cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: tankmen on July 21, 2011, 11:54:06 pm

Title: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: tankmen on July 21, 2011, 11:54:06 pm
i do not think these weapons should be able to block, they are the best support weapon in the game, go thru teammates and have an absurd hit box, i am talking about long spear but to nerf that you need to nerf pike, to nerf both of those you'd need to nerf the lances 
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Magikarp on July 21, 2011, 11:57:46 pm
This is too much of a nerf for me, I'd rather see the long spear get less speed, so it retains the anti cav value, but gets nerfed versus infantry.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Lordark on July 21, 2011, 11:59:09 pm
well if the devs cant nerf speed there only 1 other logical choice.....

Keep the pike as a support weapon not a 245 reach war spear
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Beans on July 22, 2011, 12:36:48 am
This is too much of a nerf for me, I'd rather see the long spear get less speed, so it retains the anti cav value, but gets nerfed versus infantry.

You realize that even if it had a speed of 10 the players that dominate with the 90 degree turn, the scoop, or the helicopter would still dominate?

Speed of the weapon has no effect in that style, it just has to slowly accelerate forward at all from the thrust then the spin does the rest.

edit: wait a second doesn't speed have an effect on block speed? If it had slow speed maybe it couldn't block. Do weapon speeds work for blocking like shields speed?
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Joxer on July 22, 2011, 06:26:59 am
Yeah make it so that long spear users cant block  :rolleyes: How bad have you guys gotten owned to cry about that?
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Tears of Destiny on July 22, 2011, 06:31:47 am
All I could think of when reading this thread was...

Did Walt_F4 team up with Chaos and do another pike night?
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Corrado_Decimo on July 22, 2011, 12:15:09 pm
again. the long spear is a support weapon. low damage (26p thrust. at least 3 hits on a medium armored enemy with 6PS)and slow (81 speed). is useless in a 1vs1 but shine in a 3+vs3+ context. killing a lone pikeman is damn effortless. just facehug. who gets raped by a pikeman in a 1vs1 should really consider to quit and play facebook's farmville.

EDIT:

long spear/pike is not made for kills. is made for anti-cav and stun infantry. is really fine as it is.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Lordark on July 22, 2011, 12:24:21 pm
Pike needs a new name


Agility whores disco stick.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Gheritarish le Loki on July 22, 2011, 12:48:35 pm
Can we make shield unable to block my arrows, damm i shoot at the head but its stuck on the shield....

No seriously guys, do you realy have problem versus pike users?
On a one-on-one pike user have no chance, on a 2 vs 1 ok the pike is good, but are you asking to have advantage when facing 2 opponents?
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: MadJackMcMad on July 22, 2011, 09:17:52 pm
There is a small aesthetic niggle with getting stabbed by the pole rather than the point.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Tears of Destiny on July 22, 2011, 09:20:43 pm
There is a small aesthetic niggle with getting stabbed by the pole rather than the point.

I am mere concerned with other aesthetic niggles such as this remarkable greeting I received from Air, one of our resident throwers.
(click to show/hide)

EDIT: Picture added

This to me looks more odd then being stabbed by a blunt pole.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: MadJackMcMad on July 22, 2011, 09:40:01 pm
This to me looks more odd then being stabbed by a blunt pole.

Not quite as odd as if it were a throwing hammer.

EDIT - In retrospect, how are we not to know the wooden pole pictured has not been sharpened?  The end of it is buried somewhere behind your nasal cavity.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Fartface on July 24, 2011, 07:30:05 pm
you guys prob havent dueled craftybadger with an long spear or me on my old char pikemanD.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: ArchonAlarion on July 25, 2011, 05:46:12 am
I'd rather see these weapons non-blockable. They are too long and clumsy to properly block with, and rapid changing of blocks, especially in crowded areas is ridiculous. Note that my main is a polearm user, and currently I have the longspear on my default loadout.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Corrado_Decimo on July 25, 2011, 12:22:11 pm
you guys prob havent dueled craftybadger with an long spear or me on my old char pikemanD.

uhm i dueled him yesterday for a good hour. he's really good with that but still (as it should be) too slow with the long spear to duel properly.
long spears are fine as they are because they shine among the brawl but aren't effective in 1vs1.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Bazinga on July 25, 2011, 12:24:06 pm
uhm i dueled him yesterday for a good hour. he's really good with that but still (as it should be) too slow with the long spear to duel properly.
long spears are fine as they are because they shine among the brawl but aren't effective in 1vs1.

