cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Punisher on March 26, 2011, 06:10:46 pm
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All credits for this go to IG_Saint, he came up with the idea in the xbow topic, I like it a lot and think it needs more attention.
So make upkeep cost scale with WPF for weapons. That would be pretty realistic, in that an inexperienced guy doesn't know how to take care of his weapon while a veteran can repair it more efficiently and it would solve the invasion of ranged hybrids without affecting dedicated builds in any way (maybe even slightly buffing them). Also it wouldn't be a nerf, you will be able to use your 1wpf xbow/throwing weapon with no penalty but the higher upkeep would prevent you from doing it all the time.
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This is actually a fantastic idea. +1
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I like the sound of this. It doesn't gimp hybrids by making them less combat effective, but less cost effective, whereas pure builds can afford to equip higher quality equipment to offset their specialization.
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Only problem with the IF is the fact that a lot more people will go for a more strength orientated build in order to lower the cost of their armour and thus increasing the number of tin cans running around. To make my final thoughts on this however i'd need to see stats on how this would be scaled...
I like wpf idea, but I doubt it'll effect hybrids like you think it will...
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+1 but only on weapons not on armor.
I think this might be the solution to the Xbow problem.
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+1 I like this idea!
So, would 100wpf mean the upkeep is the normal 5%, anything higher would reduce costs and lower would increase it?
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+1, as long it only affects weapons. Really good idea.
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Like it!
Implement only on weapons.
Shields may be considered with the shield skill as the cost modifier, but for simplicity sake I would keep it wpf related items (weapons) only.
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+1 I like this idea!
So, would 100wpf mean the upkeep is the normal 5%, anything higher would reduce costs and lower would increase it?
I think 100 wpf is a bit low, since with even only 6 wm you can get 100 wpf in a sideweapon and still have 135 wpf for your main weapon.
120 wpf = 5% upkeep, every 10 less wpf brings an additional +1% upkeep, every 10 more wpf brings -0.5% upkeep.
Just an example, the numbers can be tweaked of course and a linear progression would be ideal, I don't know if it can be implemented though.
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So, lets sum up.
- Wpf should affect weapons repair costs.
For example,
120 wpf = 5% upkeep, every 10 less wpf brings an additional +3%*1 upkeep, every 10 more wpf brings -0,5%* upkeep.
- Shield skill should affect shields repair costs.
For example,
3 shield skill = 5% upkeep, every 1 less brings additional +10%*2, every 1 more brings -0,5%* upkeep.
*1 I think 3% is better, because 1% is not a big change.
*2 I think 10% is better, because 1% is not a big change, and, remember, with 0,1,2 shield skill youre not shieldman, but 2h/polearm with shield, so you can use only worst, CHEAP shields. Pay for them more, coward!
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I totally support this.
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+1
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all my characters and all parts of my split personality strongly agree.
That makes at least
+7
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Um, +1 I guess? Not really much to add to my own idea. The numbers I'll leave to those that are competent to deal with it (I.E. not me).
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+1 On this idea. I wonder if it's even possible to pull this idea off.
But if it is:
The Normal 5% Upkeep cost until 109. Then the upkeep lessens by 1% every 10 WPF.
001 - 109 = 5%
110 - 119 = 4%
120 - 129 = 3%
130 - 139 = 2%
140 - 150 = 1%
150+ = No Upkeep Cost
at 150 WPF I would think everyone should consider that person a dedicated class. (1h, 2h, Polearm, Crossbow)
Archery/Throwing/Shields Should be different:
Because those require skill points. Their upkeep should be based on the skill points put in.
2 PD/PT/Shield = 4% Upkeep Cost
3 PD/PT/Shield = 3%
4 PD/PT/Shield = 2%
5 PD/PT/Shield = 1%
6 PD/PT/Shield = No Upkeep Cost
Unfortunately, this means Pure Strength builds would be at a slight disadvantage. at 31 you need 5 or 6 Weapon Master to hit 150.
And Im basing this off the character planner on the vargas website, so the WPF might be off by 1 or 2 points.
Just my 2 Cents on this topic. Welcome to changes, flames and other misc. stuff.
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+1, however I think it should have a little more upkeep cost or under 100. Maybe 1-50 7% and 51-99 6%?.
Well, if any part of this is implemented, I'd like to say, I'll just be getting richer faster.
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what if i dont like to spend points in wm?
