cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Torp on January 28, 2011, 08:19:25 pm
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how should a 1h+shield build look at lvl 30?
i was thinknig something like this:
Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)
Strength: 21
Agility: 18
Hit points: 56
Converted: 8
Ironflesh: 0
Power Strike: 7
Shield: 5
Athletics: 5
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 6
One Handed: 151
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 52
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Huscarl, no armor, no gloves, maybe boots, maybe helmet.
ill use grosse messer.
is that fine? (i wont change equipment)
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I've only played with one 1h+shield build but from my experience that would be painful to play. Aim for something more like:
Strength: 18
Agility: 18
Ironflesh 0-1
Power Strike 6
Shield 6
Athletics 6
Riding 5
Horse Archery 0
Power Draw 0
Power Throw 0
Weapon master * 6
With about 150 wpf in 1-handed weapons and polearms (for those pesky horses!). If your athletics is too low you'll be torn apart by the length of polearms and 2-handers without even getting a shot in. For the most part, you'll always do low-medium damage unless you're getting headshots. Once you get over the weird sensation of not expecting fast kills you become far more deadly. From what I've seen fighting other 1-handers, most don't learn to be patient with their class and end up falling prey to the quick block+strike shots.
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how should a 1h+shield build look at lvl 30?
It depends on what you like.
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i enjoyed my last build.
level 30
12 str
24 agil
1if
4ps
8ath
8shield
8wm
172 1hand wpf
huscarls, long espada, broad one hand axe, mail over chain, mail gauntlets, leather boots, and a sipahi helmet.
if you refuse to bring a axe or pick, then i suggest at least 15 str, and probably 18-21.
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Well, with only 18 agility it's kind of tricky to catch a fast guy with a long weapon especially if you use a short sword. If you are mainly in the center of battle taking high str might be kind of worth it though.
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im a spartan.
a spartan is naked except helmet, uses a big shield, 1 h spear (war spear) and a sword (grosse messer)
i need to be fast and deal a lot of dmg, i dunno if i should go 18/21 or 21/18
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My current main is a sword and board build. But to be honest I wouldn't be able to stand him other than the fact he is a thrower hybrid. At lvl 30 I really like playing him. Sure he isn't top of the list like some other classes, but it's a very versatile build none the less. More of a support class I guess. But it's still fun to wander alone into an open field with enemy cavalry all around and just start tossing axes at them. Drop 100'ish wpf into throwing, rest into 1 hand, and you won't regret the lost wpf in 1 hand I can promise you that.
I'll copy paste my build as reference - but I'm not saying it's THE build to do, just saying I enjoy playing this particular one and I have tried all of them.
LvL 30
3rd Gen
Skill Points Remaining to distribute 1
Strength 15
Agility 20
One Handed 129
Throwing 106
Ironflesh 3
Power Strike 5
Shield 5
Athletics 6
Power Throw 5
Weapon master 6
At lvl 31 I will have 21 AGI and drop my remaining two skillpoints into Athletics and Weopon Master - putting the extra WPF into 1 Handed and probably putting that skill at about 140+
Good Luck On Your Build!!
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My current main is a sword and board build. But to be honest I wouldn't be able to stand him other than the fact he is a thrower hybrid. At lvl 30 I really like playing him. Sure he isn't top of the list like some other classes, but it's a very versatile build none the less. More of a support class I guess. But it's still fun to wander alone into an open field with enemy cavalry all around and just start tossing axes at them. Drop 100'ish wpf into throwing, rest into 1 hand, and you won't regret the lost wpf in 1 hand I can promise you that.
I'll copy paste my build as reference - but I'm not saying it's THE build to do, just saying I enjoy playing this particular one and I have tried all of them.
LvL 30
3rd Gen
Skill Points Remaining to distribute 1
Strength 15
Agility 20
One Handed 129
Throwing 106
Ironflesh 3
Power Strike 5
Shield 5
Athletics 6
Power Throw 5
Weapon master 6
At lvl 31 I will have 21 AGI and drop my remaining two skillpoints into Athletics and Weopon Master - putting the extra WPF into 1 Handed and probably putting that skill at about 140+
Good Luck On Your Build!!
