cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 10, 2012, 07:35:58 am

Title: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 10, 2012, 07:35:58 am
Herro Mr Devs,

I was wondering if you know when/if siege gear will be brought back into the game?

Cheers,
Frank
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Vibe on May 10, 2012, 07:59:01 am
You have it in strat, in every other game mode it's flat out being useless to your team.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 10, 2012, 08:04:35 am
Sure is vibe, thanks for the input!
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: OpenPalm on May 10, 2012, 08:29:31 am
Vibe, if it was useless, they wouldn't have taken them out for being OP.   8-)
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Slamz on May 10, 2012, 09:03:32 am
We need a "Strategus" game mode for normal day-to-day play, that plays somewhat like a regular Strat battle would (1 hour timer, limited tickets, but maybe bring-your-own-gear).


Siege gear in battle and siege (despite the name) is stupid mainly because there's not enough time on the clock.  Ladders in siege breaks most of the maps but isn't, I think, quite the same problem in Strategus (where defenders don't need quite that big of an advantage anyway).


The problem right now is that people enter Strategus battles and have no idea how to properly place ladders or siege equipment because they aren't getting practice at it in daily game play.

So we need a new game mode.  One where it makes sense to allow siege gear.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Vibe on May 10, 2012, 09:09:32 am
Vibe, if it was useless, they wouldn't have taken them out for being OP.   8-)

Yes, it was either abusing it (blocking shit with construction sites and the like) or being useless (building anything in a 2-5 minute siege round is not really contributing to your team), thus removed.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: OpenPalm on May 10, 2012, 09:20:31 am
Blocking things with construction sites has limits put on it by rules.  If people were breaking the rules, then they should have been screenshotted and reported for banning.  Healing tents and forward spawns are very useful.  Weapons racks were also very useful, especially for engineers who relied on them to build everything else. 

You can't seriously tell me that an engineer building any of these things was contributing less than any peasant.  IMO they are contributing much more, and once they have set up an area, they can defend it viciously with their throwing skills + infinite ammo.  The weakness in this comes if you catch them setting up.  Placement of siege weaponry is (was) a very important facet of this class, and one that required knowledge of the map layouts and common defensive/offensive areas. 

I've played on over a dozen different characters, from cav to xbow/2h and everything in between.  Engineering was honestly the most fun that I had of any of the classes.  You don't get as many kills, but you really feel like you're helping the team, especially if the team cooperates.  Unfortunately I never got a chance to play much of it before it got erased from the game.  Still, I hope that weapons racks come back with some kind of c-site limit, and that forward spawns come back with the spawns resetting every round.   8-)
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 10, 2012, 09:33:00 am
Or we could have some maps that work with the siege gear on siege and have the maps actually be tested with the gear and adjusted to work with the gear.

What about much larger maps like some of the Strat town maps but with a 15min timer and flag bang in the middle.

I'm currently working on a map that does this and has break able doors.

I don't see why we can't expect people to bring the siege gear to a siege server, I mean we us to all the time. People always brought ladders.

It's not the equipment its the maps that aren't balanced for the gear. We are better off re-evaluating siege instead of reinventing the wheel IMO.

Yes, it was either abusing it (blocking shit with construction sites and the like) or being useless (building anything in a 2-5 minute siege round is not really contributing to your team), thus removed.

Maybe you should consider "contributing" in anther thread. This topic has already been pummelled, lifeless into the dirty ground else where.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 10, 2012, 05:32:26 pm
I don't think engineering was taken away; however, it was just fixed. 

Thank you devs for fixing engineering!!!!!

Luv u frank
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: RandomDude on May 10, 2012, 06:04:18 pm
As far as I know it wont be making a return any time soon. Just from what I read.

The main reason was that forward bases were working in siege and just making the mode messed up/unbalanced + glitchy and the easiest way to prevent it was to take the weapon rack boxes out I believe.

I dont think ladders will be returning any time soon either.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on May 10, 2012, 06:10:00 pm
As far as I know it wont be making a return any time soon. Just from what I read.

The main reason was that forward bases were working in siege and just making the mode messed up/unbalanced + glitchy and the easiest way to prevent it was to take the weapon rack boxes out I believe.

I dont think ladders will be returning any time soon either.
So, because forward bases are fucked up weapon racks also need to be removed?..
...logic? And if the issue with weapon racks is CS site spam then take a pic and make a fucking banthread.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 10, 2012, 06:18:11 pm
So, because forward bases are fucked up weapon racks also need to be removed?..
...logic? And if the issue with weapon racks is CS site spam then take a pic and make a fucking banthread.

