cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Realism Discussion => Topic started by: Rumblood on February 04, 2012, 01:33:44 pm
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A guy sitting in a saddle taking one arm and half-ass poking at someone's breastplate should in no way do as much damage as a standing infantryman using both hands and braced for thrusting into the enemy. It's pretty silly that a guy sitting essentially in a chair with one hand can do as much thrust damage as a guy standing, leaning, and using 2 hands.
This has nothing to do with speed bonus while mounted. I am talking about the guys who are sitting on an essentially motionless horse, casually turning it left and right and yet somehow managing to generate a couple thousands pounds worth of thrust using no more than their uber forearm strength. :rolleyes:
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Too be honest I wouldn't even be scared to someone like that today with no training against them :P If someone was waving a pretty heavy pike from one hand. Would just grab it and pull it out of his hand.
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Agreed, leave the 1 hit killing to couching.
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A guy sitting in a saddle taking one arm and half-ass poking at someone's breastplate should in no way do as much damage as a standing infantryman using both hands and braced for thrusting into the enemy. It's pretty silly that a guy sitting essentially in a chair with one hand can do as much thrust damage as a guy standing, leaning, and using 2 hands.
This has nothing to do with speed bonus while mounted. I am talking about the guys who are sitting on an essentially motionless horse, casually turning it left and right and yet somehow managing to generate a couple thousands pounds worth of thrust using no more than their uber forearm strength. :rolleyes:
Uhmm. Isn't polearms and 2handed weapon damage and speed already reduced when used mounted? Around -30% to both speed and damage? Same as when you use a 2h or polearm with a shield?
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thrust from horseback already receives a nerf to damage and speed.
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thrust from horseback already receives a nerf to damage and speed.
You still die in one hit so it doesn't matter one bit.
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thrust from horseback already receives a nerf to damage and speed.
Nerf its current already nerfed damage and speed by more then :!:
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Is the horse in your mind Rumblood standing still or at full galop?
Because if its at full gallops the horse in your mind Rumblood standing still or at full gallop?
Because if its at full gallop you have that whole inertia thing going on, and the example of a guy with to hands vs a guy on a galloping horse, feet in stirrups arse again the back of the saddle stabbing you with a big old lance just dont compare.
Its like saying why is that shot gun more powerful than my hand gun, he is firing it one handed like arny should that take away some of its power.
Some one remember that dudes name the quote goes something like this.
A horse a man a lance a missile.
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I think he means when it's standing still, I really do hate having someone "slo-mo" stab me with a lance from horseback, and gently force it through my chest as if I was standing against a wall. I don't care how much pierce the thing has, i've never seen someone (relating slo-mo to real life instances that are similar by force applied) slowly swing an axe at a log, steadily pushing it through, it just doesn't work. :|
I don't mind being fullcharged to death but I hate the standstill 1 shot kills for their complete lack of threat. From that I mean, it's so slow that I think "that'll bounce" despite my previous experiences of insta-death.
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All lances couch only. Lances have health bars, dropped as broken after so many hits.
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Is the horse in your mind Rumblood standing still or at full galop?
This has nothing to do with speed bonus while mounted. I am talking about the guys who are sitting on an essentially motionless horse, casually turning it left and right and yet somehow managing to generate a couple thousands pounds worth of thrust using no more than their uber forearm strength. :rolleyes:
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All lances couch only. Lances have health bars, dropped as broken after so many hits.
This
and make them one slot
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Its like saying why is that shot gun more powerful than my hand gun, he is firing it one handed like arny should that take away some of its power.
Wtf are you talking about... how is that even remotely similar.
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Wtf are you talking about... how is that even remotely similar.
Because if you thrust with the shotgun at the same time that you fire, you get an increased speed bonus! D: Don't you know these things Siiem?
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Tenne- your inquiry therefor is that the slow animation should result in less damage, which is understandable.
However, the slow animation on the Heavy lance is meant to nerf it, as in "slower weapons are weaker", not in terms of damage.
This, however, actually only nerfs the use whilst dehorsed.
I personally loved the patch a few months back when the lance was even slower, as the speed multi gets elevated with the lower speed of the used weapon, so the following proposition is actually a lancer nerf:
I would suggest making the lances faster. This would decrease their speed damage bonus, would make timing a perfect hit harder, and wouldnt give you a headache about why you just got killed by a standing lancer : )
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Tenne- your inquiry therefor is that the slow animation should result in less damage, which is understandable.
However, the slow animation on the Heavy lance is meant to nerf it, as in "slower weapons are weaker", not in terms of damage.
This, however, actually only nerfs the use whilst dehorsed.
