cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Formless on August 24, 2012, 05:11:21 am
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Hey Guys,
I don't know about you but this is annoying. As most of you guys know, the way the combat mechanics work in this game is by turns. My turn, your turn and so on and so forth. What I found is that when I am fighting 2 hand agility guys with my 1 hand. the delay on the right hand swing breaks that mechanic. Standing infront of me a 2 hander agility guy can do this:
2 hand swings, I block, I go to return the attack with the right swing and the 2 hand has enough time before my swing releases to attack me again.
In this way he can use his attack turn and then attack me again during my attack turn :shock:. This clearly breaks the combat mechanics of the game, not to mention its a hudge advantage to 2 handers.
This puts the 1 hander at a big disadvantage, currently the stab on 1 hander is mostly unusable the overhead misses about 60% of the time, therefore the only reliable attack the 1 hander has left against an agility 2 hander is the left swing. Easily predictable and rather short range.
Knowing that a good 2 hander will simply fight just on his outer reach of his sword and retreat just enough after his attack phase to escape any counter from the left swing. So the 1 hander has the hard choice of:
1.) Chasing the opponent (bad idead cause with high agility and a long weapon the 2 hand has the initiative and advantage in the movement game)
2.) Keep blocking and hope a teammate shows up and helps you out.
3.) Keep the fight going long enough to move it to a tighter space (many times not available)
Can we please give the 1 hander more tools in the tool box, because currently 3 of his 4 tools are unreliable.
Cheers,
Formless.
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Hey Guys,
I don't know about you but this is annoying. As most of you guys know, the way the combat mechanics work in this game is by turns. My turn, your turn and so on and so forth. What I found is that when I am fighting 2 hand agility guys with my 1 hand. the delay on the right hand swing breaks that mechanic. Standing infront of me a 2 hander agility guy can do this:
2 hand swings, I block, I go to return the attack with the right swing and the 2 hand has enough time before my swing releases to attack me again.
In this way he can use his attack turn and then attack me again during my attack turn :shock:. This clearly breaks the combat mechanics of the game, not to mention its a hudge advantage to 2 handers.
This puts the 1 hander at a big disadvantage, currently the stab on 1 hander is mostly unusable the overhead misses about 60% of the time, therefore the only reliable attack the 1 hander has left against an agility 2 hander is the left swing. Easily predictable and rather short range.
Knowing that a good 2 hander will simply fight just on his outer reach of his sword and retreat just enough after his attack phase to escape any counter from the left swing. So the 1 hander has the hard choice of:
1.) Chasing the opponent (bad idead cause with high agility and a long weapon the 2 hand has the initiative and advantage in the movement game)
2.) Keep blocking and hope a teammate shows up and helps you out.
3.) Keep the fight going long enough to move it to a tighter space (many times not available)
Can we please give the 1 hander more tools in the tool box, because currently 3 of his 4 tools are unreliable.
Cheers,
Formless.
Don't know about you but all of the best 1Hers I fight use their right swing very effectively as a distance closer. It's so deceptively long that I will oftentimes get hit when I think I'm out of reach. This applies for everything from the steel pick to the knightly arming sword.
Also the 1H overhead is super good; it's horizontal tolerance might be bad but it's really hard to see. You probably don't notice since you don't fight other 1Hers that you have to manual block all the time, but you notice when you're a 2H or polearm user.
I will give you that the 1H thrust is kinda crappy, but just channel your inner Saul or BobtheHero and stab the living shit out of everything.
So either I'm bad or you're not using your tools to their best extent.
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1h right swing is amazing. I use it up close a lot of the time but also for outranging and I don't get spammed by agi 2hs. Please don't change it, I love it too much :(
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Hi there
I did a new and more accurate test and actually recorded the main part of it and posted that on youtube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntqFkHWdItk
As you should know the weapon reaches of 2 handed, 1 handed and polearms are quite a bit different depending on type and direction.
The shortest of them all is the polearm stab.
Here are numbers you can add to reaches of weapons to equalize all of the weapons and their attack directions.
Polearms :
+0 Stab
+15 Overhead
+23 Right
+15 Left
+30 If you stab while mounted or holding a shield
2 handed :
+65 Stab
+45 Overhead
+30 Right
+30 Left
1 handed :
+40 Stab
+30 Overhead
+40 Right
+15 Left
Arkonor
http://forum.meleegaming.com/guides/weapon-reaches-explained-(video)/msg363312/#msg363312
his video is long but informative i recommend it
right hand swing is by far the most effective tool in 1h arsenal i can easily out reach many enemy's with it if i use correct footwork(spinning left while attacking)
i would not recommend using it close up though see how it has such a long reach it glances at close range sometimes(unless huge spin added)
do you turn into your attacks?
i do admit a 1h stab isnt as easy as it was b4 the turn nerf but its still effective with a left spin to it
now OVERHEAD is very hard for me atleast to pull of but i can get it done out of the 4 it should be fixed the other three are fine
left attack is superb in close range combat NEVER use it when they have distance on u it will get you killed
now im going to go overhead alot and see how it is i hardly ever use it nowadays i kind of abandoned it
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Ya got those who feel that something is wrong with something wrong with it, then you have those who like something how it is and prefer not to change it, then you have a third group who pretty much say "You are bad at it."
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Ya got those who feel that something is wrong with something wrong with it, then you have those who like something how it is and prefer not to change it, then you have a third group who pretty much say "You are bad at it."
you essentially just explained every thread ever......
