cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 03:27:55 am

Title: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 03:27:55 am
It's here!  The "Funding" as chadz & the Devs call it, has been implemented!

Once again, I want to say a big "Thank You" to all you who voted and posted in this thread!  Not that this thread got this implemented... it seemed the Devs may have already been chewing on this idea.  But I think it definitely got the ball rolling for them to actually make it happen.  Meaning, the "Funding" option may have been months down the road if not for this thread (and you folks voice here in this thread).

And of course a huge "Thanks" to chadz & the Devs!!!

- Mallets


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Why propose this idea?

It's quite tough for Alts to build up the financial capital that we can with our Mains.  Mains can sell their looms in the Marketplace, ensuring that for several generations (a very freaking long time), that they'll never have to worry about upkeep.  Also, with your main, when trying out items and finding out you don't like them... you can sell them on the Marketplace for about 90% of what you paid for them (only a 10% loss).  With an Alt, you have to sell it back to the shop for a 50% loss.  That can equal a lot of money (I mean a lot of money) for players.  Along with that... Mains can find deals in the Marketplace on items that Alts don't have a chance at.

I'm just saying all this to show the financial challenges that Alts face that Mains simply do not.  Again, I'm not suggesting that Alts get to use the Marketplace.  I just want to Mains be able to give money to Alts... in order to help alleviate their financial woes.  Players work hard to get their Alts to lvl 30... it'd be nice to see them have the same financial stability we have with our Mains.


What's the idea? How would it work?

I propose that Mains be able to give Alts money (gold).  Now this would be only for Mains to give money.  Alts would not be able to give money back to Mains... nor to other Alts.

Whether Mains would be able to give money to STF characters is certainly up for debate.  At this moment, I'd say "No".  But this feature is discussed in the last paragarph.  STF characters are certainly different from regular Alts.  With regular Alts, players have to work hard to get to lvl 30.  It'd be nice to see that hard work be fruitful... and have Alts be afforded the same financial stability as Mains.

Just for Main characters, have a Tab where they can give money to their Alts.  Not sure how the interface would work or look.  But it should be a simple interface to make.  And I'd think it would be a somewhat easy as programming goes.  Shouldn't be too hard of an idea to implement!


Why this is a good idea?  Or at least... why it's not a bad idea?

First off, I think there's several benefits to this idea.  But just as important... I don't see any negative effects to this idea.  Check out #1, it actually may be the best reason to implement this.

1)  Allowing Mains to give money to Alts will help take some money out of the Market... helping fight inflation.  There's tons of complaints about inflation and too much money in circulation.  The money given to Alts will be forever lost from the Market, since Alts can't give money themselves.  Over time it could totally halt inflation... might even actually see deflation happen!

2)  It'll help alleviate the financial woes that Alts face... which Mains simply do not.  Allowing Alts to wear better armor and not worry about upkeep, just the same as Mains.  While this will make more well-equipped players in-game... that's not a bad thing.  Some folks may not like that idea... but it's not an unfair advantage (because Mains get to do this).  And you guys know that skill is way more of an advantage than equipment.

3)  There's no negative effect to Strategus.  Mains cannot be given money in any way... so no unfair advantages.



Closing Statement... and what I (and the Community) need from you?

Hopefully you see the advantages of this idea.  But also, hopefully you see there's no real negative (or unfair) points in this idea.  And the factor of taking money out of circulation in the Marketplace is seemingly a good enough reason alone.

Please vote "Yes" at the top.  Please +1 this idea.  Please make a post saying "great idea" or what not... so we can get many bumps on this.

I really want to take this idea to the Admins and push for this idea to be put into effect.  But I (or rather we) need to come together and unanimously make our voices/opinions known.  Let's make this idea happen!!!




STF feature in question

Would a Main be able to give money to a "Skip The Fun" character?  Two positives here.  One being that 10k is not a lot of gold to really enjoy your STF character (thus making you grind like all other characters).  Allowing STFs to receive money would hush all the complaints about this (cause many folks are asking for the 10k to be raised).  Number 2, giving money to a STF still takes money out of circulation in the Marketplace.  And with players regularly (at least weekly) creating and deleting STF characters... that's just more money that's likely to leave the Market... thus helping to halt inflation.  Players make a STF character.  Give it tons of money to max out their equipment.  Two weeks later they are wanting to make another STF character... so they delete this one... losing all those items anyways.  And then they make another character, give it money to max out equipment... and take even more money out of circulation in the Market.

