cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Game Balance Discussion => Topic started by: Alexander_TheGreat_ on January 20, 2013, 04:24:04 pm

Title: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Alexander_TheGreat_ on January 20, 2013, 04:24:04 pm
How can you make yourself nerf heavy lances?

how logical is it? not at all
how realistic is it? not at all
how stupid is it? FUCKING YES!

The heavy lance is weaker than all the polearms on horse...why? how?
the heavy lance is weaker than the light and normal lance. The normal lance is now the far best lance. 

NERF NERF NERF NERF NEFT, KEEP NERFING STUFF.
soon we will be fighting with plastic weapons and we will be hitting real armors with plastic weapons.

Even an archer can surive 3 stabs from a heavy lance with 6 PS and full speed, fucking ridiculous. Jesus motherfucking christ.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on January 20, 2013, 04:25:26 pm
he mad
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Smoothrich on January 20, 2013, 04:31:13 pm
I agree with you.  Light and Regular Lance need to be nerfed just as much as the Heavy Lance was, if not more.  Hopefully this thread will help bring it to the balance team's attention.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: BlueKnight on January 20, 2013, 04:44:20 pm
Your reaction after the nerf is so quick that it made me speechless.

Nah but really, couching is the way to go. You may also loom normal lance but if they nerfed heavy lance so much, don't you think they will nerf normal lance after people start using it? Normal lance has 5 more pierce damage... ridiculous.

I am also 1 of these 7ps heavy glancers and I know your pain bro.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Moncho on January 20, 2013, 04:49:05 pm


<------------
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Arrowblood on January 20, 2013, 04:58:44 pm
While we talk about nerfs and buffs:

In the following picture you see a 15 STR no IF char with a +3 white transit.
A masterwork arrow penetrated his stomach.
Look down in the right corner of the screen.
Then start crying tears of joy.
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Panos on January 20, 2013, 05:00:15 pm
you are not welcome in here...archer  :twisted:
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on January 20, 2013, 05:00:53 pm
Arrowblood, either he since then healed at that spot, or the pic was shopped, that there is impossible.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Haboe on January 20, 2013, 05:01:59 pm
Learn to aim for the head...

Bunny's raging because they no longer 1 hit ppl as well as being the fastest units on the map..
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Angellore on January 20, 2013, 05:05:41 pm
The only logical solution in cRPG is to play 2h hero and enjoy all the buffs while laughing from all other classes nerfs.
Last "balance" patch buffed almost all 2h swords damage or speed (like it was too low before) and gave all 2h axes much more damage.
After that patch all 2h axes got buffed by +3 damage. Yes, PLUS 3 damage. So eg. Great Axe +3 now has 49 cut damage, it's more powerful than polearm axes now.
Balance team either play 2h class or not play this game at all, which is just a shame :(.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Arrowblood on January 20, 2013, 05:07:34 pm
Arrowblood, either he since then healed at that spot, or the pic was shopped, that there is impossible.
No it is true. But I cant remember what kind of  bow it was shot from.
(click to show/hide)

Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Panos on January 20, 2013, 05:08:04 pm
The only logical solution in cRPG is to play 2h hero and enjoy all the buffs while laughing from all other classes nerfs.
Last "balance" patch buffed almost all 2h swords damage or speed (like it was too low before) and gave all 2h axes much more damage.
After that patch all 2h axes got buffed by +3 damage. Yes, PLUS 3 damage. So eg. Great Axe +3 now has 49 cut damage, it's more powerful than polearm axes now.
Balance team either play 2h class or not play this game at all, which is just a shame :(.