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It's a useful tool, I wouldn't change it.
Since overhead was retardedly nerfed, which was kind of the middle attack I used to mix up left swing before, I have been using right swing a lot more and it's really good when you move properly.
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its already too fast. needs to be nerfed.
thanks for bringing it up,
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Only problem I have with 1h is I regularly glance stabs on peasant armor archers who are standing still facing another direction. I've also glanced a few overheads on unarmored heads. No idea whats up with it.
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lolwat
The right swing is bordering on OP, probably the one animation that makes it worth to use 1h against longer 2h and pole arms.
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It's slow and it glances, but it's the one swing where you can do a ton of neat little tricks with it for 1h. The animation itself also has this odd ghost reach that can't be explained.
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No. If you are skilled enough, you can do 3-4 attacks on your opponent before he even gets a chance to fight back.
Be it by footwork, kicking, chamber blocking, etc.
1h spammers could land one hit on me and others follow in so short order that I cannot rise successful block (using slow long bardiche).
Weapons with over 100 speed are nasty specially with very high wpf.
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Don't know about you but all of the best 1Hers I fight use their right swing very effectively as a distance closer. It's so deceptively long that I will oftentimes get hit when I think I'm out of reach. This applies for everything from the steel pick to the knightly arming sword.
Also the 1H overhead is super good; it's horizontal tolerance might be bad but it's really hard to see. You probably don't notice since you don't fight other 1Hers that you have to manual block all the time, but you notice when you're a 2H or polearm user.
I will give you that the 1H thrust is kinda crappy, but just channel your inner Saul or BobtheHero and stab the living shit out of everything.
So either I'm bad or you're not using your tools to their best extent.
[/quote
1H overhead suck dick. Plain and simple. Gets me killed constantly. Overhead right thru the asshole to just get side swung. It looks like a direct hit so. Your not expecting the miss. And what your saying about right swing is awesome because of ghost reach is horseshit as well. Every weapon has ghost reach. It shouldnt bounce when its a direct hit. Im gen gen 24 with only 1h and tried every possible type of 1h. Those 2 swings get you killed more than not.
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It's slow and it glances, but it's the one swing where you can do a ton of neat little tricks with it for 1h. The animation itself also has this odd ghost reach that can't be explained.
Whats so hard to explain? Every godamn weapon has ghost range. The worst is great maul over heads
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Yeah,there are some 35 lvl 2h rus scale danish gs spammers out there that are very hard to kill and they spam and have good footwork so your best bet is to raise shield and withraw from fight if you feel you are slower and don't have chance.
Only attack them when you are in grop or have teammates arround.
It is a bit my old friendgish,but that is why you have shield. 2h,pole builds are much superior to your shield build,so play as support.
Also avoid playing in siedge.
What is your build and main weapon?
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Whats so hard to explain? Every godamn weapon has ghost range. The worst is great maul over heads
it is problem with your connection,not engine problem. cmp explained this once.
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I personally SPAM people with right swing, just move left of them.
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What???? There's one direction of 1h that people can actually notice and fight against???? Buff 1h right direction!
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It's slow and it glances, but it's the one swing where you can do a ton of neat little tricks with it for 1h. The animation itself also has this odd ghost reach that can't be explained.
It's got kind of a "hook" animation. It will glance during the extension part of the swing (unlike left swing), but once the weapon turns in, it will connect.
Once you learn its sweet spots, and how to move properly with it to both speed it up and get the sweet spot more exposure, you have diminished the weaknesses of it significantly.
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Just dont use it up close, you get the most of it at maximum range while moving into your swing.
Think of it like you have a bat in your hand and try to hit a ball, the sweetspot is well into the swing, so the ball will go far.
If you are close and hit early in animation it will glance
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Hey Guys,
I don't know about you but this is annoying. As most of you guys know, the way the combat mechanics work in this game is by turns. My turn, your turn and so on and so forth. What I found is that when I am fighting 2 hand agility guys with my 1 hand. the delay on the right hand swing breaks that mechanic. Standing infront of me a 2 hander agility guy can do this:
2 hand swings, I block, I go to return the attack with the right swing and the 2 hand has enough time before my swing releases to attack me again.
In this way he can use his attack turn and then attack me again during my attack turn :shock:. This clearly breaks the combat mechanics of the game, not to mention its a hudge advantage to 2 handers.
This puts the 1 hander at a big disadvantage, currently the stab on 1 hander is mostly unusable the overhead misses about 60% of the time, therefore the only reliable attack the 1 hander has left against an agility 2 hander is the left swing. Easily predictable and rather short range.
Knowing that a good 2 hander will simply fight just on his outer reach of his sword and retreat just enough after his attack phase to escape any counter from the left swing. So the 1 hander has the hard choice of:
1.) Chasing the opponent (bad idead cause with high agility and a long weapon the 2 hand has the initiative and advantage in the movement game)
2.) Keep blocking and hope a teammate shows up and helps you out.
3.) Keep the fight going long enough to move it to a tighter space (many times not available)
Can we please give the 1 hander more tools in the tool box, because currently 3 of his 4 tools are unreliable.
Cheers,
Formless.
Turns exist, but under the right conditions they can be cancelled out, and one party can get in 2 - 3 swings. Doing an overhead, for example, can allow the opponent to strike you twice. So can attacking in the direction from which they are moving away from, AKA castoring, AKA what happened to you. He moves away from your attack and hits you from your other, unprotected side.
I'm a my old friend and I like to quote the OP.