Mass Slaughter

[Kafein]

No, Molly. You're the one being wrong.

What apparently everybody except you understood (and I have a hard time understanding it any other way even though I tried) when reading your post is that you thought "cultural heritage" was an excuse for something that would otherwise be unacceptable. That's wrong. Facts are, that there are plenty enough of those whales around. It would be fine to kill them even if the "massacre" was a one-year fad based on a popular novel written by a New-Yorker on cocaine who visited the Faroes once.

[Falka]

Respect for their death.  And knowing its death youre talking about. Not just another burger.

People tend to put too much emphasis on drawing conclusions from personal experience. There's really no need for me to kill a pig to realize that the meat which I eat once was a living creature.

[Molly]

No, Molly. You're the one being wrong.

What apparently everybody except you understood (and I have a hard time understanding it any other way even though I tried) when reading your post is that you thought "cultural heritage" was an excuse for something that would otherwise be unacceptable. That's wrong. Facts are, that there are plenty enough of those whales around. It would be fine to kill them even if the "massacre" was a one-year fad based on a popular novel written by a New-Yorker on cocaine who visited the Faroes once.

Maybe we should clearly state what we're actually talking about cuz there are 2 points here:
1. being that they kill those whales when they could eat... chicken.
2. the way they kill them

to 1.) There are enough of them around that killing and eating the produce is okay
to 2.) This is prolly the real issue here. It looks like a cheap horror movie. Personally, I doubt that most beef and pork meat is produced in a much less stress inducing way. They probably try but I doubt it works. Not to mention the way they are held. But here the tradition comes into play. I do not know the historical background for his but there is a lot of room to assume parts of it that are very likely: initiating boys into manhood, forcing team work and traditional ways of hunting them.
That is far from unacceptable. That's why I pointed out that, and I still think you do, you deliberately put a statement in my mouth that I never made. I made very clear by now that I solely pointed that statement towards that specific way of hunting that specific animal. And especially because it would be okay even if "the "massacre" was a one-year fad based on a popular novel written by a New-Yorker on cocaine who visited the Faroes once" I still don't see the issue with my statement. You generalize it when it's not meant to be generalized, like Leshma did.

tl;dr: I talk specific when you still assume I talk general.

[Kafein]

Maybe we should clearly state what we're actually talking about cuz there are 2 points here:
1. being that they kill those whales when they could eat... chicken.
2. the way they kill them

to 1.) There are enough of them around that killing and eating the produce is okay
to 2.) This is prolly the real issue here. It looks like a cheap horror movie. Personally, I doubt that most beef and pork meat is produced in a much less stress inducing way. They probably try but I doubt it works. Not to mention the way they are held. But here the tradition comes into play. I do not know the historical background for his but there is a lot of room to assume parts of it that are very likely: initiating boys into manhood, forcing team work and traditional ways of hunting them.
That is far from unacceptable. That's why I pointed out that, and I still think you do, you deliberately put a statement in my mouth that I never made. I made very clear by now that I solely pointed that statement towards that specific way of hunting that specific animal. And especially because it would be okay even if "the "massacre" was a one-year fad based on a popular novel written by a New-Yorker on cocaine who visited the Faroes once" I still don't see the issue with my statement. You generalize it when it's not meant to be generalized, like Leshma did.

tl;dr: I talk specific when you still assume I talk general.

Well now you're coming up with unrelated stuff. Regardless, if your previous post was not meant to be generalized in some way (which is really, really not clear at all but okay), then what was your point? "In this particular instance I think it's fine because of their cultural heritage" is a meaningless statement, unless you think cultural heritage *is* actually a valid excuse for something, and we go back to square one.

[Molly]

Now you're just arguing for the sake of arguing

[F i n]

People tend to put too much emphasis on drawing conclusions from personal experience. There's really no need for me to kill a pig to realize that the meat which I eat once was a living creature.

Maybe not you. But could you agree, that if the majority would know what its really about, they would maybe not buy cheap supermarket meat every day - and therefor not support the mass slaughter facilities?

