cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Game Balance Discussion => Topic started by: Lech on July 07, 2011, 01:31:19 pm
-
This way, horse archers will be capped at 5 ridding if they want their 15/24 build and horse crossbowman will have to invest in strength instead of going full agi like currently. Also, run and gun archers will be affected as they wouldn't be able to outrun everything else like they do currently. Mostly agi characters will excel in weapon proficiency and don't forget that AGI innate ability is increasing running speed and acceleration. Balanced builds will be the ones with most athletic and ridding and not many people would have more than 6 in either skill which will indirectly nerf cavalry and ninjas, which is good.
-
Yes, let's make agility worse. That's exactly what this mod needs. < /sarcasm>
-
Hmm. Do you even try to make standart HA build here http://infinitum.dyndns.org/crpg/calc.htm ?
Strength: 15
Agility: 24
Hit points: 50
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 0
Power Strike: 0
Shield: 0
Athletics: 0
Riding: 6
Horse Archery: 4
Power Draw: 5
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 8
One Handed: 1
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 173
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Do you really think that this +1 riding will make HA inoffensive?
You prefer to play slow character, or balanced character - they prefer to play fast characters, don't you think that's fair enough?
-
Hmm. Do you even try to make standart HA build here http://infinitum.dyndns.org/crpg/calc.htm ?
Strength: 15
Agility: 24
Hit points: 50
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 0
Power Strike: 0
Shield: 0
Athletics: 0
Riding: 6
Horse Archery: 4
Power Draw: 5
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 8
One Handed: 1
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 173
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Do you really think that this +1 riding will make HA inoffensive?
You prefer to play slow character, or balanced character - they prefer to play fast characters, don't you think that's fair enough?
They are horse archers, and on lvl 31 and up they do have 8 ridding. Why should i have ANY sympathy for most annoying class in entire c-rpg that have NO counters 1vs1 ?
With such change, lancers would have some chances against the build.
I don't think horse archers are fair, they have too high damage output atm, and their horses allow them to dodge arrows like there is no tomorrow. Also, it would make 21/18 or 18/18 builds decent choice as those would sport more ridding than 15/24 cookie cutter build.
-
But lancer CAN make build with more riding than HA.
Strength: 12
Agility: 27
Hit points: 49
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 4
Shield: 0
Athletics: 0
Riding: 9
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 9
One Handed: 1
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 181
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Maybe lancers just Don't Want to be faster, and prefer more durable builds?
-
Pointless.
-
Pointless.
-
Daft.
Especially since a lot of HA don't have 8 riding. It depends on what you value at level 30 with a 15/24 build. I'd rather the extra HA and WM than another riding. At 31 you retire. Some don't, but most do, so I doubt the extra skill point earned then helps much.
And to high damage output? :shock:
Takes a hell of a lot of arrows to kill even someone in medium armour with my MW Strongbow and bodkins.
My build at level 29:
Strength: 15
Agility: 23
Weapon proficiency:
One Handed: 1
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 162
Crossbow : 1
Throwing: 1
Skills (with 1 skill point to spend and will have another on next level):
Iron Flesh : 0
Power Strike: 0
Shield: 0
Athletics: 0
Riding: 6
Horse Archery: 3
Power Draw: 5
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 7
Now you're saying I should be punished for making a pure dedicated build? Well I apologise :rolleyes:
-
Well hot damn, so this is what the new system does, receive -5 or 6 or more, and your post becomes hidden... I like this.
But to the original post, there is no reason to make athletics worse, especially since Calradia is in the middle of the Rainforest.
-
Not surprising the playerbase want to keep their little crutches a bit longer.
Yes overdriven, you should be punished for creating one trick pony horse archer who don't even use melee weapon, just bow and 3 slots of arrows.
-
BLOODY FUCKIN HYBRIDS AND THEIR BEST OF BOTH WORLDS EQUAL UNBALANCEDNESS
BLOODY FUCKING ONE TRICK PONY DEDICATED BUILDS AND THEIR STUPID INABILITY TO DO MORE THAN ONE THING
Honestly, which is it gents?
The glass cannon that is my Dedicated crossbow build takes nearly 3-4 arrows to die in medium level armor from most lvl 31 HA builds. I don't blame them for wanting to carry 3 stacks of arrows. They are in no way obligated to play into the strengths of other melee classes if they don't need/want to and as long as it doesn't cause delaying or anything of that matter. Also, de-horse said bowman and then what are they going to do? even if they live long enough to get up, they won't be blocking with that bow of theirs. While very annoying, I don't see much of a problem with horse archery, especially since it doesn't really get good until one has put a good amount of investment into it.
