Author Topic: Las Vegas SHooting  (Read 11054 times)

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Offline McKli_PL

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #30 on: October 03, 2017, 06:28:24 am »
0
Maybe suicide by cop?
yeah sbc also, if its 'triggered' by fear,pain or in most cases guilt it's neurotic behavior

Offline Xant

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #31 on: October 03, 2017, 07:25:11 am »
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psychopathic or sociopathic person can not be a suicidal type because they are not neurotic lul
#science
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Offline IR_Kuoin

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #32 on: October 03, 2017, 10:22:50 am »
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Confirmed MK ultra yet?
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Offline SixThumbs

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #33 on: October 03, 2017, 01:20:49 pm »
+2
At the very least I wish we'd hear what pharmaceuticals these people were on.
And how!

Offline njames89

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #34 on: October 03, 2017, 01:38:48 pm »
+1
At the very least I wish we'd hear what pharmaceuticals these people were on.

So what you're saying is the tapwater made him do it...

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Offline Bittersteel

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #35 on: October 03, 2017, 01:53:04 pm »
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Yeah, it's clearly the abundance of firearms, not like this guy had a bunch of military grade automatic rifles that are already illegal to posess.

Can you source this? It would be a great argument against gun control if he used a weapon which is illegal to posess, which means criminals/psychos will get their hand on these sort of weapons for mass-shootings anyways, but I can't find it anywhere.


Offline njames89

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #36 on: October 03, 2017, 02:04:58 pm »
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Can you source this? It would be a great argument against gun control if he used a weapon which is illegal to posess, which means criminals/psychos will get their hand on these sort of weapons for mass-shootings anyways, but I can't find it anywhere.

I believe they are illegal in most places but legal in some

Offline Bittersteel

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #37 on: October 03, 2017, 02:29:10 pm »
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So you can bypass law by buying it in another state? Or can you only buy weapons in the state that you're a resident of?

I personally think gun laws should be very strict for people with a history of criminality and mental issues and so do most I assume, it seems like many school shooters fall into the latter category but are still allowed to buy guns. But then you got cases like this, an apparently normal guy, what do?

I also read up a bit on homicide per capita, and if you only count whites, the U.S homicide rate is 2.5 per 100k, not much higher then Belgium's 1.89. It seems like media doesn't take into consideration that most homicides are related to afro-americans which only make up about 12% of the population.

And about 2/3rds of gun related deaths are suicides.

Offline Vibe

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #38 on: October 03, 2017, 02:31:59 pm »
+1
Can you source this? It would be a great argument against gun control if he used a weapon which is illegal to posess, which means criminals/psychos will get their hand on these sort of weapons for mass-shootings anyways, but I can't find it anywhere.

You can hear the gunfire. Automatic weapons are illegal in US (gun being older than 1986 is an exception though), only semi-autos aren't. Apparently he either had an illegal fully auto rifle, or (ilegally) modded his semi-auto for full auto fire.

Offline Bittersteel

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #39 on: October 03, 2017, 02:38:15 pm »
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You can hear the gunfire. Automatic weapons are illegal in US, only semi-autos aren't. Apparently he either had an illegal fully auto rifle, or (ilegally) modded his semi-auto for full auto fire.

I'd say it's a valid argument against gun control if he somehow got a hold of a weapon that's illegal.

It wouldn't be if you can simply mod a legal weapon to become a killing machine and that weapon is regarded as "illegal", then claim he was using an "illegal" weapon to soothe gun control activists.

Offline Xant

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #40 on: October 03, 2017, 02:50:38 pm »
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Do Belgium's stats also only count whites?
Does it matter? Belgium's non-whites don't have a gangsta ghetto culture. It's clear that America's do, and the statistics show that that is the real problem, not the guns.
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Offline POOPHAMMER

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #41 on: October 03, 2017, 02:52:24 pm »
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Uther Pendragon: dont worry i wasnt planning on trusting you anyway

Offline Xant

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #42 on: October 03, 2017, 02:58:41 pm »
+1

Yeah. Generally if you're comparing stats from one country to another country, it's usually best practice to change the same variables for both populations. Otherwise you might be tricked into believing the flawed stats mean something. "If we take an incomplete homicide rate for the US, and compare it to the complete homicide rate in Belgium... the US is still worse"
Are you implying that Belgium has a gang problem like the US? Or that its black and Latino population are killing each other by droves all the time and by such great numbers that it has more than an insignificant effect on the final statistics? Yes, ideally you'd separate Belgium's whites from non-whites as well, but since those stats aren't available, the next best (and accurate enough for all intents and purposes) thing is to look at their complete crime statistics, since Belgium doesn't have ghettofied black areas with hundreds of black-on-black murders all the time.
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Offline Xant

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #43 on: October 03, 2017, 02:59:21 pm »
+2
Guns are not the problem.

