cRPG
Strategus => Strategus Issues => Topic started by: VeritasQ on June 16, 2013, 05:42:29 pm
-
Is there any change in speed options lately ? Because my current horse amount is bigger than crates amount + my troops and my movement speed is around 17-18 meters per minute :?
-
the strat Map terrain plays a role as well.
so if u are in a forest or a hill area 17-18 meters would be your speed with horses, unless u have made a slight oversight and mixed crates with amount of goods (u need more horses than the amount of goods, crates play no direct role when we purely operate with goods numbers)
-
also after 5h quick march u exhausted for several hours
-
This is what I use
Number of troops x 2 + Number of horses > Number of crates (not goods) for max speed bonus.
So with 5000 horses and 500 troops you could carry up to 6000 crates or around 10,000 trading goods while still maintaining a max speed bonus.
-
This is what I use
Number of troops x 2 + Number of horses > Number of crates (not goods) for max speed bonus.
So with 5000 horses and 500 troops you could carry up to 6000 crates or around 10,000 trading goods while still maintaining a max speed bonus.
have u actually tried this, cus i dont believe you can have horse speed bonus with these numbers, rather the opposite.
as soon as u have more goods than horses you will loose your speed bonus, dont forget to do an action on the map first, so the info numbers are updated.
-
have u actually tried this, cus i dont believe you can have horse speed bonus with these numbers, rather the opposite.
as soon as u have more goods than horses you will loose your speed bonus, dont forget to do an action on the map first, so the info numbers are updated.
Yes, I have tried this, but not with the numbers specified. About 2 weeks ago I had 3000 horses and 5000 goods with 250 troops. I was able to keep max bonus speed (32). To test this I kept increasing the number of goods and moving inside and outside of the fief until I suffered a speed penalty and that's where I got my numbers from.
-
That still sounds odd to me, i'm gonna do another test then today when my little battle is done, ty for your input, i'll definitely will try it and post about it here.
-
Yes, I have tried this, but not with the numbers specified. About 2 weeks ago I had 3000 horses and 5000 goods with 250 troops. I was able to keep max bonus speed (32). To test this I kept increasing the number of goods and moving inside and outside of the fief until I suffered a speed penalty and that's where I got my numbers from.
do u had 5000* goods or 2,3,4,5 differrent types of goods with summary ammount of 5000* goods?
-
do u had 5000* goods or 2,3,4,5 differrent types of goods with summary ammount of 5000* goods?
It was 5000 of the same type of goods. Here's a screenshot I took to show my friend who didn't believe me either:
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Notice I am quick marching at max speed. From my testing I could have had 204 more crates while keeping the bonus.
-
tested right now with same amount of troops (250) goods (5020) and horses (2927)
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ArQFr5D9x-NpdEpuT3ROaWVwdWNNUVFGdDRWV0p6aEE#gid=0
i got speed 13.805 (with quick march 13,805* ~2.3 = ~31,75)
if take horses more then crates speed 17.890 (qm ~40,9)
AND IF HORSES = GOODS speed 32.202 (qm ~74)
so stfu and here - from me for wasting 1h of my time :cry:
tip: speed recalculate after 1 min in moving so if enter in fief with speed 70 take 1000000000 crates and press move to in info it will be still show speed 70 and only after 1 min travel ur speed recalculater and will te shown as 9
-
I don't know why you think I'm lying, or why you're being hostile. Do you think I really photoshopped that picture? What would I gain? What kind of horses are you using, how much equipment are you carrying, and what terrain?
-
i think u just take that screen right after u got goods and leave fief and didnt wait 1 min
-
I promise you vovka, I did no such thing.