Why didn't you retire by then ?
Ironflesh 5
Power Strike 6
Shield 6
Athletics 6
Weapon master 6
All in 1h, the tank build.
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Why didn't you retire by then ?
Ironflesh 5
Power Strike 6
Shield 6
Athletics 6
Weapon master 6
All in 1h, the tank build.
If you didn't put any into IF, you could probably go 8 on PS, Sh, ATH, and WM...
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If you didn't put any into IF, you could probably go 8 on PS, Sh, ATH, and WM...
How ? 18/18.
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18/18 or 21/15, I would go for 21/15
max PS:
Lot of boucing these days with 1h -> high PS
max IF(only if you wanna use at least medium armor):
even with shield you get 2 shoted by 2h these days ...
if you wanna use no armor, I would spend the IF points rather in converting (only if 21/15 -> 3 convertions -> 1 point to spend) or (if 18/18) put them else where, just where you like it, riding, throwing, whatever ...
the rest should be self-explantional ... max shield, max atheltics, max wm ... all wpf to 1h
Edit: naked 1h/shield = useless :>
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18/18 or 21/15, I would go for 21/15
max PS:
Lot of boucing these days with 1h -> high PS
max IF(only if you wanna use at least medium armor):
even with shield you get 2 shoted by 2h these days ...
if you wanna use no armor, I would spend the IF points rather in converting (only if 21/15 -> 3 convertions -> 1 point to spend) or (if 18/18) put them else where, just where you like it, riding, throwing, whatever ...
the rest should be self-explantional ... max shield, max atheltics, max wm ... all wpf to 1h
Edit: naked 1h/shield = useless :>
21 with 7PS and7PT and rest 5 would be cool too, split profs between 1h and throwing (a little, 79?)
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12 str
24 agi
Ignore IF, be fast and deadly :)
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12 str
24 agi
Ignore IF, be fast and deadly :)
Not everyone have triple heirloomed shield and 1h weapon
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I had 15 strength, 23 agility last time around. This time I may make about the same or even 15/24 if I can spare the points.
Edit: 15 Str
23 Agi
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Adjust WPF to your liking.
1H/Shield + Polearms (or Crossbow)
Level 30
Strength: 15
Agility: 21
Converted: 2
Ironflesh: 5
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 5
Athletics: 7
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 140
Polearm: 110 (or Crossbow)
***Move IF into riding if you want to play cavalry, and/or into shields if you really want.
1H/Shield + Throwing
Level 30
Strength: 15
Agility: 21
Converted: 2
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 5
Athletics: 7
Power Throw: 5
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 140
Throwing: 110
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If you're willing to wait until level 31 to be "complete" then...
Level 31
Strength: 15
Agility: 24
Converted: 6
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 5
Athletics: 8
Weapon Master: 8
One Handed: 170
Polearm: 50
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Difficult. Imho you took the best skill combo for 21/18 for your favorite equipment. I am not sure about the viability of the build/equipment. Could be hard to play.
I would not make an agi based build... at least 18str, better 21str. Would be good if you deal damage if you hit with the Langes Messer.
A ninja build with huscarl... no.
I tested a few 1h/board builds. My last one was a 18/18 1h/shield/thrower (i know, you dont want a hybrid) hybrid. It worked great. You can deal with cav, archer, melee...
If you build 18/18 you could max shield, ath and all other important skills... and there are even free points. IF is imho waste without armor. You could test 21/15 also... if you feel too slow you can level further.
Personally i had quite good success even with a 12agi warhammer char... lot of str and ironflesh (but I had armor).
But 6 shield skill is much better than 4.
But as you know the main problem is... if you make a build without conversion of skill->attribute you have got spare skill points. If you convert a lot you have a lack of skill points. Imho your build is not bad if you dont want to use your skill points for a skill.
I would change the WPP a little bit... something like:
* One Handed: 135 (remain)
* Polearm: 100 (about)
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I have 21 str 15 agility and I have about 145 wpf
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Difficult. Imho you took the best skill combo for 21/18 for your favorite equipment. I am not sure about the viability of the build/equipment. Could be hard to play.