Read what he says.  Forward bases were being exploited *Thank KUTT for that one (I added the thank KUTT part)* and the Easiest way to fix it was removing the weapon rack.  Engineers have finally been fixed. 
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Herkkutatti on May 10, 2012, 06:19:40 pm
Quote
I dont think ladders will be returning any time soon either.
This is just stupid.... ladders were fucking awesome
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 10, 2012, 06:20:49 pm
This is just stupid.... ladders were fucking awesome

There is a thread here in the forums on ladder feedback if you want to participate.  There is even a poll on it and only 8% of all the voters agree that ladders were awesome.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Herkkutatti on May 10, 2012, 06:23:22 pm
There is a thread here in the forums on ladder feedback if you want to participate.  There is even a poll on it and only 8% of all the voters agree that ladders were awesome.
92% doesn't know how to use ladders 8% knows
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on May 10, 2012, 06:27:38 pm
There is a thread here in the forums on ladder feedback if you want to participate.  There is even a poll on it and only 8% of all the voters agree that ladders were awesome.
http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,31306.50.html
Look at that poll.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on May 10, 2012, 06:29:41 pm
Read what he says.  Forward bases were being exploited *Thank KUTT for that one (I added the thank KUTT part)* and the Easiest way to fix it was removing the weapon rack.  Engineers have finally been fixed.
Retard, the easiest way to fix it was removing the forward base... which was also done, yet to see any real reason for the weapon rack removal, and certainly not those of a smug Pony loving shithead sucking his own dick, besides the one issue with teamswitching (a big one though) forward bases were fine anyways.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: TugBoat on May 10, 2012, 08:29:08 pm
In response to "Thank KUTT for that one", I would like to say that it was not being intentionally abused by our guys. We just got back in to siege recently and have been playing it a lot recently, and one of our newer members suggested we start trying siege equipment out, which was something that we had never tried before, and something that I didn't even know was in the game mechanics.

We started setting up forward bases after we would knock down gates or doors or something, so that our team would spawn closer to the progress that we would make. At the start of the next round, we realized that it was spawning us forward, BEYOND the gate which hadn't been knocked down yet. It was not intentional abuse, it was just unfortunately a game mechanic that needs to be fixed.

Forward spawns and other features that are a part of siege equipment would be fine if they could be removed at the end of every round.

I appologize if it seemed to anyone that we were intentionally breaking siege or trying to abuse anything, it really wasn't our intention. We were just laughing and having a good time, and we thought it was amazingly hilarious and stupid that the spawns weren't being removed. Our bad if we made anyone angry or upset over it.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Arathian on May 10, 2012, 08:32:48 pm
as a non-engineer, I am VERY against the removal of siege ladders and siege gear.

Yes, some maps need to be balanced or, heck, like FtT suggested, maybe make a new "strategus-lite" mode if people make enough maps for it.

But removing it removes a beloved aspect of the game.


(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 10, 2012, 08:39:13 pm
Retard, the easiest way to fix it was removing the forward base... which was also done, yet to see any real reason for the weapon rack removal, and certainly not those of a smug Pony loving shithead sucking his own dick, besides the one issue with teamswitching (a big one though) forward bases were fine anyways.

You are so angry for one so pretty and young.  At any rate, I don't think it is nice to call an admin a retard.  Bad form, Bad form.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Arathian on May 10, 2012, 08:42:39 pm
You are so angry for one so pretty and young.  At any rate, I don't think it is nice to call an admin a retard.  Bad form, Bad form.

what's your purpose in this thread except to shit it up?
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on May 10, 2012, 09:26:34 pm
You are so angry for one so pretty and young.  At any rate, I don't think it is nice to call an admin a retard.  Bad form, Bad form.
Last I checked you wasn't no admin, just some power tripping fucking pony loving shithead.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: cmp on May 10, 2012, 09:30:36 pm
It will come back when a dev feels like adjusting it for regular sieges/battles. The problem is none of the current devs seems interested in doing that.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: OpenPalm on May 10, 2012, 10:29:02 pm
Why were the weapons racks removed?  The only answer I've ever gotten was "abuse".  Huh?  What abuse?  It's against the rules to drop c-sites everywhere.  No one was abusing them.  Forward spawns had problems and it was understandable that they were removed.  Weapons racks had nothing wrong with them...
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Andy on May 10, 2012, 11:28:38 pm
Siege gear is good for c-RPG. Seige gear IMPROVES the amount of fun for 99% of players. A game isn't about being totally and completley equal and ballanced 100% of the time. A game is supposed to be about being the most fun for the greatest number of players, and that is siege equipment.
Yes for siege equipment.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Tomas_of_Miles on May 10, 2012, 11:34:23 pm
Is it removed from duel as well? People can no longer practice with stuff... so our skillz are in demand nao! In theory... :P
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on May 10, 2012, 11:35:41 pm
Is it removed from duel as well? People can no longer practice with stuff... so our skillz are in demand nao! In theory... :P
Only weapon racks 'n' forward bases don't work.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Tomas_of_Miles on May 10, 2012, 11:38:25 pm
Well if weapon racks don't work you can't build anything else... without having to die each time like old times
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 10, 2012, 11:39:54 pm
Last I checked you wasn't no admin, just some power tripping fucking pony loving shithead.

lol @ pony loving comment.  My response to you was a quote from admin and you referenced that as retarded.  None of that was my words except the part where I added my little KUTT comment. 