Here are the horses I had if that makes a difference:
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
-
if u still have that goods just take another 3k horses and ur speed will increase
its always worked as: max speed if horses > goods > troops
if u want take more goods u can take different types of goods but still horses must more than the amount of each type of goods
-
But I have max speed bonus already. I move the same speed with 20 goods as I do with 5000 goods. This is the forumla I worked out myself and it has worked for me 3 times now. If you don't want to believe it I'm not going to force you, but don't call me a liar! :mrgreen:
Btw, if I had just left a fief in the above screenshot, then why would my quick march be at 251 minutes? That would mean I turned on quick march in the fief then left almost an hour later.
-
i think we play in different strats ((
-
This is what I use
Number of troops x 2 + Number of horses > Number of crates (not goods) for max speed bonus.
So with 5000 horses and 500 troops you could carry up to 6000 crates or around 10,000 trading goods while still maintaining a max speed bonus.
It was 5000 of the same type of goods. Here's a screenshot I took to show my friend who didn't believe me either:
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Notice I am quick marching at max speed. From my testing I could have had 204 more crates while keeping the bonus.
so on screen u have 250 troops 2927 horses and "3723 crates not goods"
now use ur magic formula
250*2+2927=3427 of shit its not more then 3723
:P
-
so on screen u have 250 troops 2927 horses and "3723 crates not goods"
now use ur magic formula
250*2+2927=3427 of shit its not more then 3723
:P
Take into account excess equipment which takes around 300 crates
-
Take into account excess equipment which takes around 300 crates
oh yes 5020 goods its 3347 crates but still
troops 250 250 250
rouncey 2924 3350 5020
goods 5020 5020 5020
crates 3347 3347 3347
speed 13.805 17.890 32.202
-
as Vovka is pointing out, u have even more crates than your calc is supposedly allowing for an speed bonus, so yeah, seems to me that you info page aint updated at all...
also your pic is showing 5020 goods on the left side and 5041 goods on the middle of the screen...
i'm not gonna waste my time on this sry.
either your messing around here or you're using some buggy scripts for your stratpage.
-
as Vovka is pointing out, u have even more crates than your calc is supposedly allowing for an speed bonus, so yeah, seems to me that you info page aint updated at all...
also your pic is showing 5020 goods on the left side and 5041 goods on the middle of the screen...
i'm not gonna waste my time on this sry.
either your messing around here or you're using some buggy scripts for your stratpage.
i think he have 21 stakes they calculate as goods by script
-
i think he have 21 stakes they calculate as goods by script
ah ok
-
ah ok
btw i think he is merican no? god bless merica iam out :P
-
as Vovka is pointing out, u have even more crates than your calc is supposedly allowing for an speed bonus, so yeah, seems to me that you info page aint updated at all...
also your pic is showing 5020 goods on the left side and 5041 goods on the middle of the screen...
i'm not gonna waste my time on this sry.
either your messing around here or you're using some buggy scripts for your stratpage.
250*2 + 2927 = 3427 + 300 = 3727 > 3724
Troops Horses Equipment
If you don't believe me put your money where your mouth is. I will take the same amount of equipment specified in my original post. If I can't travel at max speed, I will give you 3 loom points. But if I can you will give me 3 million strat gold.
-
250*2 + 2927 = 3427 + 300 = 3727 > 3724
Troops Horses Equipment
If you don't believe me put your money where your mouth is. I will take the same amount of equipment specified in my original post. If I can't travel at max speed, I will give you 3 loom points. But if I can you will give me 3 million strat gold.
save ur looms mate just test it with same as on screen and then add 3k horse on top (5020 in summ)
and u will get this
troops 250 250 250
rouncey 2924 3350 5020
goods 5020 5020 5020
crates 3347 3347 3347
speed 13.805 17.890 32.202
btw max speed in strat smlike 91-93+- :P (2 troops 2 horse 0 crates qm)
-
As Vovka is showing and what you also should get on your stratpage, if u dont, then try disabling your scripts, restart your browser and wait a minute for the page to update after your move action.
There is something going wrong on your page, because we just cant reproduce your numbers mate, no reason to start a betting contest for that...
-
The thing Veritas is asking should be: I have more horses than troops and crates together. Far more than that. Yet it gives 50% of expected speed. Before that it worked perfectly. Did something change? He has more than 4k more horses than needed.
