Long spears aka pikes

[Xant]

... Jesus christ, Joxer. You are comparing overheading with longspear/pike and a great long axe? Well, that's not surprising. Even before on this thread you've failed to comprehend how buggy overhead on polearms is more abusable on longspears than the shorter polearms.

[Joxer]

Holy supreme being of dark you are actually responding to my post. Wow that's a surprise.

[Xant]

Yes, I stopped responding to your posts earlier because they made no sense at all. Like.. at all. I respond to people if they say something stupid, but if it's something outright nonsensical, why bother. I see now that I shouldn't have started replying.

[Dezilagel]

...fail atempt at a comeback Joxer.

Srsly:

Game Balance Discussion

Leave this thread alone.

[Joxer]

Wtf do you even read shit before you go off ranting offtopic crap.
I replied to this:

The over head makes no sense realistically or game-balance wise. How would someone swing that pole over their head like that so easily

R-E-A-D

[ManOfWar]

It's gay. The instant thrust was easier to block than the current slow one.

YES I cannot chamber that shit!

[Kharn]

They can be realistic and balanced at the same time.

Add unbalanced to the weapon (you shouldn't be able to feint with a pike)
Lower the speeds of the weapons a bit
Increase the damage a bit
Lower the cost decently

[Gorath]

(you shouldn't be able to feint with a pike)

True

Though you really shouldn't be able to feint with any of the longer than 110 reach weapons period.  At least not like you can do in Warband without the unbalanced tag.

[Vibe]

They can be realistic and balanced at the same time.

Add unbalanced to the weapon (you shouldn't be able to feint with a pike) - yes
Lower the speeds of the weapons a bit - no
Increase the damage a bit - dear god no
Lower the cost decently - lol

[Leshma]

Just to inform you that pikes are back in the fashion

One day nerfs ftw!

[Cyclopsided]

They fixed the buggy overheads, removed it from long spear all together.
-->leshma complains they are still used as a support thrusting pole arm and didn't disappear from battle completely.

[Camaris]

I like the idea making pikes unbalanced.

[PikeDan]

Pikes should be unbalanced, for sure. If you're feinting with a 300 length weapon, you're doing it wrong.

[Cyclopsided]

You... you really think feinting is the problem? Or do you think unbalanced tag actually prevents feinting? Both? [Surprise: Both are wrong]

Unbalanced tag would really just cause a huge additional stun to the pike users after you block them. They wouldn't be able to block your return swing. Pretty easy to see the problem there. You want pikemen to not be able to defend themselves, again.

[PikeDan]

You... you really think feinting is the problem? Or do you think unbalanced tag actually prevents feinting? Both? [Surprise: Both are wrong]

Unbalanced tag would really just cause a huge additional stun to the pike users after you block them. They wouldn't be able to block your return swing. Pretty easy to see the problem there. You want pikemen to not be able to defend themselves, again.

There's already a pretty long wait between pokes, and I assure you, I don't want pikemen to be unable to defend themselves (Especially when I am one, after all.)

However, it's a 300 length weapon, and it should feel like a 300 length weapon. I think that by either giving it unbalenced and adding say, +2 damage or by keeping it as is and lowering the damage would both work, depending on how the devs would want the pike to fit in the Metagame. As it is right now, Cav stay away from me, and I tend to get most of my kills via support with a pike, and giving it +2 damage/Unbalanced would reinforce that infantry support role while still being one of the best deterrants to cav around.

IMO, the strength of the pike isn't in dehorsing cav, it's in keeping cav away from the line to start with, what cav outside of stupid ones would charge an aware pikeman, after all?