I would not make an agi based build... at least 18str, better 21str. Would be good if you deal damage if you hit with the Langes Messer.
A ninja build with huscarl... no.
I tested a few 1h/board builds. My last one was a 18/18 1h/shield/thrower (i know, you dont want a hybrid) hybrid. It worked great. You can deal with cav, archer, melee...
If you build 18/18 you could max shield, ath and all other important skills... and there are even free points. IF is imho waste without armor. You could test 21/15 also... if you feel too slow you can level further.
Personally i had quite good success even with a 12agi warhammer char... lot of str and ironflesh (but I had armor).
But 6 shield skill is much better than 4.
But as you know the main problem is... if you make a build without conversion of skill->attribute you have got spare skill points. If you convert a lot you have a lack of skill points. Imho your build is not bad if you dont want to use your skill points for a skill.
I would change the WPP a little bit... something like:
* One Handed: 135 (remain)
* Polearm: 100 (about)
thx for a nice and serious post :D
1. it's not a ninja build, it's a spartan build, which is why i chose this equipment. It will be a new alt, not a part of the ninja clan.
2. I only need polearm wpf vs. horses and when my shield breaks.
and i'll think about the 18/18 build, but as you say, i will have useless spare skill points, as IF is kinda useless as 1 hit kills me anyways. I gotta rely on my shield.
I mgiht go 6 shield, but then i have to put one less point in another skill... which one?
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thx for a nice and serious post :D
thx
1. it's not a ninja build, it's a spartan build, which is why i chose this equipment. It will be a new alt, not a part of the ninja clan.
I knew that... errm... it was primarily my first thought about babelfish's suggestion, sorry.
2. I only need polearm wpf vs. horses and when my shield breaks.
Ok, but I still think the tradeoff of -15 1h against +50 polearm WPP is not bad.
and i'll think about the 18/18 build, but as you say, i will have useless spare skill points, as IF is kinda useless as 1 hit kills me anyways. I gotta rely on my shield.
Try 18/15 a while. If you think you are slow you can level agi, if you want more damage go str. Agi does not make wonder... you will never go easily behind a normal 2h (most have a lot of agi) or walk around a turtle.
I mgiht go 6 shield, but then i have to put one less point in another skill... which one?
no idea
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from what you are saying you want to do...
go 15/21 or 12/24
you need the wpf to be competent in poles and 1hands. you are going to be relying on your shield and speed to stay alive which means you want high athletics and high shield. hitting hard is worthless to you if you get your shield broken in 3 hits or cant close into range with anyone.
p.s. you dont need heirloomed gear to make a 15/21 work... i did 12/24... and my only heirloomed item was my gloves. id say to do 15 str though cause you arent using strong enough weapons to make up for the 12 str against tin cans.
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To be honest - not flaming or trolling here - I feel like you guys are looking for the cookie cutter build. Like the ultimate end all configuration of perfection. Imo the skillset is situational, and the fun level is based on actual satisfaction.
Ask yourself this? How many games have you grown bored of because you couldn't break away from the cookie cutter build that bored you to tears in fear of trying a gimp or unconventional build that you thought would work for you? I'm sure a few.
I say just do what you feel is right. The bonus is you can reroll at lvl 15 and keep your stuff right? That way you can feel out certain playstyles and then get a free respec if it is just not working for you. Lvl 15 is nothing.
IF is not gimp either. I know it's obviously a low added bonus, but that extra sliver of life can mean the difference between living/playing or sitting the rest of the round out watching from the shadows.
I really don't find the dynamics of this game as cut and dry as alot of people try and make it out to be. There is no right answer, there is only your answer. So I hope you can still feel comfortable to decide what is right for you after being TOLD what is right by half the community playing.
Good luck!
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To be honest - not flaming or trolling here - I feel like you guys are looking for the cookie cutter build. Like the ultimate end all configuration of perfection. Imo the skillset is situational, and the fun level is based on actual satisfaction.