According to formula u dont need horse per good and per troop but u need horses per CRATE and per troop.
-
The thing Veritas is asking should be: I have more horses than troops and crates together. Far more than that. Yet it gives 50% of expected speed. Before that it worked perfectly. Did something change? He has more than 4k more horses than needed.
According to formula u dont need horse per good and per troop but u need horses per CRATE and per troop.
give numbers :P
-
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ArQFr5D9x-NpdEpuT3ROaWVwdWNNUVFGdDRWV0p6aEE#gid=0
Nice doc, I will use it.
The only thing I still have doubt with is :
- the "X + Y" goods type that chadz mentionned in the beginning.... I think it is still true at some degree
- the "10 000 crates and +" range seems to be different (due to bug or due to formula changing with lots of goods/crates?)
-
i dont know how crates calculate
if u have different types of good for example 99*6 (594 in summ) give 99 crates in same time 594 of 1 type goods give u 400 crates and 100*10 = 167 crates in same time 1k goods = 1000*0.666 ~ 667 crates...
for max speed u need #horses more then troops more then crates and more then biggest amount of goods if u have several types
so for transport 600 goods (1 type) with max speed u need 600 horses
or only 100 in u have 6 types goods * 99 (or 101 horses for 100*6 cos its give u 101 crates)
but its almost useless for big factions caravans cos they transfer not more than 2-3 types of goods in same time and its pain in ass calculate how many horses u need and if plan swap with some one u can be fuccked so better just take so many horses as goods u have
-
i dont know how crates calculate
if u have different types of good for example 99*6 (594 in summ) give 99 crates in same time 594 of 1 type goods give u 400 crates and 100*10 = 167 crates in same time 1k goods = 1000*0.666 ~ 667 crates...
for max speed u need #horses more then troops more then crates and more then biggest amount of goods if u have several types
so for transport 600 goods (1 type) with max speed u need 600 horses
or only 100 in u have 6 types goods * 99 (or 101 horses for 100*6 cos its give u 101 crates)
but its almost useless for big factions caravans cos they transfer not more than 2-3 types of goods in same time and its pain in ass calculate how many horses u need and if plan swap with some one u can be fuccked so better just take so many horses as goods u have
Thanks again, its food for though.
I prefer to not waste too much rounceys on caravan so I aim for the fewest, but like you said its a pain in the ass to not know exactly how it works.
-
I am totally confused now. I remember carrying over 10k crates of maybe 10 good types and having 500 troops or less. I used 11k rouncies with no problems. I had speed of 30-34 on plains. I dont understand that document Butan posted. How do i used it?
Lets do some examples. if i have 100 crates of goods (one type) and 100 troops is 200 horses enough? If i have 100 crates (50 each type) and 100 troops is 200 horses enough? If i carry 1000k crates of one good type and 100 troops is 1000.1k horses enough? If i carrying 1000k crates of 10 different goods type and 100 troops is 1000.1k horses enough???
WTF :D
-
I am totally confused now. I remember carrying over 10k crates of maybe 10 good types and having 500 troops or less. I used 11k rouncies with no problems. I had speed of 30-34 on plains. I dont understand that document Butan posted. How do i used it?
Lets do some examples. if i have 100 crates of goods (one type) and 100 troops is 200 horses enough? If i have 100 crates (50 each type) and 100 troops is 200 horses enough? If i carry 1000k crates of one good type and 100 troops is 1000.1k horses enough? If i carrying 1000k crates of 10 different goods type and 100 troops is 1000.1k horses enough???
WTF :D
yes for all examples ) but too many "1000k" i think its just typo but still do u mean just 1000 or 1 000 000 )))
-
It wasnt a typo. I wrote 1000k on purpose. As we know most of use use the common "bug" that hides crates. I wrote 1000k to simulate the large trade stuff. We know caravans sometimes have 20k crates or 50k. What happens in those situations?