United States' homicide rate per 100,000 inhabitants is 4,7. Russia's is 10,2, even though handguns are completely prohibited and long guns are strongly restricted.

4,7 is a high number compared to European countries: it is, however, an average gotten from 50 states with wildly varying homicide rates. Hawaii has 0,5 (half of Western Europe's average) and Louisiana has 10,54 (slightly higher than Russia) - and the average is gotten from these and the other 48 less extreme states.

Hawaii does not have a problem with violence, Louisiana does. To get relevant numbers, one mustn't look at the United States on the whole, but as it is: an union of different states, cultures and  people.

Switzerland has one of the most liberal gun policies of Western Europe, and yet one of the smallest homicide rates: 0,7. In the United Kingdom, all handguns and semi-automatic rifles are illegal, but its rate (1,2) is distinctly bigger.

United States has 89 firearms per one hundred citizens, and 3,2 homicides per 100,000 inhabitants are committed with those. Mexico has 15 firearms per hundred citizens, but 22,7 homicides per 100,000 inhabitants are committed with those.

The facts are that the presence of firearms does not have an effect on the amount of homicides, only on how they are committed.

The homicide rates per state are as follows:

(click to show/hide)

The north-east and west are the most peaceful, the mid-west a bit more restless, and the south the most violent by a good margin. 43,6% of murders were committed in the south (15 states).

Out of 17-29 year-olds, there are twice more black victims than white.

Now, is there a correlation between gun laws and homicides?

In Alaska, Arizona, Vermont and Wyoming, you can carry a loaded gun both openly and concealed without a permit. These states receive six stars (******).

After those come states in which open carry is unrestricted, but concealed carry requires a permit that officials have to issue: Idaho, Nevada, New Mexico, Montana, South Dakota, Kentucky, Virginia, Colorado, Washington, Oregon, Nebraska, Kansas, Missouri, Louisiana, Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, West Virginia, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, Maine, North Carolina. They receive five stars (*****).

Third, states where you need a permit for open carry, and concealed carry is "shall-issue." (A Shall-Issue jurisdiction is one that requires a permit to carry a concealed handgun, but where the granting of such permits is subject only to meeting determinate criteria laid out in the law; the granting authority has no discretion in the awarding of the permits, and there is no requirement of the applicant to demonstrate "good cause".): Utah, North Dakota, Minnesota, Oklahoma, Mississippi, Tennessee, Georgia, Indiana, Iowa, Connecticut and Delaware. These receive four stars (****).

Fourth, states where open carry requires a permit, and concealed carry is "may-issue": Massachusetts and Rhode Island. These receive three stars. (***).

Texas, Arkansas, South Carolina and Florida are "shall-issue" states where open carry is not permitted. They receive two stars. (**).

California and New York are "may-issue" states that do not permit open carry. Hawaii, Maryland and New Jersey completely disallow concealed carry, but give permits for open carry. These receive one star. (*).

Illinois and District of Columbia completely ban both concealed and open carry, and do not receive a single star. States with an "assault weapon ban" also receive a minus (-).

(click to show/hide)

As we can see, finding a clear correlation is difficult. Both the most peaceful state Hawaii and the murder capital Washington DC have harsh gun laws in effect.

In conclusion, gun laws do not seem to have any effect on homicide rates in the United States. The same correlation can be seen internationally.
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Offline Xant

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Re: Las Vegas SHooting
« Reply #44 on: October 03, 2017, 04:18:57 pm »
+1
I'm implying that comparing cherry-picked data from one country to complete data from another to try and make one country look less shitty is not very productive. I've never had cause to investigate the Belgian homicide rate.

Here's the great thing, if we could compare like-for-like data you'd probably be able to answer the above questions with hard numbers.

The last time I had this debate with an American I proposed that we compare a US State with any European country that has equivalent population and equivalent % black people living in it to get round this obstacle. They didn't like the numbers that came out of that. Apparently I cherry-picked to get the numbers I wanted rather than take national stats and ignore parts of them till they nearly matched unaltered stats for a European country.

How is it cherry picked? Again, do you think Belgium has a black-on-black violence epidemic like the US? If not, what makes you think the statistics would be significantly different if they were excluded?

What you proposed to the American makes absolutely no sense unless the American was trying to argue that the Black Man as a race is incapable of co-existing peacefully. Clearly there's a cultural issue in the US with the Latinos and blacks and it doesn't make any sense to try to equate them to their European counterparts.
Meaning lies as much
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