The negative factor to this is... most players (after at least gen-ing their Main, which most players have done so) can instantly make a lvl 30 character with the best equipment available.  What's different about regular Alts is that players work hard to get them to lvl 30... they should be able to have the same financial stability as Mains.  However, STF characters are a different story.  Players could truly have instant gratification if able to give money to STF characters.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: POOPHAMMER on April 25, 2012, 03:32:46 am
incoming infinitely fueled by endless gold STF cav alts here we come!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 03:35:00 am
incoming infinitely fueled by endless gold STF cav alts here we come!

Well, if you read the last paragraph... this is a feature in question.  And in the initial out-look... I'm saying don't implement giving money to STFs.

I don't want to have anything in the way of seeing the main idea get implemented in-game (which is to allow Mains to give money to regular Alts).  If it would be too overpowering to have STF characters be given money... then let's not implement it.

But for players' regular Atls... with whom they've worked hard to get to lvl 30... I think it'd be a great idea for them to be able to have the financial stability that Mains get to have!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 06:20:36 am
Just edited the post with the idea to push for 50 votes.  I think if we got that many... then the Devs would definitely take notice... and hopefully implement this feature!

Heck, I think it we got over 30 votes, it'd make a big impression!

Please... if you agree with this idea... then VOTE... and +1 the original post... and post a reply to bump the thread!

Thanks!!!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Eugen on April 25, 2012, 08:00:06 am
Sounds good to me!

Maybe this even stops my evil plan to use all my alts as sacrifices to equip my main with full loomed equipment set soon!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Khalim on April 25, 2012, 11:14:18 am
I created a thread about transfering money Main<->Alt in both ways and this is what I wrote:

Quote
I am playing CRPG for some time, but I am not a high Gen player. Actually I am Gen 1 because I started over some times. I did this because I wanted variety in my playstyle.

Maybe I am bad informed but as far as I know the Alternate system works this way:

You have 1 Main who can access the market
You can create alts, play them to 31 and sacrifice for Heirloompoints
I dont know if you get gen+1 if you sacrifice lv31 Alternate but I assume this.


The problem I currently see is, that you dont have access to the market with your alts. This really limits the fun of playing an Alt because you know that you waste a lot of money, due to the limitateion of transfering gold.

You either have the choice of:

1, play Main and have full advantage but keep grinding the same stuff for 8,7 Mio xp
2, switch between Main and Alt from time to time but get punished with lesser goldincome per time

Both of them are bad choices. I dont like the system and I dont see the point why the player should be punished if he wants to swich characters.

The best solution is simple:
Just allow Alts to use the market. It enables the player to transfer gold and nothing is lost.
Its like having 1 account and the opportunity to play different characters and this would be great.

Please keep in mind that using alt already has a (small) disadvantage already, if they would be allowed to use market.
Playing several Alt at once would lead to a small DELAY of GENEREATIOn which is a small Xp punishment, but this is acceptable.

I really hope that playing an Alt will get buff, because the current version sucks and I dont see the point of it.

However I dont agree on the part of reducing inflation.

What I want is that I get X money for Y time.

And if I spend c + v time which is Y I want X money.

X money for Y time
X money for c+v Time
c+v = Y

simple as that ;)

Inflation should be fighted with other methods then BREAKING the game and punishing player who want diversity(=playing alts)
But currently you get DOUBLEPUNISHED for playing alts for no reason.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: ArchonAlarion on April 25, 2012, 04:52:58 pm
incoming infinitely fueled by endless gold STF cav alts here we come!

Yes, until your main runs out of gold. I know you are rich poop, and good for you, but that isn't feasible for most. Also, you are playing what amounts to a "dead" character. I don't even see much appeal in doing this. You'd also need to regularly play on your "slave" main to continue retiring and selling loompoints, all for a dead-end character.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 04:54:54 pm
Inflation should be fighted with other methods then BREAKING the game and punishing player who want diversity(=playing alts)

I, of course, answered you in your own thread.  But here I wanted to answer you're thought about "diversity".