-
As Vovka is showing and what you also should get on your stratpage, if u dont, then try disabling your scripts, restart your browser and wait a minute for the page to update after your move action.
There is something going wrong on your page, because we just cant reproduce your numbers mate, no reason to start a betting contest for that...
Well, I can once again confirm that I am moving at max speed with the exact numbers. Nothing is wrong with scripts or my browser. I have been moving for hours and I can clearly tell I'm going at max pace.
-
So your speed is in the 30'ies (without quickmarch) and you have different types of goods or just one type?
-
So your speed is in the 30'ies (without quickmarch) and you have different types of goods or just one type?
I don't know how to make this much clearer. I have one type of goods, 5020 of it and 21 stakes. I am moving at 32.202 speed with 2927 horses.
-
can u make 2 screenshots?
1st - ur info
2nd one (turn off all ur scripts, f5 and ss ur inventory in "faction" menu) ^^
-
Very interesting, after testing back and forth, it seems like the mechanics have changed again since the 0.3.0.0 (from 18-05-2013) patch.
Because at that time this would not work, many have done their testing and ofc made some googlesheets with it.
Now things work with crates again if its only with one type of goods, i also checked your thingy if i stack different types of goods as well and then it wont work crate wise, quite odd.
then a different rule sets in place the no goods type above horses rule...
So yeah, if one person only has one type of goods u can go: troops x2 + horses > crates.
If u have more than one type of goods it becomes different, then its: horses >= goods (u can stack different kinds but none of them may have a higher number than horses, the sum of all goods can be higher as long no type of them is above the horse number).
Example a: fewer troops than 1k horsies with 1k salty stones & 1k cute cats = horse speeds.
Example b: fewer troops than 1k horsies with 1100 salty stones & 1k cute cats = speed penalty (crates are still within the limit but this no longer applies).
-
tested right now again
1.
troops: 200 naked
goods Colored sand: 5000
crates: 3343
rouncey +3: 3000 3000 +200*2=3400>3343
speed:14,189
2.
troops: 200 naked
goods Colored sand: 5000
crates: 3343
rouncey +3: 3343 as many as crates
speed:14,716
3.
troops: 200 naked
goods Colored sand: 5000
crates: 3343
rouncey +3: 5000 as many as goods
speed: 32,841
:( chadz nefred druzhina caravans
-
funny stuff, i tried vovka's exact numbers just with my own goods and i have horsespeed 32.841 meters per minute 8-)
GG DRZ, its over :twisted:
-
conspiracy! :evil:
-
Very interesting, after testing back and forth, it seems like the mechanics have changed again since the 0.3.0.0 (from 18-05-2013) patch.
Because at that time this would not work, many have done their testing and ofc made some googlesheets with it.
Now things work with crates again if its only with one type of goods, i also checked your thingy if i stack different types of goods as well and then it wont work crate wise, quite odd.
then a different rule sets in place the no goods type above horses rule...
So yeah, if one person only has one type of goods u can go: troops x2 + horses > crates.
If u have more than one type of goods it becomes different, then its: horses >= goods (u can stack different kinds but none of them may have a higher number than horses, the sum of all goods can be higher as long no type of them is above the horse number).
Example a: fewer troops than 1k horsies with 1k salty stones & 1k cute cats = horse speeds.
Example b: fewer troops than 1k horsies with 1100 salty stones & 1k cute cats = speed penalty (crates are still within the limit but this no longer applies).
This is interesting. If I read it right then I could potentially have 5000 wolf pelts, 5000 silver cups, and 5000 gold nuggets while suffering no speed penalty? I will test this once I get back in a fief.
-
Yeh when i use 2 different types it seems to ignores the crates and follows the horses, but when i try with 3 different types the crate parameter starts to work again and i cant follow the horses with each type.
Weird stuff, i guess thats also why most ppl tend to stick to 1 type of goods or the few who bother doing the management 2 types.
