... and the second .... and the third .... and the fourth .... or im dead ...

This thing is soooooo slow , that if u didnt hit the first hit, ure 100% dead .... and i say ... .this is right so ...

A crushthrough weapon should be like the long maul ..... very very heavy .... and very very slow.

If u have a crushthrough weapon , that u can wield like a katana .... something is wrong ....

I ask , why can u wield it so fast, when it is so heavy , that u can crush through shields ? There is something wrong.

So make crushthrough weapons slow and everything is fine.

One step back when the wielder attack u , and then u go infight .... bam , bam , bam .... no chance for the slow crusher ...
1h shielder mostly have high agi , so that they can attack 2h and so on ...

But let crushthrough live .... like in the long maul .... this thing is really heavy .... i think i carry an anchor with this thing. Im slow like hell ....

Dont know what it is , with the bar mace .... didnt try it , but i think a speed over 90+ is too fast for crushtrough weapon. It should be slow and heavy. And everything is fine.

Sorry for mistakes ... my english is bad ;-)

P.s.: Can someone tell me , what this Troll point has to say , what i have ? What does it mean ?

[dontgothere]

But if you guys ban crush-through, I may never get a kill ever again.   

[Sean_Drew]

Yes , you will .... crushthrough is no magic weapon ....

A good player will kill a crush through user easily , like me a few minutes ago .... he walked back, when i swing and than attacks with fast swings .... i had no chance ...

The only thing is .... crush through must be heavy and slow .... than its ok ....

[Ganon]

Just remove crush through form barmace and iron mace and leave the short weapons able to crush.

They are doing that and i'm using the great maul as anti-turtle weapon, which is so short any kind of backpedaling with me being so slow results in 100% miss. A really unnecessary nerf. My suggestion is to up the requirement while keeping crush trough on that weapon, but Gorath did some weird test were a 3 agi character was not outspammed by a 27 or 30 agi one. I call bs on that

Xant they're increasing the blocking abilty of 2h weapons, just look at previous posts in this thread you can find the formula.