I want diversity as well.  I want to be able to play my Alts with the same comfort that I play my Main.  I want them to be able to wear good equipment and not have to worry about upkeep, the same as Mains.  And I would love for them to have the capital to try out tons of different armors and weapons... just as Mains get to do.

My idea would help all that.  I would think you'd be on board for this... since you want the same?!


And as for using some other method to fight inflation... why?  Why does it have to be some other method?  Why can't it be this method?  How is it breaking the game?  Certainly no more than your idea which would "break" Strategus!  Now I'm not saying it would actually "break Stategus", cause the word "break" is a matter of opinion.  But your idea could have drastic effects on Strategus.  And you may not care much about Strategus... but apparently some do (I'm personally not one of them).


My point being is... I want to see Alts helped out... apparently you do as well.  Your idea of allowing Alts to use the Marketplace is going to get shot down (just as my old post did).  So here I am... trying to propose an idea that will help Alts... while not negatively affecting Strategus.

And it just so happens that it will also help fight inflation... something that seems to concern many of the veteran players (those who's opinions carry weight).  So yes... I am using it as a selling point!  And my idea will truly help fight inflation!  I'm not spouting "hot air" to just try to get them on board.  It will help a legitimate concern of the Marketplace!

Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 05:01:47 pm
Yes, until your main runs out of gold. I know you are rich poop, and good for you, but that isn't feasible for most. Also, you are playing what amounts to a "dead" character. I don't even see much appeal in doing this. You'd also need to regularly play on your "slave" main to continue retiring and selling loompoints, all for a dead-end character.

Exactly Archon!

And if rich players want to throw their money at a character they are going to delete in a week or so... I say let them!  It'll just help the Market out.  Now of course, as you said... most players won't this.  Most can't afford to do this.  And others are just smart enough to not through their money away on a STF character.

But as mentioned in my OP... I'm currently not proposing that Mains give money to STFs.  The reason I'm against it at the moment is because I don't anything negative against the main idea of "Allowing regular Alts to receive gold from Mains".  Some (like Poop) may say "No" to this idea based on the stance that allowing STFs able to participate in this will create to many uber Cavs (and the like).  I don't want that viewpoint hurting my main idea of getting approved.

So at the moment... this idea does not include STFs receiving money.  If the idea is approved... then Devs can decide on this matter themselves.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: POOPHAMMER on April 25, 2012, 05:13:04 pm
Yes, until your main runs out of gold. I know you are rich poop, and good for you, but that isn't feasible for most. Also, you are playing what amounts to a "dead" character. I don't even see much appeal in doing this. You'd also need to regularly play on your "slave" main to continue retiring and selling loompoints, all for a dead-end character.

You make it sound like I am the only person on crpg with gold
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 25, 2012, 09:34:37 pm
Great to see all the votes!  Thanks for your time!  And keep them coming!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (Why it a good idea)
Post by: Kafein on April 25, 2012, 09:43:47 pm
You make it sound like I am the only person on crpg with gold

He still makes a point. There's no reason to dump a lot of gold into STF chars for prolonged use, and you could do that with any char anyway so I don't see why are STF chars a problem. Such a feature would be welcome as 10k really isn't enough to try things.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Espu on April 25, 2012, 10:51:28 pm
Good idea. Implementing.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Death_Dealer on April 25, 2012, 10:53:26 pm
i want to be able to transfer items to alts and this or i ll need to get another key to have another main:P oh poor alts
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Tears of Destiny on April 26, 2012, 05:44:47 am
Good idea. Implementing.

If you are serious, then I'm a very happy person.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Xeen on April 26, 2012, 06:03:40 am
Sounds good.  This game is way way wayyyyy too restrictive. 
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Slev23 on April 26, 2012, 06:07:39 am
Alts are way too restricted. Like, why can't they access the marketplace? Is the sole reason so that you can't exchange money on an account. It just doesn't make sense...
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 26, 2012, 06:08:56 am
Good idea. Implementing.

If you are serious, then I'm a very happy person.

