A way to give IF a buff

[Kafein]

^I have had a thought



What if this only effects base stats of armour!!!!



reduces maximum armour by 10! lowering maximum "armour" a fair bit and it buffs plate users over loomed kuyak users!

Can you just write this again in english because after reading several times I only came up with nonsensical meanings.

[Butan]

getting IF to survive 2 more hits sounds like a huge improvement, and in fact it's more than 2 unless you wear very little armor.

Against a 0PS pickaxe +0 opponent maybe.


If what you say is true, it means that, for 14 HP (from the 7 IF) to make you survive 2 hits or more, your opponent must (after damage reduction) strike you for less than 14 damage at each hit.

So if you are lvl 30 with 7 IF, you have 70 hit points.
If your average opponent only does less than 14 damage at each hit, that means you are able to tank about 5-6 hits from him with your fragile build with naked-light-medium armor.
Something is wrong with your maths Kafein   


(im not counting glances, bad hiltslash or nudge/kick damage, NOR I am counting peasants, troll builds/weapons)

7 IF + no armor = 0-1 extra hit
7 IF + light armor = 0-1 extra hit
7 IF + medium-heavy armor = 1-2 extra hits
7 IF + very heavy-ultra heavy armor = 1-5 extra hits

12 IF + no armor = 0-1 extra hit
12 IF + light armor = 0-1 extra hit
12 IF + medim-heavy armor = 1-5 extra hits
12 IF + very heavy-ultra heavy armor = 3-15 extra hits


Thats my experience in strength builds. Dont you see a problem somewhere ?

[Kafein]

Against a 0PS pickaxe +0 opponent maybe.


If what you say is true, it means that, for 14 HP (from the 7 IF) to make you survive 2 hits or more, your opponent must (after damage reduction) strike you for less than 14 damage at each hit.

So if you are lvl 30 with 7 IF, you have 70 hit points.
If your average opponent only does less than 14 damage at each hit, that means you are able to tank about 5-6 hits from him with your fragile build with naked-light-medium armor.
Something is wrong with your maths Kafein   

(im not counting glances, bad hiltslash or nudge/kick damage, NOR I am counting peasants, troll builds/weapons)

I believe we were talking about net damage, after armor reduce. So doing less than 14 makes perfect sense. Maybe the first part of my message was unclear, but even though more HP would be basically useless for me because I don't wear armor, the fact that I don't wear armor and often die at the first error I do, makes me realise how forgiving playing a tincan is. When you survive two hits, imagine that I would have died if I had taken that damage. That's my point.

7 IF + no armor = 0-1 extra hit
7 IF + light armor = 0-1 extra hit
7 IF + medium-heavy armor = 1-2 extra hits
7 IF + very heavy-ultra heavy armor = 1-5 extra hits

12 IF + no armor = 0-1 extra hit
12 IF + light armor = 0-1 extra hit
12 IF + medim-heavy armor = 1-5 extra hits
12 IF + very heavy-ultra heavy armor = 3-15 extra hits


Thats my experience in strength builds. Dont you see a problem somewhere ?

I don't completely agree with that chart. Already with 40ish total body armor if your total HP is higher than 70 you can take quite a beating.

[Butan]

Thats what I feel when I play, maybe I encounter too much +3 weapons users    It was much more beneficial to have IF months/years ago when most people didnt have masterwork weapons nor knew how to use them at 100% efficiency.


With 40 armor and 70 HP (ignoring ranged) you should die in 3-4 hits maximum, except against low PS - low base damage weapons (which are quite rare and absolutely not representative); with some exceptional cases you can have the situation you presented earlier with 5-6 hits survival rate, but only if you're lucky (damage randomness is still there) AND that you have at least a medium armor, like in your last example, and never naked or light...

[Tydeus]

Speed bonuses and sweetspots reduce damage by a fair bit. 14 damage a hit isn't exactly rare if you're hitting someone with 60+ body armor, especially if you're using a 1h cut weapon. Also, most melee have at least 50 armor, 40 is pretty low.