Ask yourself this? How many games have you grown bored of because you couldn't break away from the cookie cutter build that bored you to tears in fear of trying a gimp or unconventional build that you thought would work for you? I'm sure a few.
I say just do what you feel is right. The bonus is you can reroll at lvl 15 and keep your stuff right? That way you can feel out certain playstyles and then get a free respec if it is just not working for you. Lvl 15 is nothing.
IF is not gimp either. I know it's obviously a low added bonus, but that extra sliver of life can mean the difference between living/playing or sitting the rest of the round out watching from the shadows.
I really don't find the dynamics of this game as cut and dry as alot of people try and make it out to be. There is no right answer, there is only your answer. So I hope you can still feel comfortable to decide what is right for you after being TOLD what is right by half the community playing.
Good luck!
okay, i've been playing as a ninja ever since i started, never gone the tincan way becasue it's more effectiver - iplay as i want.
And this alt is not an attempt to make a great char, i make it cause i want a spartan char, and if i just wanted a good char i would've used other item.
Also, im not looking for 'the' build, but it's nice to hear other peoples opinions and experiences
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cookie cutter build... interesting turning point.
If I look at the scoreboard there are often different persons on top... 1h, 2h, cav, ... depends mainly on map, e.g. cav at city map will be probably not so usefull. My 1h/board is at siege much better than in battle because of the corridors, rooms... its narrow. So on top should be the best skilled player with the best fitting build for a specific map.
I play different builds (2h, 1h/board/throwing, throwing, polearm) because it is fun to play differently. But I want always a viable build. I dont want a 2h who loose all 2h duells. So imho its normal to think about a good build for a specific class. You think about how you want to play and then you choose the build. The "how to play" is very depending on the weapon.
The rl hoplits mainly fighted with spear and shield... if the spear was broken they used the sword. The main formation was the phalanx. Also they used javelines. (Wikipedia). They used that (build) because it was viable. If we build a hoplite the question is whether the build is viable on m&b maps. But imho it is good to think about the best build for a hoplit if you want to play a hoplit.
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Hm I think mouse build is decent for a 1h shield but I'm guessing torp joining spartans so they will probably team together so maybe something like this as build would be better:
Strength: 18
Agility: 21
Hit points: 53
Converted: 8
Ironflesh: 0
Power Strike: 6
Shield: 6
Athletics: 4
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 145
Polearm: 102
4 athletics is more then enough specially since your going naked so less weight but up to you.
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I went for the 21/15 build, but instead of maxing IF I got 5 riding and 2 IF. Trade 10 hp for a horse.
7 PS makes most hits a 1 hit kill against infantry (archers for sure). Works quite well :)
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8PS 5 ATHLETIC SHIELD WEAPON MASTER All wpf in 1h. Could work. 24/15
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8PS 5 ATHLETIC SHIELD WEAPON MASTER All wpf in 1h. Could work. 24/15
It does work, that's my build. But 5 shield sucks for fighting polearms, can't chase archers, heavy armor slows too much, etc. I suppose it depends on style, being this slow means I often can't get out of the kind of trouble I like to get into. Someone more patient might like it a lot more, I guess.
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It does work, that's my build. But I would hope it's not optimal since 5 shield sucks, can't chase archers, heavy armor slows too much, etc. I suppose it depends on style, being this slow means I often can't get out of the kind of trouble I like to get into. Someone more patient might like it a lot more, I guess.
21/18 7ps 6 ath 5 shi 5 wm ? Or even trade 1 point of shield for weapon master. 4 shield is enough to use huscarl.
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21/18 7ps 6 ath 5 shi 5 wm ? Or even trade 1 point of shield for weapon master. 4 shield is enough to use huscarl.
If you like, but personally I think 5 shield isn't enough for huscarl. Maybe I'm too sucky to make it work.
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i like my 144 1H, 100 polearm, 15 str, 21 agility build.
5 power strike
7 shield
7 athletics
7 weapon master
4 ironflesh
huscl, sidesword, warspear.
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You should put those 4 skill points into Horse riding, otherwise it's a good build.