-
Not surprising the playerbase want to keep their little crutches a bit longer.
Yes overdriven, you should be punished for creating one trick pony horse archer who don't even use melee weapon, just bow and 3 slots of arrows.
I use a sword occasionally. I just don't have any PS or WPF so it takes me a century and 1000000 hits to kill anyoe. There's no harm in making a dedicated build. Like a dedicated str build, shielder, archer, lancer ect ect. You see plenty of those.
Again I apologise for wanting to perfect my class and be as skilled as possible at it. Such people as I seem to have caused you great pain.
-
Not surprising the playerbase want to keep their little crutches a bit longer.
Yes overdriven, you should be punished for creating one trick pony horse archer who don't even use melee weapon, just bow and 3 slots of arrows.
You can argue all you want for "riding" being a crutch as there are ways of making Cav arguements worth considering... But are you seriously claiming that "athletics" is a crutch?
Regardless.
How will this even solve ANY of the 18/18 or 21/21 archer builds which will STILL outpace your "balanced" melee builds if this suggestion was implemented. The only melee builds that I see who have "even" stat allocation of 18/18 or the like and thus can take advantage of your proposed system for fast athletics are shielders, which can't to shit to catch up to a lightly armoured non-slow-ass-shield using archer.
The ironic thing is, Archer Builds are more "Stat Balanced" with the STR/AGIL ratios then Melee Builds are on average.
So now, archers will outrun everything with a pulse still, 6 ATHL archers will still be a dime a dozen, 7 ATHL archers will be a bit more rare, and STR Melee builds will dominate AGIL Melee builds more then ever...
What?
-
The ironic thing is, Archer Builds are more "Stat Balanced" with the STR/AGIL ratios then Melee Builds are on average.
So now, archers will outrun everything with a pulse still, 6 ATHL archers will still be a dime a dozen, 7 ATHL archers will be a bit more rare, and STR Melee builds will dominate AGIL Melee builds more then ever...
What?
This post says it all. Agility really doesn't add much. Please don't take away its crowning skill.
-
You can argue all you want for "riding" being a crutch as there are ways of making Cav arguements worth considering... But are you seriously claiming that "athletics" is a crutch?
Regardless.
How will this even solve ANY of the 18/18 or 21/21 archer builds which will STILL outpace your "balanced" melee builds if this suggestion was implemented. The only melee builds that I see who have "even" stat allocation of 18/18 or the like and thus can take advantage of your proposed system for fast athletics are shielders, which can't to shit to catch up to a lightly armoured non-slow-ass-shield using archer.
The ironic thing is, Archer Builds are more "Stat Balanced" with the STR/AGIL ratios then Melee Builds are on average.
So now, archers will outrun everything with a pulse still, 6 ATHL archers will still be a dime a dozen, 7 ATHL archers will be a bit more rare, and STR Melee builds will dominate AGIL Melee builds more then ever...
What?
It will solve the 18/24 or 18/21 builds, it's not only archer specific, 2h and polearm use such builds a lot too, not to mention cavalry. It's aim is to reduce average speed of cavalry and nerf agi builds.
-
i seriously dont get the point why you want to nerf everything. its awsome to have extremes, and i love seeing skilled str builds kill half a team just like i love seeing high skilled ninjas sneaking around backsslashing jumping and running and what not.
deversity for the win. fuck this communist equality crave.
-
It will solve the 18/24 or 18/21 builds
srsly. what is there to solve. lets solve trees. and peanutbutter.
-
It will solve the 18/24 or 18/21 builds, it's not only archer specific, 2h and polearm use such builds a lot too, not to mention cavalry. It's aim is to reduce average speed of cavalry and nerf agi builds.
Why exactly does the game need to slow down? You old? :P
-
It will solve the 18/24 or 18/21 builds,.....
and nerf agi builds.
And what is your issue with 18/21(4) builds instead of 30/9 builds which run rampant across the land now that agility is worthless compared to STR? We're all having the same problem trying to comprehend how you could be having problems with underpowered, gimpy, and weak agility builds compared to the STR build domination which is the current state of the game.
-
And what is your issue with 18/21(4) builds instead of 30/9 builds which run rampant across the land now that agility is worthless compared to STR? We're all having the same problem trying to comprehend how you could be having problems with underpowered, gimpy, and weak agility builds compared to the STR build domination which is the current state of the game.
This really.