When I yell that 2h class needs a nerf people say that I whinne.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Angellore on January 20, 2013, 05:16:25 pm
When I yell that 2h class needs a nerf people say that I whinne.
Look at your avatar, then look at mine. Do you see the difference between us now? :D
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 05:32:11 pm
Lancers are the biggest pussies this mod has ever seen. Some even retired their level 35 chars because of this. Grow up, kids.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: jtobiasm on January 20, 2013, 05:38:30 pm
B-U-F-F   A-R-C-H-E-R-S

p.s yoro phase
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 05:39:33 pm

After that patch all 2h axes got buffed by +3 damage. Yes, PLUS 3 damage. So eg. Great Axe +3 now has 49 cut damage, it's more powerful than polearm axes now.

And unbalanced.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Duc_OLIVIERO_loliv on January 20, 2013, 05:45:19 pm
why I change mine against the lance  :twisted:
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Kafein on January 20, 2013, 06:11:41 pm
Lancers are the biggest pussies this mod has ever seen. Some even retired their level 35 chars because of this. Grow up, kids.

Losing 20% (if not more, I don't remember) damage over one year with no buff whatsoever, no class ever took that like a man. I did not happen to any other (except archers during one day) either.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: sF_Guardian on January 20, 2013, 06:19:11 pm
Losing 20% (if not more, I don't remember) damage over one year with no buff whatsoever, no class ever took that like a man. I did not happen to any other (except archers during one day) either.

There really needed to be done something about lancers.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 06:22:52 pm
Losing 20% (if not more, I don't remember) damage over one year with no buff whatsoever, no class ever took that like a man. I did not happen to any other (except archers during one day) either.

Well I would just try playing something else, it's not like I'm born to play 2H... I just play it atm because I haven't acquired everything I need for my main. Only thing I wouldn't play anymore is ranged, but that leaves me with 7 different classes which isn't too bad (shielder, swashbuckler, 2H, 2H cav, lancer, 1H cav, polearms).

Problem is they want to pwn and if they can't pwn they leave the game.

Btw. 10 minutes ago Deserters owned server thanks to having 5 or 6 lancers. Truly UP class...
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Lemmy_Winks on January 20, 2013, 06:24:47 pm
Just get a great lance and couch people, its inexpensive and you basically always one shot people no matter what. Its pretty fun.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 06:26:30 pm
Now Heavy Lance one shots too, they buffed it. I don't hear lancers mentioning that buff, just nerfs.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Shemaforash on January 20, 2013, 06:36:02 pm
A masterwork arrow

This is your problem & solution.

Get bodkins m8????
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Torben on January 20, 2013, 06:51:22 pm
Now Heavy Lance one shots too, they buffed it. I don't hear lancers mentioning that buff, just nerfs.

silly leshma  :rolleyes:

imo couching shoulda stayed nerfed and stabbing should have been buffed. 
either faster stab (shorter window for the bad cav to hit the spot,  better cav vs cav for skilled dudes/ however making them better on foot as well) or a little damage buff to the heavy lance for the poor non loomed players.

but couching,  cheesh -.-


thoughts,  odin?
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Konrax on January 20, 2013, 06:55:10 pm
Cav has to be one of the easiest classes in the game to play.

Mainly because you can poke stab on horse back, if you had to couch everything then I would say it takes some skill.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 06:56:07 pm
Well I do agree that stabbing should be buffed and couching stay nerfed but they already buffed couching. Now if they buff stabbing, lancer is back to the old values while other classes aren't.

I'm for buffs, but many things need to be buffed alongside lancers, not just heavy lance.

But most of all, I want to see old lance angle back. That was kinda awesome.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Torben on January 20, 2013, 07:05:39 pm
Well I do agree that stabbing should be buffed and couching stay nerfed but they already buffed couching. Now if they buff stabbing, lancer is back to the old values while other classes aren't.