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I just retired my 1h+shield
I had at level 30
18str
21agi
6ps
4sh
7ath
4-5wm cant remember, had about 140 1h wp was thinking of making a 0wm build which would have around 100wp but i didnt know what else to sink the 4 extra points into riding/shield/IF/wm/throwing
used an elite scimitar unheirloomed and rarely had glances. really only people i consistantly glanced off were heirloomed black armored ones/one
i went for this build because i wanted high athletics and i wanted to be able to use a slashing sword without glancing off armor.
if I remade him i think i would do it the same. not much experience with other 1h+shield builds before this one. but it seemed to work really good. I think with a triple heirloomed sword would be nice though.. oh im addicted to retiring
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i think i will go 18/18 and then see what i need most; dmg or speed
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I had 18/18 and only 110 in 1H wpf. I was too slow to do anything. Leave STR at 15 and rest put into agi, you'll need it. Using any shield and especially Huscarl means you're very slow, people (ninjas and other agi builds) will easily get behind you, you'll be a easy pray for cavalry if you're playing alone (outside of the group). Worst thing about shields is that they make you slow, you can't spam, you have to wait for your chance. Going 1H after playing Ninja style will be really painful. You won't be able to use skills you perfected as a ninja. Even if you put shield on your back you movement speed will remain slow, you'll attack faster but take into acount that manual blocking with 95 length Katana and 95 length Side Sword isn't the same. It's much harder to properly block using short one handed sword.
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I went for the 21/15 build, but instead of maxing IF I got 5 riding and 2 IF. Trade 10 hp for a horse.
7 PS makes most hits a 1 hit kill against infantry (archers for sure). Works quite well :)
Hell ya brother
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I had 18/18 and only 110 in 1H wpf. I was too slow to do anything. Leave STR at 15 and rest put into agi, you'll need it. Using any shield and especially Huscarl means you're very slow, people (ninjas and other agi builds) will easily get behind you, you'll be a easy pray for cavalry if you're playing alone (outside of the group). Worst thing about shields is that they make you slow, you can't spam, you have to wait for your chance. Going 1H after playing Ninja style will be really painful. You won't be able to use skills you perfected as a ninja. Even if you put shield on your back you movement speed will remain slow, you'll attack faster but take into acount that manual blocking with 95 length Katana and 95 length Side Sword isn't the same. It's much harder to properly block using short one handed sword.
in my opinion 15 agility is fast enough, I put ever single point into 1h, if you do that and then go 21 strength, in my opinion you will have the ultimate build
then again I do not use the huscarl shield
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i think ill go for this build:
Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)
Strength: 18
Agility: 21
Hit points: 53
Converted: 8
Ironflesh: 0
Power Strike: 6
Shield: 6
Athletics: 4
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 7
One Handed: 146
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 100
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1
Barbutte helm
Huscarl shield
War spear
Grosse messer
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good luck with your hybrid
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I think you'll end up wanting more agility than that. I've played 1h for quite a while now and I find my best tactic is controlling the fight through speed+shield. If I wasn't faster than most opponents I wouldn't be able to get the golden strike to the back of their head or the invisible left=>right strike.
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I had 18/18 and only 110 in 1H wpf. I was too slow to do anything. Leave STR at 15 and rest put into agi, you'll need it. Using any shield and especially Huscarl means you're very slow, people (ninjas and other agi builds) will easily get behind you, you'll be a easy pray for cavalry if you're playing alone (outside of the group). Worst thing about shields is that they make you slow, you can't spam, you have to wait for your chance. Going 1H after playing Ninja style will be really painful. You won't be able to use skills you perfected as a ninja. Even if you put shield on your back you movement speed will remain slow, you'll attack faster but take into acount that manual blocking with 95 length Katana and 95 length Side Sword isn't the same. It's much harder to properly block using short one handed sword.
If he has no other eqipment besides his helmet and gloves, then speed should not be the problem.
18/21 with light armour and backup weapon worked quite nice for me. I had only trouble with naked or also light armoured 2h agi builds, but he you can not counter everything.