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Great idea! +1
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Let's shit on a str builds more. Srsly we don't have enough problems as is
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What problems could STR builds possibly have? The only one I could think is being spammed oh that was pre-patch chadz fixed that soo what else is there holding you all back?
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Talk to any REAL player that STR builds aren't the godsend everyone seems to think they are
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It really isn't that much of a difference. So an AGI build can afford some better weapons. They really couldn't do that muc with it unless they did a lot of skill converting due to the armor and weapon STR req.
The top tiers requiring 16 STR
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+1 On this idea. I wonder if it's even possible to pull this idea off.
But if it is:
The Normal 5% Upkeep cost until 109. Then the upkeep lessens by 1% every 10 WPF.
001 - 109 = 5%
110 - 119 = 4%
120 - 129 = 3%
130 - 139 = 2%
140 - 150 = 1%
150+ = No Upkeep Cost
at 150 WPF I would think everyone should consider that person a dedicated class. (1h, 2h, Polearm, Crossbow)
Archery/Throwing/Shields Should be different:
Because those require skill points. Their upkeep should be based on the skill points put in.
2 PD/PT/Shield = 4% Upkeep Cost
3 PD/PT/Shield = 3%
4 PD/PT/Shield = 2%
5 PD/PT/Shield = 1%
6 PD/PT/Shield = No Upkeep Cost
Unfortunately, this means Pure Strength builds would be at a slight disadvantage. at 31 you need 5 or 6 Weapon Master to hit 150.
And Im basing this off the character planner on the vargas website, so the WPF might be off by 1 or 2 points.
Just my 2 Cents on this topic. Welcome to changes, flames and other misc. stuff.
And for Cavalry?
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And for Cavalry?
ya what are you ideas for that seeing as how it cost a ton to support those horses and most die easily.
BTW this could be a good idea or bad idea it depends on what is going to happen with the patch. Throwing lances for free....i'll take 4 stacks at power throw 10 sir ty very much. Not really sure people have thought this through. Archers already make tons of money. You just player archer all day. Then when chadz does let you trade money between alts and main eventually you'll start seeing full plate and BS everywhere again.
I don't see the point in talking about this much either b/c I am pretty sure it cannot be done but I do give yall props for thinking of new things.
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It is a terribly bad idea. It would only enable people to run around in plate armors all the time.
Also increasing the upkeep for low leveled would increase the number of useless leechers.
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So we'll have people with the most expensive weapons , heirloomed 3 times , and won't pay much of upkeep ? so why not wear the most expensive armor since we don't have to pay much for our weapons ...
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Talk to any REAL player that STR builds aren't the godsend everyone seems to think they are
Not sayign their a godsend I'm just saying what problems do you possibly have as a STR build...maybe with a 3 agi build problems will occur yeah but so would a 3 STR build (even more so actually)...I'm just saying I don't see STR builds really having that much of a handicap that this suggestion would f them in the a as you seem to be claiming o.o.
There are fake players playing this game?
On topic great idea, however the numbers would have to be tweaked people not having to pay upkeep is dumb but softning the impact is a good start. Of course the upkeep charge will have to be upped to compensate but this is a good nerf to hybrids/STR builds (apparently) that doesn't make them less combat effective and should be implemented!!!
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On topic great idea, however the numbers would have to be tweaked people not having to pay upkeep is dumb but softning the impact is a good start. Of course the upkeep charge will have to be upped to compensate but this is a good nerf to hybrids/STR builds (apparently) that doesn't make them less combat effective and should be implemented!!!
Many people have 800k more like I do I have tons of eq too. This will not change anything for me actually. I used to be heavy agi. Now I don't see the point in heavy AGI. STR goes much further than AGI in so many ways. BTW a 24 STR 15 AGI build you can get 148 in 1 weapon type at lvl 30 and 150 at 31. Yes this might affect people decisions on hybrids a bit (even mine) but a balance for AGI really you think?
To balance AGI you have to buff AGI end of story. You could nurff STR but that is just lame. Or buff what Weapon Master, Atheltics, Shield, Riding, Horse Archery do even if by a small amount. It's one other other but not this.
I do like the fact it gives some love back to pure builds though that's the best thing about this.
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You guys make valid points.
1. Free Throwing Lances does seem a bit scary.
2. Didnt think about Cavalry, mainly focusing on weapons..
Maybe the cost reduction could be different for different weapon types. Although i dont know how this system would work on the 2-H weapons with Polearm Secondary modes...