I'm for buffs, but many things need to be buffed alongside lancers, not just heavy lance.

nah imo the heavy lance nerf made the other lances a good choice,  a nerf was called for.  however nerfing the most expensive lance  to make it less effective then the lance in everything but frontal outreaching game of great lances and maybe twohanders is to big of a deal. 
they are so slow that you have to trigger your release at a point that gives a huge timeframe for the situation to change. 
I would love to see the heavy lance at its current state but with at least 80,  preferably 84 speed.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Alexander_TheGreat_ on January 20, 2013, 07:10:11 pm
nah imo the heavy lance nerf made the other lances a good choice,  a nerf was called for.  however nerfing the most expensive lance  to make it less effective then the lance in everything but frontal outreaching game of great lances and maybe twohanders is to big of a deal. 
they are so slow that you have to trigger your release at a point that gives a huge timeframe for the situation to change. 
I would love to see the heavy lance at its current state but with at least 80,  preferably 84 speed.

What was the stats on the old heavy lance?
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: BlueKnight on January 20, 2013, 07:13:31 pm
Now Heavy Lance one shots too, they buffed it. I don't hear lancers mentioning that buff, just nerfs.
1hitting is only when perfect conditions are combined together (for your knowledge). My op 2h character survived couch from heavy lance like a baws. A lot depends on the moving speed of the person that is hit. Some crossbowman who was running away survived my couch(15 str and light-medium armour) and for example some heavy guys die from 1 hit. I don't know if they were wounded already or something but what I know is that their movement speed decides wheather it is 1 or 2 hits
What was the stats on the old heavy lance?
it had 29 pierce at MW and 2 patches ago it had like 32 pierce at MW! like 1 year ago...
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 07:14:35 pm
Your alt has 65 armor, mine has 42-48 and it's get one hit every time.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Prpavi on January 20, 2013, 07:19:45 pm
Guess you gonna have to find a new OP bullshit class to abooz Phase.

1h left swing agi seems populat nao, might wanna try that.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Torben on January 20, 2013, 07:21:49 pm
well yes,  the heavy lance comes from being quite a monster.  cant tell you the speeds though,  have been changed quite a bit,  first big speed nerf was down to about 68,  was reverted quite fast though...
 
anyhow,  imo weapons should not limit spontaneous reactions to changing situations as much as the slow heavy lance does it now.  horses are too weak to withstand the weakness of the heavy lance, hm hm hm.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: BlueKnight on January 20, 2013, 07:22:36 pm
But most of all, I want to see old lance angle back. That was kinda awesome.
This lance angle is retarded but old one was even more retarded lol... I guess lance angle should be dependant on your current speed. I guess the reason was that stabing 90 degrees aside at full speed was non-realistic and OP but what stops you from stabing on your left when you are standing still. Too brain-involving to turn a little? Same stabbing to the right.

I would make damage of basic heavy lance 25 pierce and increase speed to 80 and nerf couch to 2/3 of current value.

Your alt has 65 armor, mine has 42-48 and it's get one hit every time.
It is main, has 61 b armour ^^
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 07:24:00 pm
It was fun. That's what matters to me. Never picked lancer for longer than an hour after lance angle nerf.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Prpavi on January 20, 2013, 07:24:47 pm
This lance angle is retarded but old one was even more retarded lol... I guess lance angle should be dependant on your current speed. I guess the reason was that stabing 90 degrees aside at full speed was non-realistic and OP but what stops you from stabing on your left when you are standing still. Too brain-involving to turn a little? Same stabbing to the right.

I would make damage of basic heavy lance 25 pierce and increase speed to 80 and nerf couch to 2/3 of current value.


But you play the game so your opinion doesn't count.

Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Brrrak on January 20, 2013, 07:27:00 pm
Every time I survive a heavy lance couch with 5 IF in Corrazina, I laugh maniacally.  I also die a little inside, but that's okay.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Torben on January 20, 2013, 07:30:48 pm
I prefer the old status quo

mate,  their is no such thing as old status quo : )


yes,  I am all for having the old lance angle.  and now that the heavy lance doesnt do damage anymore,  they might as well put it into a patch and see how it works : )


btw i think i would suck horribly using it now,  has been a while o0
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: BlueKnight on January 20, 2013, 07:33:47 pm

yes,  I am all for having the old lance angle.  and now that the heavy lance doesnt do damage anymore,  they might as well put it into a patch and see how it works : )