If anything, nerf my 36/3 12PS 11IF character that shatters people in siege or any battlemap with more then 50 players. I have been couched by Tommy or Roh' and lived, laughing manically in my Transitional+ armour. If I ever decide to swap out my HBS for a Claymore or Mallet or Morningstar, not much stands up to my abuse.
STR builds are just silly powerful right now. Even "balanced' STR builds like 27/12 work wonders for polearms, two handers and shielders. This too is silly.
-
silly maybe, but way cool. i want all that shit. i plead to the chadzs that deversity will win over cruel uniformity.
its a bit like in the real world: i want hot shots, cripples, hunks, heteros, homos, women, men, ugly, beautiful, strong, weak, fat, thin, fuck it, even LECHs to live, let live, get born and die in one big happy chunk of life, and not a uniform-as-fuck-world in which everyone different doesnt get a chance. (sooner or later someone had to bring a chocolate chip cookie thing into this thread) so ya! stop nerfing! stop chocolate chip cookieing around!! say yes to...
life ^^
-
silly maybe, but way cool. i want all that shit. i plead to the chadzs that deversity will win over cruel uniformity.
its a bit like in the real world: i want hot shots, cripples, hunks, heteros, homos, women, men, ugly, beautiful, strong, weak, fat, thin, fuck it, even LECHs to live, let live, get born and die in one big happy chunk of life, and not a uniform-as-fuck-world in which everyone different doesnt get a chance. (sooner or later someone had to bring a chocolate chip cookie thing into this thread) so ya! stop nerfing! stop chocolate chip cookieing around!! say yes to...
life ^^
If this is true then AGI needs to be buffed to be in line with the power of STR builds. Athletics needs to make a MUCH greater difference, even/especially in armor above leather and such.
-
If this is true then AGI needs to be buffed to be in line with the power of STR builds. Athletics needs to make a MUCH greater difference, even/especially in armor above leather and such.
would be fine with me
-
And what is your issue with 18/21(4) builds instead of 30/9 builds which run rampant across the land now that agility is worthless compared to STR? We're all having the same problem trying to comprehend how you could be having problems with underpowered, gimpy, and weak agility builds compared to the STR build domination which is the current state of the game.
Agi shielders might be up, but agi polearm and 2h users do more than fine. Most 2h swords and long war axe require just 15 str and with 43+ damage they don't need much powerstrike to be effective. They don't even require 5 tbh to 2 hit kill most people. Imo, athletic footwork advantage is more effective than one additional hit or less turning into strikes, considering you can dance dodge arrows and bolts.
Anyway, with changed soak and reduction values that will probably be in next patch, agility would regain it's position.
Also, look at the perfect builds (33+), most of them are high agi builds. If athletic sucks, why so many people want 7+ ?
-
Also, look at the perfect builds (33+), most of them are high agi builds. If athletic sucks, why so many people want 7+ ?
Level 35 (142 278 448 xp)
Strength: 30
Agility: 12
Hit points: 77
Skills to attributes: 4
Ironflesh: 6
Power Strike: 10
Shield: 4
Athletics: 4
Riding: 4
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 4
One Handed: 102
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 120
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
If i had 9 to 12 Heirloom points and level 35? I would make this. No Contest. What do I need more athletics for? You can't dance me in melee. Chase an archer? I've got a shield. or a horse. or both.
This is a: Pikeman, Pole arm spammer, Hoplite, 1h / Shield, Swash buckler, Lancer, 1h Cav.
If I am in light armor I am going to be fast. If I put on A lordly Gothic Plate w/ Bevor + Lordly Plate Mittens? You won't kill me. Sorry bro, I don't have to chase you then because if you can outrun me, you're too weak to get through my armor in an agility build.
-
But lancer CAN make build with more riding than HA.
Strength: 12
Agility: 27
Hit points: 49
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 4
Shield: 0
Athletics: 0
Riding: 9
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 9
One Handed: 1
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 181
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Maybe lancers just Don't Want to be faster, and prefer more durable builds?
that build is retarded for a lancer. You basically have no hp and go at silly speeds on horse... good luck if a fly passes on front of you while doing so, coz it may kill you XD.
-
But lancer CAN make build with more riding than HA.
Strength: 12
Agility: 27
Hit points: 49
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 1
Power Strike: 4
Shield: 0
Athletics: 0
Riding: 9
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 9
One Handed: 1
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 181
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Maybe lancers just Don't Want to be faster, and prefer more durable builds?
Lancers need the PS to go for the 1-shot. I wouldn't recommend 4 PS and 1 IF. On top of this, WPF isn't as important to a lancer as damage and health.
-
my favorite lancer build is the 21/15 with 5ps and 7 riding, 7 athl