So am I!  Please oh please let it be!!!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 26, 2012, 06:24:33 pm
Glad to see so many voters!  Thanks for your time (whether you voted "Yes" or "No", your opinion is appreciated)!

And we are almost to our mark of 50 "Yes" votes, and it's only been up 2 days.  I personally would like to have the poll up for a week, before presenting the results to the Devs... and saying, "Please take notice, the vast majority want this implemented... please implement this as soon as possible".

So with several days left in the poll, let's shoot for over 50 votes.  I'd love to see 70 or 80 "Yes"votes.  Heck, why not 100 (though I'm not sure we have enough active forum members for such numbers).

Either way, the more "Yes" votes... the more likely the Devs will take notice... and hopefully implement this feature!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: BlindGuy on April 26, 2012, 06:54:07 pm
Idea is pointless. Mains are for playing, alts are for trollin, they dont need any boni, infact already they are too useful, in that you can sac them for their looms. I personally would be happy with alts removed altogether. This isnt the whole world.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Kafein on April 26, 2012, 06:57:19 pm
Idea is pointless. Mains are for playing, alts are for trollin, they dont need any boni, infact already they are too useful, in that you can sac them for their looms. I personally would be happy with alts removed altogether. This isnt the whole world.

visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: BlindGuy on April 26, 2012, 07:05:17 pm
Im serious? WHY do you need alts anyway? Because 1/ You want to make a troll Xbow cav. You dont deserve money, or 2/ You are not happy with your main. In which case, retire and do something else.

If you really have so much gold you dont want it, give it to me ffs, I can always use more +3, I respec about twice a gen, cause guess what? I play all the "classes", find them all fairly abusive and easy at 30, and get bored of raping shieldarchers and overconfidant spammers.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Tears of Destiny on April 26, 2012, 07:13:38 pm
Well for starters Alts will grind for looms slower then mains, so they are not too useful, as if you did the same with your main then you would have the gold and the faster track to looms (xp gen bonus). I should also point out that I have alts mainly so I am never ever bored, and so I can actually compare classes instead of making up random things like a lot of people do when talking about other classes "Oh yes, I played a thrower/cav/twohander/etc a year and a half ago..."
It also helps to cut down on annoyance, as if a patch temporarily screws things up or for whatever reason my main is just "not working for me" then I can fire up one of my alts.

Currently alts are more of a disadvantage then an advantage (which is good), but they are hardly "too useful."

BlindGuy, why you so silly...
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Kafein on April 26, 2012, 07:15:12 pm
Im serious? WHY do you need alts anyway? Because 1/ You want to make a troll Xbow cav. You dont deserve money, or 2/ You are not happy with your main. In which case, retire and do something else.

If you really have so much gold you dont want it, give it to me ffs, I can always use more +3, I respec about twice a gen, cause guess what? I play all the "classes", find them all fairly abusive and easy at 30, and get bored of raping shieldarchers and overconfidant spammers.

I have alts because it's more effective to have a level 30 guy of each class you will never retire with anyway if you want to switch classes often.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: cmp on April 26, 2012, 07:30:26 pm
Yes, it's gonna be implemented.
No, the vote had nothing to do with it (not that we look at votes, but 50 is a laughable amount anyway).
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 26, 2012, 09:08:48 pm
Yes, it's gonna be implemented.
No, the vote had nothing to do with it (not that we look at votes, but 50 is a laughable amount anyway).

Well that's awesome to hear!

And I never really thought that Devs were going to implement something because of a Poll.  But I just wanted a way for numerous folks to get behind this idea and make their opinion know (whether only 50, or a 100 plus).

I'm sure this is something you Devs had in ya'lls mind sometime now.  Just glad to see it's going to happen!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Slev23 on April 26, 2012, 09:47:37 pm
cmp, is there any chance of letting alts become mains under very restrictive conditions?
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: ArchonAlarion on April 27, 2012, 12:25:51 am
Well for starters Alts will grind for looms slower then mains, so they are not too useful, as if you did the same with your main then you would have the gold and the faster track to looms (xp gen bonus). I should also point out that I have alts mainly so I am never ever bored, and so I can actually compare classes instead of making up random things like a lot of people do when talking about other classes "Oh yes, I played a thrower/cav/twohander/etc a year and a half ago..."
It also helps to cut down on annoyance, as if a patch temporarily screws things up or for whatever reason my main is just "not working for me" then I can fire up one of my alts.