Knowing what meat is. Knowing what meat means, makes you buy your meat from local, fair butchers, makes you "celebrate" your once-in-a-week steak.

And since it's basically murder we are talking about, there should be a bit more conciousness in peoples minds. Especially when it comes to supporting or not supporting bad quality meat from animals that are, under the worst conditions, raised for the sole purpose of feeding fat, stupid, ignorant people.

Having to kill at least one of the thousands of animals a human being consumes during his or her lifetime, might achieve just that.

It definately did for me.

You got my point now or do i need to specify more...?

[Leesin]

It's pathetic how blown out of proportion this has become, the ignorance is astonishing. These Whales suffer far less than a lot of livestock we use for sustenance day in day out, these whales live free their entire lives and a very small amount of them are killed fairly quickly in this 'slaughter' each year, a slaughter that is never going to drive them into extinction. The whale meat provides the islanders a decent amount of meat to consume at little expense, why should they stop it just because a few hippies can't handle seeing some blood in the water. I learned the value of it myself after catching rabbits, breaking their necks, skinning and gutting them, it isn't nice but it's how meat ends up on our plates and has done so for far longer than these new age hippy fucks have been crying about it.

[Gravoth_iii]

Ignorance is bliss, ill stay ignorant till i have more money. I could go for some whale too, never tried that.

Ive seen enough videos of pig slaughter if i actually went to one id probably become a vegan, and fuck that. Slaughtering one of my own would be hard to get over since i often struggle with killing bugs, even spiders and i hate spiders.

[Falka]

But could you agree, that if the majority would know what its really about, they would maybe not buy cheap supermarket meat every day - and therefor not support the mass slaughter facilities?

Knowing what meat is. Knowing what meat means, makes you buy your meat from local, fair butchers

Nope, I couldn't. I don't agree that people don't know "what meat is" and "what meat means" in the first place. Maybe we shouldn't have a high opinion of human intelligence, but people aren't that dumb to don't know that the piece of meat on their plate used to be a pig or a cow which someone had to kill. They're just indifferent and I highly doubt that killing by your own hand an animal would change their attitude. After all in POland each year almost in every family someone kill a carp for christmas eve dinner and guess what, people still don't give a damn.

Having to kill at least one of the thousands of animals a human being consumes during his or her lifetime, might achieve just that.

It definately did for me.

So because of some personal, anecdotal experience you'd like to force all kids to kill a chicken?  Even though part, if not most, of them would be able to realize the same as you without a need to kill an animal? Great, then I have another anecdotal evidence for you. A friend of mine who was a vegetarian never in his life killed a chicken. Or any other animal. Conclusions?

PS. I'm sure the practical aspect of the whole operation would be very... interesting. All these shool trips, going to the "local butchers" to " kill, clean and eat a chicken" 

[Kafein]

In this particular instance I think it's fine because only *our* cultural heritage makes killing that particular animal somehow 'ugly' or different than killing a pig or a cow or a lamb. That's if you want to latch onto the cultural heritage point Molly stated. Who are we to say 'ew, eating whales isn't cool man', that's far different than the extreme examples of 'derp, I guess my culture allows me to eat humans'.

In prehistory over in bonny Britain eating waterfowl seemed to be taboo for some weird reason, in most of our history eating dogs is taboo (apart from some weird period approx. 3000 years ago where that was fine - but not before or after that period). Over here it'd be weird to eat insects despite the obvious nutritional benefits. These things change and there's not always an objective 'truth' to what animals should or should not be eaten, it all draws very strongly on what you're accustomed to ending up on your plate.

That's if you want to be general based on your cultural prejudices over what should or should not be eaten. I bet the way we butcher and eat cows is distasteful to some cultures, do we turn around and obey their cultural norm regarding what animals are 'good' to eat? Hell no.

Okay, first of all I don't know why you bring eating habits into this. As I said, killing whales that are not endangered or otherwise critically important in their biome is just as fine if you do it for eating or for making beauty products or for the pleasure of the hunt or traditions or whatever. My objectivist view on the matter is that whether killing an animal is okay or not does not depend on why you're killing it, it depends on the animal itself. It is an universal good to preserve biodiversity and to keep ecosystems stable. This has nothing to do with what animals are good to eat in my culture or anyone else's.