@Vovka have u tried leaving your faction if it works then?
I wonder if its the goods type or if a sneaky nerf against big clans is set in place :P
-
Yeh when i use 2 different types it seems to ignores the crates and follows the horses, but when i try with 3 different types the crate parameter starts to work again and i cant follow the horses with each type.
Weird stuff, i guess thats also why most ppl tend to stick to 1 type of goods or the few who bother doing the management 2 types.
@Vovka have u tried leaving your faction if it works then?
I wonder if its the goods type or if a sneaky nerf against big clans is set in place :P
yes tried ^^ check map my fiefs white XD
i know for sure some goods from NA have differend weight mb here the same (
-
yes tried ^^ check map my fiefs white XD
i know for sure some goods from NA have differend weight mb here the same (
oh yeah it was white just before hehe.
kk, i guess i'll be tryin the same with the goods from our other fief then, i wonder how much our diamonds weight :P
-
Perhaps its not the goods that are the issue at all. What are your guys' renown levels? I may have another theory if Bjarky's renown is similar to mine. Now that I really think about it, in my starting days of strat I seemed to follow the basic good/speed formula that you guys are talking about, but after getting over 10 mil renown I started to notice I was able to carry more with no penalty.
-
Renown: 4978429
i think i cant carry goods so fast because I'm white and a slav :cry:
-
Dont think so, i have way less renown than Vovka-san :o
Could really be that there are differences between certain goods, i haven't gotten around to check it out yet though, once i have time i will.
-
This movement speed is just retarded. I can only say good job dev team. Devs are more nerfed than archers... I cant figure out how to make my caravan drivers go faster... I got one caravan driver with more horses than troops and goods altogether and he is moving at 18m/min... Rly now... WTF...
-
:shock: and you're not on some lands like forest or hills?
-
There are all conditions for max speed. Plains, horses are way over the needed number, no exhaustion... Everything is done by the book and still doesnt work...
-
There are all conditions for max speed. Plains, horses are way over the needed number, no exhaustion... Everything is done by the book and still doesnt work...
yay! now u biggest looser not me! :P
-
i thought it is all about weight i mean every single horse carries 1kg ( which is now even closer to reality) and i need to do couple more experiments for analysis this bug.
-
tested right now again
1.
troops: 200 naked
goods Colored sand: 5000
crates: 3343
rouncey +3: 3000 3000 +200*2=3400>3343
speed:14,189
2.
troops: 200 naked
goods Colored sand: 5000
crates: 3343
rouncey +3: 3343 as many as crates
speed:14,716
3.
troops: 200 naked
goods Colored sand: 5000
crates: 3343
rouncey +3: 5000 as many as goods
speed: 32,841
:( chadz nefred druzhina caravans
test same pls
100 naked troops
h - # horsys
g - goods 100
c - crates
1. H>G>C
2. G>H>C
3. G>C>H
-
Hmmm tried with different goods now, it seems to behave the same way with me with many goods, so dont think they behave differently per good type anymore.
It is rather as if maybe ppl with alot of long caravan runs on their back can carry more?
Anyhoo as long as ppl follow this, veteran or new: troops < horses > goods
Then there shouldn't be any trouble getting that sweet bonus speed :idea:
-
The more troops I have and the more horses I have the faster I am?! Doesn't sound logic :|
-
no, horses is the one u need more of, troops slow u down the more you have.
-
differently per good type anymore.
I'm not so sure. Actually, I think there may be a small difference in weight of various goods.... I'm not sure, but I think I had a different weight with the same number of goods but from different sources. And it is all calculated basing on goods weight, not number, but the difference is usually to small to notice.
-
yeah i've had some more ppl try it and it seems like caravan number of runs seem to have a play here, caravan newbs couldn't reproduce what the veterans could, i'm far to lazy to test though how many runs that are required of ppl before a bonus buffer starts stacking.
the difference in goods weight is to small to explain what happened to us caravan vets with overstacking goods and still getting the speed bonus.