And that's why I am never butt-hurt about balance or feel the need to lobby for my play-style (besides a bit of personal integrity). I have over a dozen alts and play between 6 of them regularly (including my main).
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: BlindGuy on April 27, 2012, 12:33:23 am
Meh, another thing that doesnt matter being implemented while so many problems remain unlooked at. WOOT FOR PRIORITIES!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: POOPHAMMER on April 27, 2012, 03:57:48 am
Meh, another thing that doesnt matter being implemented while so many problems remain unlooked at. WOOT FOR PRIORITIES!

Try filling one of these out sometime

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 27, 2012, 06:50:57 am
Meh, another thing that doesnt matter being implemented while so many problems remain unlooked at. WOOT FOR PRIORITIES!

This feature doesn't negatively effect you... so why QQ so much... or be so adamant against it?  And if it's just because they have not yet dealt with something that you feel is an issue... that's still no reason to go against this feature... just because in your "opinion" there's more pressing matters (priorities).  Maybe a post saying... hey, you guys should really deal with this first would be better received... by both the community and (more importantly) the Devs.

And I'm sure in the grand scheme of things... this feature being implemented is quite easy to do (as programming goes).  So that's probably one of the reasons why it's been prioritized above others.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Espu on April 27, 2012, 07:16:24 am
This feature took me less than two hours total. The more pressing issues (whatever you mean) are usually things that either take a lot of time to implement (clan/banner system independent of Strat) or a lot of thinking to solve (team balance). All developers work on whatever spare time they happen to have and thus smaller tasks get done a lot easier.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 27, 2012, 07:20:28 am
This feature took me less than two hours total. The more pressing issues (whatever you mean) are usually things that either take a lot of time to implement (clan/banner system independent of Strat) or a lot of thinking to solve (team balance). All developers work on whatever spare time they happen to have and thus smaller tasks get done a lot easier.

My thoughts exactly.  And thanks a million Espu!!!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Kalp on April 27, 2012, 08:29:33 am
I want this

Quote
and Alts will be able to give money to Mains

 :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 27, 2012, 12:03:40 pm
Yeah Kalp, I'm not exactly sure how this feature that they are implementing works.  Maybe they'll have it as free trade between all characters (Mains & Alts, even STFs).  Not sure exactly what parameters the Devs have included in this feature.  I've been told that Devs may frown upon Mains being able to receive money from Alts, cause it could affect Strategus.  So I decided to leave that option out, in hopes it'd better my chances of seeing this feature approved and implemented.

However, it seems that the Devs may have been looking into this before I even made the original post.  So you'd have to question them about how it's exactly going to work.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Kafein on April 27, 2012, 12:17:22 pm
chadz only accepted the main to alt gold transfers.
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 27, 2012, 12:34:29 pm
chadz only accepted the main to alt gold transfers.

Cool.  I kind of figured that'd be the case.  And I'm 100% elated!  The basis of making the post in the first place, was the hope of bringing financial stability to Alts.

Thanks so much to everyone... Devs, chadz, & voters... your work & efforts are much appreciated!!!
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Kalp on April 28, 2012, 12:54:39 pm
What about giving heirloom points/weapons from main char to alt ?
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on April 29, 2012, 07:55:40 am
Just out of curiosity, any idea when this could be installed/implemented?

Not trying to sound like a dick rushing ya'll (not that at all), just simply curious?
Title: Re: Giving money to Alts (And why it's a good idea)
Post by: Mallets on May 03, 2012, 04:53:44 pm
It's here!  The "Funding" as chadz & the Devs call it, has been implemented!

Once again, I want to say a big "Thank You" to all you who voted and posted in this thread!  Not that this thread got this implemented... it seemed the Devs may have already been chewing on this idea.  But I think it definitely got the ball rolling for them to actually make it happen.  Meaning, the "Funding" option may have been months down the road if not for this thread (and you folks voice here in this thread).

And of course a huge "Thanks" to chadz & the Devs!!!