It would nerf 1h cav so no chance for old lance angle.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Falka on January 20, 2013, 07:34:16 pm
Losing 20% (if not more, I don't remember) damage over one year with no buff whatsoever, no class ever took that like a man. I did not happen to any other (except archers during one day) either.
German Greatsword used to have 38pierce dmg at the beggining. Until last patch had 26 pierce dmg. I hope you can do math  :wink:
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 07:36:53 pm
Same goes for Bec, awlpike hoplites, HA and many other classes and weapons. Hate against lolstabbers is reasonable but no one cries more than lancers and archers. No one.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Torben on January 20, 2013, 07:38:09 pm
true true.  devs stop nerfin the mod  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 07:44:28 pm
Btw. my main is part lancer, part 1H cav, part swashbuckler, part shielder, part polearms and hoplite. That's why alt is 2H, to cover whole melee aspect of the game :D

Lancer buff is a good news for me.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Rebelyell on January 20, 2013, 07:50:30 pm
It would nerf 1h cav so no chance for old lance angle.

1h cav 1hit now most of the time

nerf is needed :twisted:

but old lance wuld be sooo goood
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on January 20, 2013, 07:53:22 pm
Lance angle should be given based on lance reach (only talking lancing, not couching, that'd be an insane nerf to greatlances), it'd make there be a real choice inbetween using the longer and the shorter lances, and it'd be amazingly fun riding around on a plated charger in full plate with a short spear stabbing 360.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Rebelyell on January 20, 2013, 07:56:24 pm
Lance angle should be given based on lance reach (only talking lancing, not couching, that'd be an insane nerf to greatlances), it'd make there be a real choice inbetween using the longer and the shorter lances, and it'd be amazingly fun riding around on a plated charger in full plate with a short spear stabbing 360.

revolution

I am more than sure then they can do  that..... but who knows :/
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Gurnisson on January 20, 2013, 08:31:38 pm
In the old days lancing was by far the easiest way to roflstomp pubs. Nowadays it's one of the harder classes to do so. Played all classes except (dedicated) horse thrower for quite an extensive period.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 20, 2013, 08:35:29 pm
Gurnisson, is your alt Powerpuff girl or something like that?
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: BADPLAYER_old2 on January 20, 2013, 09:54:13 pm
Buff the Heavy Lance damage and nerf horses HP vs melee considerably more (keep it the same for ranged though).

Otherwise keep it as is.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: BlueKnight on January 20, 2013, 11:25:20 pm
German Greatsword used to have 38pierce dmg at the beggining. Until last patch had 26 pierce dmg. I hope you can do math  :wink:
He wrote over one year which means during 1 year which means that german lost less than h. glance
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Oberyn on January 21, 2013, 09:56:08 am
Heavy lance still fine, nerf 2h.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Leshma on January 21, 2013, 12:01:32 pm
Nerf Arabian Warhorse :twisted:
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Panos on January 21, 2013, 12:29:31 pm
Let`s face it,the bad hype behind lancers is because of GK`s and their cunt tactic to spawnrape,so I truly believe that most of you guys have a biased opinion that Lancers are OP in general,they aren`t I can assure you for that.

- Horses die easily with a couple of  hits.

- Every ranged is aiming at you because you are an easy target

- Most 2hander GS can outreach Hlance with their lolstab

- Ranged projectiles deal a lot of damage because of the speed bonus

If you think that lancing is easy I`m willing to lend  you a pony to play for a couple of days and then we can have this conversation again.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Shemaforash on January 21, 2013, 05:50:02 pm
Let`s face it,the bad hype behind lancers is because of GK`s and their cunt tactic to spawnrape,so I truly believe that most of you guys have a biased opinion that Lancers are OP in general,they aren`t I can assure you for that.

- Horses die easily with a couple of  hits.