*EDIT*  Actually you said, "Retard *spam spam spam spam*" which wasn't saying what was said to be retarded; instead, the person saying it to be retarded.  Again, I was only quoting what an admin said in response to your selective memory.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Visconti on May 10, 2012, 11:44:06 pm
We need a "Strategus" game mode for normal day-to-day play, that plays somewhat like a regular Strat battle would (1 hour timer, limited tickets, but maybe bring-your-own-gear).


Siege gear in battle and siege (despite the name) is stupid mainly because there's not enough time on the clock.  Ladders in siege breaks most of the maps but isn't, I think, quite the same problem in Strategus (where defenders don't need quite that big of an advantage anyway).


The problem right now is that people enter Strategus battles and have no idea how to properly place ladders or siege equipment because they aren't getting practice at it in daily game play.

So we need a new game mode.  One where it makes sense to allow siege gear.
Yes, this game mode would be amazing! i would love to join a randomly generated strat style siege of a castle, i remember suggesting this somewhere, but i cant seem to find the thread anymore >.<

Also, ladders in siege were never OP or broken imo, thats one of the reasons i started playing cRPG tbh, as well as most of TKoV, i could understand in battle, but in siege they just made the game very interesting
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 10, 2012, 11:51:48 pm
I only remember ladders being used briefly *took a break somewhere and then came back and they were gone*.  I do remember having to be on my toes all the time for ninjas.  I'm all for ladders coming back if we can add fire bombs to destroy them in 1 hit.  That would be super fun.

If there is no option to bring back fire bombs then make it so ladders must be built with 15 building mats or something.  This will stop ladder spam going up everywhere.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 11, 2012, 12:24:53 am
It will come back when a dev feels like adjusting it for regular sieges/battles. The problem is none of the current devs seems interested in doing that.

Oh dear :/

CMP would it be possible to allow weapons racks again?

Also how would one go about helping the dev team to recode the forward spawn? I'm crap at coding but a bunch my friends are game devs and worked for half brick so I can just intimidate my code monkeys into coding.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: polkafranzi on May 11, 2012, 01:19:05 am
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Arathian on May 11, 2012, 01:37:38 am
Oh dear :/

CMP would it be possible to allow weapons racks again?

Also how would one go about helping the dev team to recode the forward spawn? I'm crap at coding but a bunch my friends are game devs and worked for half brick so I can just intimidate my code monkeys into coding.

*sigh*


well, what if someone who knows how to code really wanted to code the weapons back?
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: cmp on May 11, 2012, 01:54:32 am
well, what if someone who knows how to code really wanted to code the weapons back?

The thing is, Warband uses a proprietary language (i.e. it's not used elsewhere), so you can't just pick up the code and change it. A good programmer will learn it fast enough (see Ozin), but there's still the fact that cRPG is closed source and we don't give random people acces to the source. If someone is interested in helping to develop the mod, he should hang out in IRC, show interest, etc...
That said, forward bases are not being brought back; they are meant for longer games like Strategus battles, and they don't really work in round-based battles. I see nothing wrong with restoring the weapon rack, but first it needs to be fully integrated with the upkeep system.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Arathian on May 11, 2012, 01:57:39 am
The thing is, Warband uses a proprietary language (i.e. it's not used elsewhere), so you can't just pick up the code and change it. A good programmer will learn it fast enough (see Ozin), but there's still the fact that cRPG is closed source and we don't give random people acces to the source. If someone is interested in helping to develop the mod, he should hang out in IRC, show interest, etc...
That said, forward bases are not being brought back; they are meant for longer games like Strategus battles, and they don't really work in round-based battles. I see nothing wrong with restoring the weapon rack, but first it needs to be fully integrated with the upkeep system.

yeah, restore weapon rack, fuck forward bases.

I would be ok with that.
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: Rainbow on May 11, 2012, 02:56:12 am
yeah, restore weapon rack, fuck forward bases.

I would be ok with that.

Me too!
Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: FRANK_THE_TANK on May 11, 2012, 05:18:13 am
The thing is, Warband uses a proprietary language (i.e. it's not used elsewhere), so you can't just pick up the code and change it. A good programmer will learn it fast enough (see Ozin), but there's still the fact that cRPG is closed source and we don't give random people acces to the source. If someone is interested in helping to develop the mod, he should hang out in IRC, show interest, etc...
That said, forward bases are not being brought back; they are meant for longer games like Strategus battles, and they don't really work in round-based battles. I see nothing wrong with restoring the weapon rack, but first it needs to be fully integrated with the upkeep system.

What does fully integrated actually mean? Is it currently allowing people to spawn with crap Armour and change into shinny gear or something?

I've always found I get hit for everything I pull out of the box, I even got hit 3 times in one round for the csite (but I've only ever seen that once).

Title: Re: Siege gear: is it coming back?
Post by: bilwit on May 11, 2012, 05:20:54 am
Bring back stacking siege towers. That shit was fucking hilarious.