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....This is not a good idea. If you want cost balancing for specific items then ask for that.
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Ummm... I have a suggestion. Upkeep should be relative to level. the higher your level the better the weapons and armour you can afford should be. I miss tin cans, great helms, armour, horses, flamberges and good weapons.
rage if you like but what is the point of a level 30 with peasant weps.
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rage if you like but what is the point of a level 30 with peasant weps.
Not raging at all just trying to point out some things you might not have thought of. And the point of a lvl 30 with peasants weapons for me is the same point of any game.
FUN
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I think it's a bad idea as well for 3 reasons:
1.Upkeep was implemented for a reason and i don't see why a specialist should be immune to it.
2.People using xbow with 0 wpf or throwing weapon with 3-5PT and 0-120 wpf are very low threat so what is all the fuss about ? the more of them the better.
3.The many flaws already stated behind the idea:
-Big advantage for agi buld
-Low lvl would suffer even more
-The return of mass armor cav
-The return of everybody is a plated knight
-The return of everybody as a sniper xbow
-Rebalancing everything
-Moar work for dev, longer time for strategus to return
Ps: On a different tread somebody posted a test build with o wpf and no skill points spent on anything at lvl 30 yet he achievied 130 kills for 250 death or so, should we nerf 0wpf and 0ps , pd or pt build cuz they can still kill somebody once in a while ?
Isn't that the main concept behind the proposed idea, nerf inefficient builds ?
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Great idea, +1
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I think it's a bad idea as well for 3 reasons:
1.Upkeep was implemented for a reason and i don't see why a specialist should be immune to it.
2.People using xbow with 0 wpf or throwing weapon with 3-5PT and 0-120 wpf are very low threat so what is all the fuss about ? the more of them the better.
3.The many flaws already stated behind the idea:
-Big advantage for agi buld
-Low lvl would suffer even more
-The return of mass armor cav
-The return of everybody is a plated knight
-The return of everybody as a sniper xbow
-Rebalancing everything
-Moar work for dev, longer time for strategus to return
Ps: On a different tread somebody posted a test build with o wpf and no skill points spent on anything at lvl 30 yet he achievied 130 kills for 250 death or so, should we nerf 0wpf and 0ps , pd or pt build cuz they can still kill somebody once in a while ?
Isn't that the main concept behind the proposed idea, nerf inefficient builds ?
1. Immune? 5-10% cost reduction is immune?
2. Lol, I'm using an xbow with 1 wpf, I just spam bolts when at ranged (and get occasional lucky kills and headshots, and that's with crossbow, not sniper crossbow) and when the melee starts to happen I just switch to my polearm and slice thru everyone who thought I had more wpf in xbow than in pole. Very low threat my ass.
3. You obviously missed the part that the cost reduction for high wpf would not go over 10 or 15%.
Effin doublepost D:
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I think that having upkeep relative to WPf is stupid, i mean nothing is wrong with hybrids. But... there is something wrong with the fact that at level 30 or more you can not afford to use a complete weapon set that is any better than what you could afford at level 15. Pre patch you could tell new players and good players apart by there gear but now this is not the case at all.
I suggest that lower levels get a bit less cash higher levels get a bit more. Now this is realistic Professional soldiers were paid more than peasants and had better gear. As a peasant you cannot use top of the line gear anyway so i do not see a problem
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I think that having upkeep relative to WPf is stupid, i mean nothing is wrong with hybrids. But... there is something wrong with the fact that at level 30 or more you can not afford to use a complete weapon set that is any better than what you could afford at level 15. Pre patch you could tell new players and good players apart by there gear but now this is not the case at all.
I suggest that lower levels get a bit less cash higher levels get a bit more. Now this is realistic Professional soldiers were paid more than peasants and had better gear. As a peasant you cannot use top of the line gear anyway so i do not see a problem
You don't find it disturbing that every single chap out there has a pocket xbow these days? (myself included)
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The wpf should only give a very minor (say, up to 15-20%) discount even if you stack it up to 200 wpf. The main effect is to INCREASE the maintenance costs of weapons for which you have low wpf. Not by much, 50% at wpf=1 and 0% at wpf=100 is enough. It is mostly to discourage carrying expensive weapons with very low wpf. DISCOURAGE, not prevent in any way.
Yes, side-xbow and throwing hybrids, I am looking at you!