This. If you know what you're doing, you can't loose against a pikeman in 1vs1.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Lordark on July 26, 2011, 06:51:30 am
I remember back in the day you could not block with pikes... 245 reach is like a great lance. You cant block with those either. For the sake of balance... LET CAV USE PIKES!
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Cyclopsided on July 26, 2011, 09:24:39 pm
Honestly? This fucking thread, lol.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: dodnet on July 26, 2011, 11:33:53 pm
I remember back in the day you could not block with pikes... 245 reach is like a great lance. You cant block with those either. For the sake of balance... LET CAV USE PIKES!

Why dont give cav a 10 metre long lightsabre so no one can stop them anymore?
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Xerdena on July 27, 2011, 05:25:17 pm
I am mere concerned with other aesthetic niggles such as this remarkable greeting I received from Air, one of our resident throwers.

no longer a thrower,
i can feel the comunity's massive sigh of relief.
anywho my computer crapped out, hardrive's shot.
won't be on for a month or two so have fun everyone!


also: please grant greatlances the ability to block and stab or couch on foot whichever is fine
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Tears of Destiny on July 27, 2011, 09:25:07 pm
I am mere concerned with other aesthetic niggles such as this remarkable greeting I received from Air, one of our resident throwers.

no longer a thrower,
i can feel the comunity's massive sigh of relief.
anywho my computer crapped out, hardrive's shot.
won't be on for a month or two so have fun everyone!


also: please grant greatlances the ability to block and stab or couch on foot whichever is fine

:(
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Lordark on August 09, 2011, 01:10:46 pm
bump. Pole stun cause 2 much rage to be ignored!
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Banok on August 09, 2011, 05:26:06 pm
overhead stab but no block

AMIRIGHT?
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Cyclopsided on August 09, 2011, 08:38:37 pm
If you give an overhead stab, why take block away?
The thing being abused is the non-collision of overhead ~swings~ with pole arms.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Thucydides on August 09, 2011, 09:39:57 pm
overhead stab would probably be pretty glitchy
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Murmillus_Prime on August 09, 2011, 09:59:32 pm
Lances have been nerfed enough, no thank you.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Cyclopsided on August 09, 2011, 11:52:21 pm
overhead stab would probably be pretty glitchy
ever played FaS or any m&b mod with overhead stabs? They aren't.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Glyph on August 10, 2011, 07:39:39 pm
ever played FaS or any m&b mod with overhead stabs? They aren't.
like in vikingr, really awsome, i'd prefer if spear-type waepons like lances, spears and stuff. get an overhead thrust instead of the goofy overhead attack we have now.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Lordark on August 12, 2011, 07:41:36 am
like in vikingr, really awsome, i'd prefer if spear-type waepons like lances, spears and stuff. get an overhead thrust instead of the goofy overhead attack we have now.


-- Listen to him mods he is much wise.

Then after we do that we can nerf 2h speed and every1 is happy since mods love 2 nerf shit!

AMIRITE???
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: The_Angle on August 12, 2011, 09:35:14 am
I imagine one day we could continue to nerf things until.

visitors can't see pics , please register or login
 (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/830/glanceseverywhere.png/)

Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Corrado_Decimo on August 12, 2011, 10:57:08 am
I imagine one day we could continue to nerf things until.

visitors can't see pics , please register or login
 (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/830/glanceseverywhere.png/)

this will probably happen. but we'll roll max strength / 3 agility builds.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Chudleague on August 13, 2011, 04:16:15 am
I personally hate being stabbed by a person 2 ft away when they are wielding a 12 ft pole, that being said, their overhead attacks will come down on me while they have a teammate between the attacker and me.

It has to be one or the other, cant be both.

If i can get hit from 2 feet away while the end of the spear is 4 feet behind me, then the teammate should be hit FIRST in the overhand attack and it wouldn't reach me.

If It doesn't hit the teammate but the end comes down over the teammate and hits me then I shouldn't be able to be hit by the pike 4 ft away from the player.

Basically either the whole model needs a hit box on it, or just the pointy part, not both. As it stands currently its teammate biased and glitchy.

Id prefer that it would still be able to block, but not stab anyone inside its range.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Corrado_Decimo on August 13, 2011, 11:34:00 am
I personally hate being stabbed by a person 2 ft away when they are wielding a 12 ft pole, that being said, their overhead attacks will come down on me while they have a teammate between the attacker and me.