[Overdriven]

Nope, I couldn't. I don't agree that people don't know "what meat is" and "what meat means" in the first place. Maybe we shouldn't have a high opinion of human intelligence, but people aren't that dumb to don't know that the piece of meat on their plate used to be a pig or a cow which someone had to kill. They're just indifferent and I highly doubt that killing by your own hand an animal would change their attitude. After all in POland each year almost in every family someone kill a carp for christmas eve dinner and guess what, people still don't give a damn.

So because of some personal, anecdotal experience you'd like to force all kids to kill a chicken?  Even though part, if not most, of them would be able to realize the same as you without a need to kill an animal? Great, then I have another anecdotal evidence for you. A friend of mine who was a vegetarian never in his life killed a chicken. Or any other animal. Conclusions?

PS. I'm sure the practical aspect of the whole operation would be very... interesting. All these shool trips, going to the "local butchers" to " kill, clean and eat a chicken" 

It's about detachment. It's all very well having some vague idea of where your meat comes from. But very few people are confronted by that in reality. Having to do something yourself, in front of your face, is very different from simply being aware of something going on somewhere. It's very easy to detach yourself from the process and most people do just by being so far removed from it.

The same goes for any life experience. Sure you might be aware there are people living in slums some place in the world. But it hits much harder when you go and see that first hand.

[Xant]

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


They deserved it for their actions.

[Leshma]

From what I've gathered through the years, think that Kafein don't give a flying fuck about traditions. If you want to use "its mah culture" card as an excuse for doing some stupid shit, that won't fly when it comes to Kafein.

Cannibalism is also part of the culture of many tribes and it isn't just about treating human as food source. One tribe in Polynesia or Indonesia or Micronesia or wherever somewhere between Asia and Austrialia, is practicing cannibalism. But it ain't just eating unfortunate foreigners because of their silky white skin. They do it because when an elder is dying, he whispers on someone's ear who is the person responsible for his death. They have a belief where a demon is devouring people on their death bed. So when someone ill says a name, that member of a tribe isn't considered human anymore but a demon who killed and wants to devour fellow tribesman. Because of that, other tribesmen kill him, chop his head and extremities and serve him as a meal. It is their culture bruh!

[Gravoth_iii]

From what I've gathered through the years, think that Kafein don't give a flying fuck about traditions. If you want to use "its mah culture" card as an excuse for doing some stupid shit, that won't fly when it comes to Kafein.

Cannibalism is also part of the culture of many tribes and it isn't just about treating human as food source. One tribe in Polynesia or Indonesia or Micronesia or wherever somewhere between Asia and Austrialia, is practicing cannibalism. But it ain't just eating unfortunate foreigners because of their silky white skin. They do it because when an elder dies, he whispers on someone's ear who is the person responsible for his death. They have a belief where a demon is devouring people on their death bed. So when someone ill says a name, that member of a tribe isn't considered human anymore but a demon who killed and wants to devour fellow tribesman. Because of that, other tribesmen kill him, chop his head and extremities and serve him as a meal. It is their culture bruh!

I wouldnt say no if i was served human meat tbh, as long as i wouldnt be punished for it in any way.

[Leshma]

Knowing what meat is. Knowing what meat means, makes you buy your meat from local, fair butchers, makes you "celebrate" your once-in-a-week steak.

You seem halfway to becoming a vegan. Most people don't care too much about livestock and they have a perfectly fine excuse for it. Humans, as top of the food chain who seem to care about each other tend to die in really stupid ways every second all around the world. While I'm writing this probably hundreds of emaciated kids died in Africa or India, many died from some nasty disease that makes death looks like salvation. And I can't do a bloody thing about it. Therefore don't think about it because I have enough things of mine to care about. Why the fuck should I care about livestock that is systematically bred to be slaughtered months after they are born?

People who care about such things don't have real issues in life and are overprotected by those around them, especially those who are part of organizations that are working to stop the slaughters of animals.