I personally loved the patch a few months back when the lance was even slower, as the speed multi gets elevated with the lower speed of the used weapon, so the following proposition is actually a lancer nerf:
I would suggest making the lances faster. This would decrease their speed damage bonus, would make timing a perfect hit harder, and wouldnt give you a headache about why you just got killed by a standing lancer : )
I'm not 100% sure I follow your logic to be honest Torben but I shall take your word for it since all I do is shoot cavalry as opposed to play them. The thing I find most ridiculous is the fact that the speed is so slow for such a powerful attack, it just looks and feels completely silly. I don't mind it if it hit me in the head, i'm quite sure my face wouldn't be to well off with a sharp object shoved into it, but through my armour it's little more than an annoyance because, well... armour should protect you, even leather armour would in truth have some resistance to an object that's already touching you being slowly and methodically jammed into it, especially with that said armour on a backwards movement pattern.
On the same line of thought though, I have found, while playing my pikeman, that I can in fact only slightly touch people and cause large amounts of damage and stagger, which is also a little funny.
I know i'm more or less a reasonably outspoken person when it comes to different game play styles, such as cavalry (due to their high damage, physics and, want of a better word, broken game mechanics) but I do try to give a reasonable explanation for why I believe this.
Naturally, I'm willing to admit that I don't really know how cavalry plays all that well, as all I tend to see from the majority of cav is them bumping people to death/harrassing players till they give up or killing peasants. My days of being a horsearcher are well behind me and I understand a lot has changed since those days, although I fondly remember being able to grab a lance and knock out some good scores without having any polearm prof or ps due to silly speed bonus' etc. (Remember, that was nearly a year ago now)
There are a few things I find silly with cavalry and inparticular it's the stand-still stuff that gets me, cav are a charging force, not a stationary one. Speaking purely from realistic terms, if a cavalryman was stationary in medieval times fighting an infantryman, they would have less of a chance of surviving due to their lack of maneuverability. Charging, they're more or less an unstopable force, as they should be. That seems to be a rule of thumb more than something that happens every time of course.
If i'm harking on about cavalry here as well, I might as well mention the number of times i've seen reasonably armoured players go flying because a horse WALKED into them. I wouldn't mind being knocked out of the way but watching a guy in full plate get killed by a walking arabian horse is of course hilarious, but rather ridiculous when i've just checked his health to be at 10%! (B - Names Cheat)
I really don't want any class to be nerfed to the ground, I would just like to see some mechanics changes so that they don't have quite so much of an advantage being stationary/walking pace. I hate cavalry from the bottom of my soul because of their low handedness (for the most part) and just want the balance to be bent a little bit more in favour of infantry when they aren't moving. All my classes I play are Anti-cav, I'm rather, without sounding arrogant, adept at sniping cavalrymen off horses and my alt is a Bifi-esc longspearman with a presidence on jump stabs towards horses!
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It aint my logic mate :D
the damage speed bonus on horse INCREASES with the weapon speed DECREASING, so a 60speed weapon gets a higher amount of speed bonus than a 90 speed weapon.
the slower speed leaves the lance at its fully extended length longer, making it easier to hit at full range.
both mechanics actually make 0wpf lancing viable, as speed bonus increases because of decreased weapon speed due to wpf.
all in all, a higher weapon speed decreases speed bonus damage, and the time the weapon is fully extended.
this, ofc, wont help with stationary thrust except perception wise, but it will help with slow moving cav.
thinking about it, i dont really want that change :visitors can't see pics , please register or login
D
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It aint my logic mate :D
the damage speed bonus on horse INCREASES with the weapon speed DECREASING, so a 60speed weapon gets a higher amount of speed bonus than a 90 speed weapon.
the slower speed leaves the lance at its fully extended length longer, making it easier to hit at full range.
both mechanics actually make 0wpf lancing viable, as speed bonus increases because of decreased weapon speed due to wpf.
all in all, a higher weapon speed decreases speed bonus damage, and the time the weapon is fully extended.
this, ofc, wont help with stationary thrust except perception wise, but it will help with slow moving cav.
thinking about it, i dont really want that change :visitors can't see pics , please register or login
D
Of course you don't because from what I understand you're saying, it'll make your gameplay much harder. (Which is a good thing, hopefully it'll shoot down some of the numbers of cavalry so that we have less stacking.)
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What about simply nerfing lance damage so they are only viable at high speed?
No headshot is as easy as with cav, once you have settled your aim (bit down to the left, use the horse as your mercedes star aim) u just hold the lance at the right angle and off you go 1-shotting everyone. They did it to archery already for it to require more skill. IMO lance damage should only pay off when headshotting or at very high speeds.
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Stop moaning about the CAV, they are the best class in "MNB" , you do not always die from 1 hit, put some points into IF or get a better armor. I need to thrust 3 times to kill a heavy armor dude, 2 times on light infantry and 1 on light peasants.