cRPG
Melee: Battlegrounds => General => Topic started by: Smoothrich on December 29, 2014, 08:47:58 pm
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Use that nifty map maker tech and draw up something like out of a Total War game or Mount and Blade, make it simple and maybe draw from a few Strategus ideas in a short demo.
A lot of people would be happy to see some kind of campaign thing promised eventually instead of just deathmatch, and you guys could prob make it look cool and show off your potential some.
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No.
ONly persistent world mod would be good with Europe map.
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No.
ONly persistent world mod would be good with Europe map.
Yeah, Persistent World mod with a big ass map is what the real potential of this game could be.
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How about something playable for those who crowdfunded it two years ago? You seem all over the place, a bit of that a bit of this, but nothing in playable state.
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How about something playable for those who crowdfunded it two years ago? You seem all over the place, a bit of that a bit of this, but nothing in playable state.
this would be to attract new people who prefer single player games and to show off their engine/mod potential/expanded gameplay/hype not to simply placate the destitute plebs.
i'd rather they got more fans for a better game in the future than directing resources to some half-assed demo that isn't ready to play yet sooner
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How about something playable for those who crowdfunded it two years ago? You seem all over the place, a bit of that a bit of this, but nothing in playable state.
That's not true at all... Did you sleep through the closed pre-alpha-thing?
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Real Europe map 1:1 scale
Wtf? Welcome to the eternal riding simulator...
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You can capture castles which are close to you, no need to go from Germany to Ireland to get some kills. And you can spawn at castles that belongs to your team so no need to capture distant flags. Still impossible I think.
Not sure if you really mean 1:1 scale though... castles in my area are at best 20-50 km apart from another. You would ride for hours to even see another player and you would actually never be able to cross the entire map.
Besides that from a technical standpoint that would just not be possible... the biggest maps in all of gaming wouldn't be bigger than a smaller county in real life.
I can imagine a big Europe map but it would be more like 1:20000
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Pretty sure Daggerfall was about the size of the UK. There was a lot of riding, but it was actually kind of fun knowing you've been riding for 15 minutes in order to see something like 0.00000000001% of the game world (which in this case was the dungeon at the end of the ride, riding always looked the same).
By my calculations, walking from Lisbon to Moscow in real time should take about 3 weeks, but if you think about it, if every settlement in the immediate vicinity of Lisbon were represented, it would probably take longer to march to all of those in succession.
It would be cool, but it's probably not the team's aim. I can't imagine it'd be terribly hard to mod, unless you wanted the content to be accurate to each location. Increasing that accuracy would obviously make it exponentially harder.
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Pretty sure Daggerfall was about the size of the UK.
Daggerfall: 62 km²
UK: 244.820 km²
Not quite... :P
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I said "about"!
Actually:
Bethesda claims that the scale of the game is the size of Great Britain: around 229,848 square kilometers/ 88,745 sq miles, though the actual size of the map is 161,600 square kilometers, or 62,394 square miles. The game world features over 15,000 towns, cities, villages, and dungeons for the player's character to explore. According to Todd Howard, game director and executive producer for Bethesda, the game's sequel, The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind, is 0.01% the size of Daggerfall, but most of Daggerfall 's terrain was randomly generated. The explorable part of Morrowind, Vvardenfell, is 9.3 square miles, or 24 square kilometers. By comparison,The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion is approximately 22 square miles, or 56.97 square kilometers, and The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim is 14.3 square miles, or 37.1 square kilometers, with a quarter of this terrain as unplayable, as it is stuck behind invisible borders.
Anyway, it felt big enough. :)
M&B2 is touting 225km2 battle maps - I can't remember if M:BG map size has been revealed, but I expect they'll be comparable. You'd need to line up about 30 of those maps on each side of a square to get the size of the UK (so ~1000 maps all up) - or a few more than 200 on each side (say ~50 000 all up) to get the size of Europe.
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Oh stop being such size queens.
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But size matters. :(
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You can get altitude at varying levels of accuracy, then take a high level sample map of terrain imagery and generate it from there. It wouldn't be hard to make a game covering the entirety of Europe or even Earth given that all of the data already exists.
I agree on that there should not be a 1:1 scale though, that's just silly and boring. You could potentially make it playable by making time crazy fast and just using fast travel-like abilities between points of interest, but then you lose the feel of scale of the maps.
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We need to attract people who like singleplayer which is a huge demographic. Just look at all the singleplayer mods for Warband!
Think of people like Yahtzee who don't like playing with other people :D
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I said "about"!
Actually:
Anyway, it felt big enough. :)
M&B2 is touting 225km2 battle maps - I can't remember if M:BG map size has been revealed, but I expect they'll be comparable. You'd need to line up about 30 of those maps on each side of a square to get the size of the UK (so ~1000 maps all up) - or a few more than 200 on each side (say ~50 000 all up) to get the size of Europe.
I'm a bit lost on the decimal places here.