It has to be one or the other, cant be both.

If i can get hit from 2 feet away while the end of the spear is 4 feet behind me, then the teammate should be hit FIRST in the overhand attack and it wouldn't reach me.

If It doesn't hit the teammate but the end comes down over the teammate and hits me then I shouldn't be able to be hit by the pike 4 ft away from the player.

Basically either the whole model needs a hit box on it, or just the pointy part, not both. As it stands currently its teammate biased and glitchy.

Id prefer that it would still be able to block, but not stab anyone inside its range.

the hitboxes are fine. the facts is people master the stab use by turning and releasing before aiming. i say hitboxes are fine because if you stab while standing still at short range, you glance.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Deracination on August 13, 2011, 06:07:18 pm
I don't really have a problem with the balance of these; I understand it's a lot harder to use a weapon only effective if you spin like a ballerina.  Getting stabbed by them turning sideways and moving the shaft through my torso is just cheesy looking, though.  I think, if anything, you could just give it side-swing as well as overhead animations that had hitboxes along the whole pole for blunt damage as well as a stab whose hitbox was only the tip and did piercing.  Dunno how the coding for that'd work, though.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Chudleague on August 13, 2011, 07:08:30 pm
the hitboxes are fine. the facts is people master the stab use by turning and releasing before aiming. i say hitboxes are fine because if you stab while standing still at short range, you glance.

And that is really the problem, with all attacks too.

Sword stabs can last a lot longer than is reasonable (But that could be explained as he is running forward with his sword forward ale Aragorn).
Sometimes you release your block after you've already blocked and the sword remains and stabs you.

Overhead attacks can miss your body, but if they turn into you at any point during the "attack" like after it hits the ground it just slides into the side of your ankle through the dirt and hits you for the same amount of damage.

But with long polearms its the worst. Most of the time when they do it with long spears and pikes the spear is waving it and out of the ground unrealistically. And yes they attack and spin into you, but still its a "stab" and the only part that can stab is way behind me. No matter what direction I'm aiming, if I have a 12ft spear and your 4 or less feet from me it is physically impossible for me to poke you with it.

The only explanation that could be viable, and its flimsy, is that they are holding it close to the point so its only a 4 ft spear and the rest is behind them, but that should require a different animation and an 'x' to change your grip on it.

Thats my QQ for the day.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Corrado_Decimo on August 13, 2011, 08:46:23 pm
And that is really the problem, with all attacks too.

Sword stabs can last a lot longer than is reasonable (But that could be explained as he is running forward with his sword forward ale Aragorn).
Sometimes you release your block after you've already blocked and the sword remains and stabs you.

Overhead attacks can miss your body, but if they turn into you at any point during the "attack" like after it hits the ground it just slides into the side of your ankle through the dirt and hits you for the same amount of damage.

But with long polearms its the worst. Most of the time when they do it with long spears and pikes the spear is waving it and out of the ground unrealistically. And yes they attack and spin into you, but still its a "stab" and the only part that can stab is way behind me. No matter what direction I'm aiming, if I have a 12ft spear and your 4 or less feet from me it is physically impossible for me to poke you with it.

The only explanation that could be viable, and its flimsy, is that they are holding it close to the point so its only a 4 ft spear and the rest is behind them, but that should require a different animation and an 'x' to change your grip on it.

Thats my QQ for the day.

you're right but i don't think devs can fix game engine flaws by themselves. messing with hitboxes will give you other stuff to deal with... like a pikeman sticked behind his friend's huscarl shielder spamming thrusts (without teamhitting his friend ahead) while the shielder blocks all.
Title: Re: long spear, pike, lance and heavy lance
Post by: Mckillroy on August 20, 2011, 12:26:01 am
Look the main issue is that lances were one hit kill. Yes u could continue to move forward with the lance while it was in the enemy,but that would just make u fall off the horse or be no use whats o ever as cav since your so found of your lance to leave it behind. It should be when u hit a enemy on foot in the TORSO area u should lose your lance (don't mean u need to repair it every time u use it though) but it should not work after(or at least make it for u drop the lace and yes even when u hit the shield and nock down the shielder to). The only time a lace could be used more then once is if u hit the soft juicy head because it would just be a through in through.(with the right momentum).  and whats with this new stab motion on horse back u just break your arm

Cav are not the main force just the back up