- Every ranged is aiming at you because you are an easy target

- Most 2hander GS can outreach Hlance with their lolstab

- Ranged projectiles deal a lot of damage because of the speed bonus

If you think that lancing is easy I`m willing to lend  you a pony to play for a couple of days and then we can have this conversation again.

I find cavalry to be relatively easy, the only problem is that I don't find playing it is very much fun when you are completely gimped and incredibly predictable with the lance angle nerf.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Hunter_the_Honourable on January 21, 2013, 07:36:46 pm
Nerf Arabian Warhorse :twisted:

visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: LordBerenger on January 21, 2013, 07:51:48 pm
Buff Arabian Warhorse  :)
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Swaggart on January 21, 2013, 08:15:02 pm
In the old days lancing was by far the easiest way to roflstomp pubs. Nowadays it's one of the harder classes to do so. Played all classes except (dedicated) horse thrower for quite an extensive period.

You're completely right.

It's very hard to pick up a lance, press X and maneuver it into the back of someone who's fighting someone else for an instant kill. Sure, you can pick and choose your engagements, zip across the battlefield, you're only marginally weaker if you're dehorsed when compared to dedicated infantry, and your horse does as much damage as a tractor-trailer, but to compensate, you can miraculously slash someone as they're laying underneath your horse after being bulldozed by it.

I propose that we give cav players a permanent x5 to compensate them for voluntarily playing this ridiculously hard playstyle.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Hunter_the_Honourable on January 21, 2013, 08:16:45 pm
Buff Arabian Warhorse  :)

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(joking I love you really <3 )
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: LordBerenger on January 21, 2013, 09:29:17 pm
visitors can't see pics , please register or login


(joking I love you really <3 )

<3
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on January 21, 2013, 09:32:30 pm
Heavy lances are supposed to deal damage.  Why they are so weak is beyond me.  Even with +3 heavy lances in strategus battles I have to 3 shot archers in tattered rags of clothes (granted I'm on a +3 destrier or +3 rouncey and only 6 PS) but still it's waaaaaaay too low for the fact you're riding on a horse and thrusting a large lance into their bodies. 

It's a no brainer to use a regular lance over a heavy lance.  Hell I started using a non-loomed lance over my +3 heavy lance until I could sell it for a +3 lance. 

If they nerf the lance and light lance as bad as they did the heavy lance, they will have effectively killed off the cavalry lance stab class of weapons.  There'd be no reason to not use a great lance at that point. 
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Kampfkarotte on February 21, 2013, 11:33:19 pm
sad fact is: lance cav is nerfed to death. i stop being lance cav and go 1h till they will buff lance again
ITS UNREALISTIC THAT AN ARCHER WITH NO HEAD ARMOR DOESNT DIE WHEN I HIT HIM IN THE HEAD WITH FULL SPEED ON CHAMPION COURSER :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Rebelyell on February 22, 2013, 12:08:33 am
compare to lancer 1h cav is uber OP
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Torben on February 22, 2013, 12:44:07 am
compare to lancer 1h cav is uber OP

well it depends a bit on how you use it.  not rly OP,  just that its easier for new players to rock with 1h cav then before. 

i agree,  heavy lance could use a tweek,  but lancer cav is not at all too weak.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: LordLargos on February 23, 2013, 06:23:21 am
The truth is everything gets nerfed to shit except 2h, it's not fair but it is the way of c-rpg.
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Rebelyell on February 23, 2013, 07:19:07 am
well it depends a bit on how you use it.  not rly OP,  just that its easier for new players to rock with 1h cav then before. 

i agree,  heavy lance could use a tweek,  but lancer cav is not at all too weak.
like 1h cav can 1 hit almost evryone when h lance needs 2 hits to naked archer head, balance is broken
Title: Re: nerfed heavy lance (Rage post)
Post by: Felix_Iron on February 24, 2013, 07:21:41 pm
Three or four month ago balance was pretty good. Now agility inf and str archers kick all asses  :cry: