cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: betard_lulz on April 25, 2013, 11:19:53 pm

Title: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 25, 2013, 11:19:53 pm
SO as a shielder (15/17 atm) I've noticed 2h dont really "recoil" off my shield or even weapon sometimes(Iberian mace) when I succesfully block them yet I recoil off of stuff that blocks me. What gives? anyone have any suggestions on how to fight a 2h person? 
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: sF_Guardian on April 25, 2013, 11:22:00 pm
SpamspamspamspamsPam and .... spam. Standard-tactic for any situation in today's cRPG...
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 25, 2013, 11:30:59 pm
halp. I'm really curious to know why 2h's dont recoil or at least the majority dont and only some guys who swing 2h's do
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Daniisme on April 25, 2013, 11:34:41 pm
I find it the best way to counter a 2 hander is to chamber the fuck out of them.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Panos on April 25, 2013, 11:35:05 pm
Quote from: betard_lulz on April 25, 2013, 11:30:59 pm
halp. I'm really ucrious to know why 2h's dont recoil or at least the majority dont and only some guys who swing 2h's do

because they cry better than the other classes, and their class never got a major nerf.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: kasMVC on April 25, 2013, 11:39:11 pm
How did I not realize this was a whiney wa wa 2h thread veiled as a question


Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Ronin on April 25, 2013, 11:39:14 pm
Best way to counter 2hander, is ranged. Get a ranged sidearm; throwing, crossbow etc.

Or spears and teamwork.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: bigsean on April 25, 2013, 11:40:36 pm
sounds like glancing
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: no_rules_just_play on April 25, 2013, 11:44:20 pm
try to get around him, always hold your shield between you and the twohander. twohander is a little bit too strong, but they are beatable.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Dooz on April 25, 2013, 11:56:42 pm
Sounds like what you're referring to is probably the way a player swings. Depending on how one moves with the swing, before during and after, it might give the impression of "recoiling" or not. Swing and pull back? Recoil. Swing and keep moving in the same direction with another swing or something, doesn't look like a recoil it's more of one smooth motion. I'm not so sure there's actually a game mechanic that deals with recoiling as such, but who knows. Not I.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Vieuxcrotter on April 26, 2013, 12:47:47 am
Its all in the footwork and proper timing. If you see a 2 handers trying to feint like a mofo dont respect is feints too much.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Gurnisson on April 26, 2013, 12:52:09 am
If you think he's a spammer you need to move with your swings, start quite fast after he hits the shield (listen to the sound of him hiting it. Don't get fooled by hold + wiggles), and keep your camera so that your swings will hit him quite early in the animation.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Lennu on April 26, 2013, 01:17:17 am
2h has their weaknesses. Thrust has relatively long stun so with a weapon heavy and fast enough you can hit then before they actually recover from that hit. I'm trying to use this against most of the 2handers I can't "out feint".
Also 2h hilt slash is relatively risky if you can attack back fast enough = they rely on it too much.

So, if a 2hander makes a thrust try to predict when it will contact so you might be able to take advantage of their thrust stun.
Also, if you're fighting with a 2hander, attack back as fast as you can. Leave no room for them to hiltslash. (I find it hilarious how even the best players get to feel my axe of their face because they tried to hiltslash me) This way you might be able to land a few hits, or at least force them to be more careful and not to use their superior attack animations anymore. After you've attacked back at them a few times start using feints again. (I find delayed overheads the hardest ones to block, and delayed leftswings impossible to chamber)


+ you're using an Iberian mace = most op shit on the mod. Knockdown, superior damage, balanced, fast, unglancing leftswing...


+ 1 more thing that I realised. A simple trick that works against bad/average players:  Block once, again, again and again. Now they think their spam has suppressed you, so aim at their head and swing as fast as you can. You might surprise them and get a nice bonus damage for hit on the head + knockdown.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 26, 2013, 01:30:27 am
By recoil I mean when his weapon hits my weapon or shield it just kind of sticks. where as if I hit a shield or another weapon my weapon IMMEDIATELY AFTER CONTACT bounces slightly backwards and no actions are able to be taken place during that time. 
Quote from: Gurnisson on April 26, 2013, 12:52:09 am
If you think he's a spammer you need to move with your swings, start quite fast after he hits the shield (listen to the sound of him hiting it. Don't get fooled by hold + wiggles), and keep your camera so that your swings will hit him quite early in the animation.
Quote from: Vieuxcrotter on April 26, 2013, 12:47:47 am
Its all in the footwork and proper timing. If you see a 2 handers trying to feint like a mofo dont respect is feints too much.
Quote from: Dooz on April 25, 2013, 11:56:42 pm
Sounds like what you're referring to is probably the way a player swings. Depending on how one moves with the swing, before during and after, it might give the impression of "recoiling" or not. Swing and pull back? Recoil. Swing and keep moving in the same direction with another swing or something, doesn't look like a recoil it's more of one smooth motion. I'm not so sure there's actually a game mechanic that deals with recoiling as such, but who knows. Not I.
Thanks. I know for a fact my footwork kinda sucks at times and I shall try the listening things as well.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Tears of Destiny on April 26, 2013, 01:32:24 am
It all has to do with weapon weight comparisons, and two handers weigh much more then one handers, for weapon stun.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 26, 2013, 01:38:43 am
Quote from: Tears of Destiny on April 26, 2013, 01:32:24 am
It all has to do with weapon weight comparisons, and two handers weigh much more then one handers, for weapon stun.
so if a 3.5 weapon hits a 1.0 weapon then chances are the stun wont occur?
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: zagibu on April 26, 2013, 01:44:13 am
Quote from: betard_lulz on April 26, 2013, 01:38:43 am
so if a 3.5 weapon hits a 1.0 weapon then chances are the stun wont occur?

When you block a heavy weapon with a light weapon, you will probably be stunned, unable to attack for a short moment. When you block a light weapon with a heavy weapon, you won't be stunned, and can immediately attack back, forcing the other guy to block.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 26, 2013, 01:47:19 am
Quote from: zagibu on April 26, 2013, 01:44:13 am
When you block a heavy weapon with a light weapon, you will probably be stunned, unable to attack for a short moment. When you block a light weapon with a heavy weapon, you won't be stunned, and can immediately attack back, forcing the other guy to block.
ok cool thanks for that. Now perhaps you can help me define this recoil I talk about: from the ATTACKERS side...if my light weapon is blocked by a heavy weapon then i tend to notice my weapon "springs" backward just a bit after the attack. What would you call that?

ALSO when my light weapon/shield blocks a heavy weapon the weapon just kind of sticks to my shield/ does not spring back.

Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: zagibu on April 26, 2013, 02:20:51 am
I think that's just animation difference between 1h and 2h, but I'm not 100% certain.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 26, 2013, 02:21:51 am
ok well thanks all for the help itt.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: dreadnok on April 26, 2013, 02:47:31 am
Quote from: Tears of Destiny on April 26, 2013, 01:32:24 am
It all has to do with weapon weight comparisons, and two handers weigh much more then one handers, for weapon stun.


Wrong. I get stunned by longswords with a mighty iron war axe. The games mechanics  are askew. The muadao is atrocious for catching the swing the air and swinging non stop off a shield.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: JihadistMexican on April 26, 2013, 03:02:00 am
hold
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: betard_lulz on April 26, 2013, 03:10:42 am
[H]old?
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Mala on April 26, 2013, 03:58:13 am
Quote from: Tears of Destiny on April 26, 2013, 01:32:24 am
It all has to do with weapon weight comparisons, and two handers weigh much more then one handers, for weapon stun.
But all  my shields weight more that the most of the 2h weapons. Looks like that the stun system is broken. :P 
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Jarold on April 26, 2013, 05:00:15 am
Simple, go 2h hero!
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Tibe on April 26, 2013, 07:49:41 am
Everybody has their own way. I personally just put my shield on my back and used my 1h blade for leftswingleftswingleftswing. Worked suprisingly well. 1h without shield is assloads better than shielding.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on April 26, 2013, 09:16:50 am
Left swing and circle like a fucking shark.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Rhekimos on April 26, 2013, 09:53:51 am
The best way to learn how to counter a class/tactic is trying to use it yourself and taking notice of how you were countered. No other method is as illuminating.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 10:14:28 am
Back in medieval times, only best knights deserve 2H sword - true elite  :mrgreen:

So if you have 100 knights. maybe 5 of them deserve 2H sword (those who were close to the king or something). Why? Because it is expensive sword to make and you need extra training lesions for it.
It is long and perfectly balanced deadly medieval weapon, and you can do so much more things than with 1h sword, polearm, spears and so and so.
Simply it is the best medieval weapon you can get.

Never understand why so much crying here about best medieval weapon. Status of 2H swords is nerfed right now. They can make much more damage and they are much more longer in real life than in cRPG.
All others weapons in cRPG are buffed so they can be equal to 2H swords.
For example: IRL if you go with spear on 2H sword, knight will easy cut wooden spear in peaces and kill you. But, this is a game .... yea right. Just stop QQ about 2H swords.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Rebelyell on April 26, 2013, 11:06:43 am
-_-
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: [ptx] on April 26, 2013, 11:08:30 am
Quote from: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 10:14:28 am
Back in medieval times, only best knights deserve 2H sword - true elite  :mrgreen:
So, you wouldn't have a 2h sword if this game were more realistic?
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Ronin on April 26, 2013, 11:11:21 am
Quote from: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 10:14:28 am
Back in medieval times, only best knights deserve 2H sword - true elite  :mrgreen:

So if you have 100 knights. maybe 5 of them deserve 2H sword (those who were close to the king or something). Why? Because it is expensive sword to make and you need extra training lesions for it.
It is long and perfectly balanced deadly medieval weapon, and you can do so much more things than with 1h sword, polearm, spears and so and so.
Simply it is the best medieval weapon you can get.

Never understand why so much crying here about best medieval weapon. Status of 2H swords is nerfed right now. They can make much more damage and they are much more longer in real life than in cRPG.
All others weapons in cRPG are buffed so they can be equal to 2H swords.
For example: IRL if you go with spear on 2H sword, knight will easy cut wooden spear in peaces and kill you. But, this is a game .... yea right. Just stop QQ about 2H swords.
In cRPG 30 of 100 players are using 2h swords. So they shouldn't be too overpowered. Besides, I do not agree with the part where greatswords are the strongest weapons melee weapons. A greatsword is basically very heavy and long, it has it's obvious weaknesses. In cRPG and Warband too bad we don't have a stamina system.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Tibe on April 26, 2013, 12:01:49 pm
Quote from: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 10:14:28 am
(click to show/hide)
Whats there really to understand? Like you said it is the best medieval weapon. And when it is the best medieval weapon in the medieval game, than whats the fucking point of playing with anything else besides the best medieval weapon? And that is why it is nerfed to a equal playin level with other weapons. So there is a point of using something else besides 2h. Was that really so hard to figure out by yourself? :rolleyes:
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on April 26, 2013, 12:10:39 pm
Quote from: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 10:14:28 am
For example: IRL if you go with spear on 2H sword, knight will easy cut wooden spear in peaces and kill you. But, this is a game .... yea right. Just stop QQ about 2H swords.
Wow, I knew you were an idiot, but, damn... that was a bit... more than expected...
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 12:37:46 pm
Quote from: Zlisch_The_Butcher on April 26, 2013, 12:10:39 pm
Wow, I knew you were an idiot, but, damn... that was a bit... more than expected...

Read the full post and do not just pull things out of context.

This part refers to the balance of the game. But I guess you're just too stupid to get it all.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on April 26, 2013, 12:42:39 pm
Quote from: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 12:37:46 pm
Read the full post and do not just pull things out of context.

This part refers to the balance of the game. But I guess you're just too stupid to get it all.
My very point was that even your fucking real life example was complete bullshit. But I guess you're just too stupid to get it all.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Berserkadin on April 26, 2013, 12:48:20 pm
But really Sagar, 2h wasnt the "best" weapon in medieval times. That's just a fucking retarded and uneducated statement. I guess you knew this from watching medieval action movies?
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Grumpy_Nic on April 26, 2013, 12:48:58 pm
you need to find the weakness of a 2hander. He got no shield. Shoot him.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Tibe on April 26, 2013, 12:56:41 pm
Quote from: Berserkadin on April 26, 2013, 12:48:20 pm
But really Sagar, 2h wasnt the "best" weapon in medieval times. That's just a fucking retarded and uneducated statement. I guess you knew this from watching medieval action movies?
Fucking Mel Gibson movies. :lol:
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: NJ_Legion_Icedtea on April 26, 2013, 01:17:18 pm
My suggestion would be to find yourself a ranged friend and stick with him shielding them until they shoot dead the 2h. 2h are good but only in melee, never forget that a shield is to block so keep blocking till help comes :D
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Sagar on April 26, 2013, 01:21:14 pm
Mel Gibson told me that  :wink:

Needs to think outside the box. Medieval knight - if he was a skilled 2H swordsman, he also always carry a shield and 1H weapon.

It's hard to argue with someone who knows so little about medieval life, weapons and warfare. Much of this can be found in the books, and if you have the opportunity to type into a Medieval Swordsmanship Club - in practice, many things will be clearer.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: _GTX_ on April 26, 2013, 01:24:40 pm
LEFT STRIKES ALL THE WAY, that is all.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Teeth on April 26, 2013, 01:30:57 pm
Quote from: betard_lulz on April 25, 2013, 11:19:53 pm
anyone have any suggestions on how to fight a 2h person?
Go on the forum and lobby.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Tibe on April 26, 2013, 01:37:06 pm
I bitched slightly about 2h being OP back in the day. My main concern was the stupid lolstab, which is sorta fixed now. Now ive played a good ammount with polearms, 1hs, 2hs and I kinda feel that they all seem rather balanced. After that one big patch not so long ago that buffed 1h I must say im having lots of fun with everything.
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Macropus on April 26, 2013, 01:57:58 pm
Yeah everything is pretty balanced now.

Except fucking OP str-whores!
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: Ronin on April 26, 2013, 02:18:07 pm
Quote from: Macropus on April 26, 2013, 01:57:58 pm
Yeah everything is pretty balanced now.

Except fucking OP str-whores!

Except fucking OP agi-whores!
Title: Re: How to deal with 2h?
Post by: zagibu on April 26, 2013, 03:46:43 pm
I just wanted to say that 2h swords in real life are not heavy at all. They rarely exceed 2.5 kg, and some are even lighter than 2 kg. In cRPG, they are too heavy. You have to subtract at least 0.5 kg from most of them to get realistic weight.

And the thing about them being the best weapons...that really depends on the situation. They are versatile, that's true, but in very tight melee situations, they are worse than sword and board, and in formations, polearms are obviously better. In cRPG, though, we don't have formations, and we have hiltslash, so those two situations don't really apply. We also have unbreakable polearms and 1h swords that can hurt through plate armor, so comparing cRPG with reality is not really helpful.