I thought it was 244820 km² for the UK (not 244 km²); while Daggerfall being only 161 km², which would be an enormous difference. But you're saying it's actually 161600 km², right? Anyway, hand crafted 3D worlds won't be that huge. It would be totally boring to ride for hours without seeing anything. Bannerlord's map size will be more than sufficient for any gaming purpose.
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Yeah, it was about 3/4 the size of GB.
I've never tried Euro Truck Simulator, but I suspect it's probably not my type of game, however, a lot of people love it.
I think whether scale translates to "boring" or "exciting" depends on how you handle it in the game. Is trapsing across the barren waste a major part of the game, or something you can automate and do in the background? Is there pointless filler or does it all have the potential to be a place of interest if you stop and start to build?
For a Europe map for stronghold PW mod for or more realistically, for M:Epic, I think huge scale could work really well for this type of game, but it does need an approachable auto-travel system - like strategus - you don't generally sit there and watch your guy travel all the way across the map. In M:Epic, this could be an alt that you occasionally check up on and set new waypoints, while most of the time you're playing with your other characters.
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Well, I would prefer to have no fast travel options apart from respawning at your home base or the nearest next spawn point. Traveling is a major thing in games like this imho.
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You know Warband has some excellent city maps and Strategus was the perfect way to experience them.
With enough resources I bet people could design a dozen high quality epic siege type maps of historical or fantasy places whatever the Melee setting is. Release good map making tools and maybe one of the cRPG mapper pros will show real potential as a Melee mapper too.
Need good maps for a good game. And the devs could do cool scripting with friendly merchant NPCs getting owned by heavy cav at the start for immersion on high quality maps suitable for MP.
Not even a strategy map required except for flavor and just fight an army as attacker or defender with pre designed spawns and gear. Maybe culture themed so the AI does a full gimmick like DTV. And let players drop in and out of the rotating maps or just single player. Like Titanfall does in concept.
That was honestly a leading theme in comment chains and feedback on the Kickstarter, only interested in single player. Cut them in on the fun so they pay in.
The DTV noobs too. But it's more Defend the Keep and you with optional Co op bros slaughter AI armies of escalating strength with Stronghold type defenses between waves. Wave defense is casual gamer crack, DTV is already popular, rethink it bigger and better as a core Melee mode.
Like cod Zombies but upgrading your walls boiling oil repairing walls getting corpses out of the spikes so the enemy can't use its dead as cover or climbing between waves. And chill out time of the enemy archers showering arrows or catapults between infantry assaults as you loot gold and gear between waves to be real immersive and fast paced. Let ranged my old friends get boners headshotting bots instead of kiting in MP to cum.
The Siege of Ahmmerad for example could be presented like the movie 300 with Day 1 2 3 etc as the increasing difficulty with bombardment and Stronghold repair every day. Show Kesh at his tent pushing a knight chess piece and zooming in on his raging yet scheming face and switch to Huey leading a suicidal cavalry charge into the breach all patrioticly at dawn for effect.
I understand the game mechanic limitations but demos of gametypes and engine scripted crap seem very doable for you guys. Maybe whip up you walking in a pike phalanx towards a smoking rubbly wall gap to an opposing shield wall with people hammering their shields and taunting. End with a united war cry charge by both sides while directed Arbalast spam from a contested siege tower melee in the background instakills with attention to deadly bolts piercing armor and blood spewing feedback and an arrow getting stuck in your armor that you shrug off before rearing a horse and dodging a lance all dramatically.
Eventually us fans and fellow modders should get some early tools to animate crap like that to show off your engine. Who doesn't love historical warfare reenactments? And good ones you curate on YouTube. The shit people do in the Total War engine can be amazing but you could be better for personal combat.
Honestly just using the engine for cool looking shit would create interest and probably be fun. Be sure to experiment a lot and look to community members for help on engine tests as a loyal shitty pre alpha group whenever you want playtesting!
You should also promise to sponsor community made gametypes and maps on dedicated servers to reassure your pc gaming credentials.
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Daggerfall: 62 km²
UK: 244.820 km²
Not quite... :P
Slovenia 0.2 km²
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Slovenia 0.2 km²
This mmo scale talk is stupid. I think an arcade focus would be superior for the Melee game. On deep dueling and army battle mechanics with high quality maps and epic sieges. Just add some single player and Co op modes to those good maps. And casual shit like spawning as cav in a large bot filled server to slaughter peasants like evil DTV.
All the talk about massive scale battles would need solid maps and bots. Another good innovation from Titanfall was the Moba styled trash bots to feed xp from. That should be considered for a game mode with Moba influences that I always dreamed of for Warband where you level and gear up over the rounds with peasant creeps and real players always fighting.
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Slovenia 0.2 km²
:?
Rather 20.273 km²
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Slovenia 0.2 km²
haha
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I hate the idea of gigantic maps. If there's 1000 people on then maybe but it would suck otherwise. It's like DayZ, you spend half an hour trying to find anything, just fields and houses no action. That's fine for survival I guess but this is a war game, needs battles.
Perhaps scale the maps dependent on the players online?