Author Topic: Split NA players from EU players.  (Read 15151 times)

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Offline Garem

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #120 on: July 12, 2011, 05:47:27 am »
+2
Strategus happens at weird hours, period. Internationalization/Diplomacy is the ONLY way to handle that. Would you rather be forced to be ready to fight at any time, or have an opposing clan from your own timezone manipulate the battles so that you have to fight at stupid times? For crying out loud, a midnight fight for a man in Seattle is at 3am for a guy in Miami. A 10 AM fight by a New Yorker forces a San Franciscan to wake up in time for a 7am fight.

Plus, how will you force clans to fight in their timezone? People always can and always will be able to manipulate time and distance/ping to their advantage. Unless Strategus set fights to occur at set times... but there are just too many fights going on and scheduling would be an absolute nightmare. And as I understand it, there's no chance of getting an Icelandic server so there's no good solution for preventing that, either. Again, internationalization and diplomacy are really your only options. And for whatever fucking reason, NA clans seem to be violently opposed to working with those filthy Europeans (sic). Really, I hear a lot of shit about Europeans on the NA servers. No idea why; they do the majority of the groundwork in making this game fun, running tournaments and events to keep things fresh. I digress.

A two-continent idea is fine, I'm all for shaking things up with geography (although separated by water? that sounds silly- make passage between them possible!) and I can't conceive of any downsides. Just don't expect it to solve the problems being highlighted.
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Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #121 on: July 12, 2011, 06:41:02 am »
0
And for whatever fucking reason, NA clans seem to be violently opposed to working with those filthy Europeans (sic). Really, I hear a lot of shit about Europeans on the NA servers.

Same reason why a lot of EU players talk crap about NA. The average individual has never lived outside of his or her country, and dare I say that opens one's mind.

Bias and stereotypes are bound to happen, both in malicious ways, good fun, and not even knowing it. My parents still stereotype Russia like it is still the 80s...
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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #122 on: July 12, 2011, 06:41:49 am »
0
Plus, how will you force clans to fight in their timezone? People always can and always will be able to manipulate time and distance/ping to their advantage. Unless Strategus set fights to occur at set times... but there are just too many fights going on and scheduling would be an absolute nightmare. And as I understand it, there's no chance of getting an Icelandic server so there's no good solution for preventing that, either. Again, internationalization and diplomacy are really your only options. And for whatever fucking reason, NA clans seem to be violently opposed to working with those filthy Europeans (sic). Really, I hear a lot of shit about Europeans on the NA servers. No idea why; they do the majority of the groundwork in making this game fun, running tournaments and events to keep things fresh. I digress.

A two-continent idea is fine, I'm all for shaking things up with geography (although separated by water? that sounds silly- make passage between them possible!) and I can't conceive of any downsides. Just don't expect it to solve the problems being highlighted.

The EU clans don't run any tournaments for NA clans, so I don't know why you would bring up doing any groundwork in making the game fun. A lot of NA clans worked with EU clans in order to cover all the hours and fight on each other's "home turf" when appropriate. You should know this because you are in Fallen. I'm not aware of any NA clans being "violently opposed" to working with EU clans. Any shit talking you hear about Europeans on the NA servers is probably just nationalism and ribbing at you because you mentioned you were from some other place. We do the same thing to Canadians.
 
Separation by water would still allow clans to interact if they had access to a port-city, and any serious invasion would be possible, but only under the unification of all nations on one continent.
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Offline Matey

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #123 on: July 12, 2011, 07:42:14 am »
0
i have nothing against the EU players... and thats why i want a split. I want to fight the NA players that bug me without having to worry about the EU clans wiping us all out while we are in-fighting. :D

Offline Soldier_of_God

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #124 on: July 12, 2011, 05:36:53 pm »
0
The Knights of the Black Rose is a split-off of na players from The Risen, and still maintains relations. we have many diplomatic interests from around the world... i founded this clan.

that being said the idea of fighting any EU is not appealing because of ping. i get 240+ ping on european servers, personally. i would do it, but, if we didn't have to fight EU potentially, that would make things a lot more strait forward with politics, and strategus.

Offline Garem

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #125 on: July 13, 2011, 05:08:02 pm »
+1
The EU clans don't run any tournaments for NA clans, so I don't know why you would bring up doing any groundwork in making the game fun. A lot of NA clans worked with EU clans in order to cover all the hours and fight on each other's "home turf" when appropriate. You should know this because you are in Fallen. I'm not aware of any NA clans being "violently opposed" to working with EU clans. Any shit talking you hear about Europeans on the NA servers is probably just nationalism and ribbing at you because you mentioned you were from some other place. We do the same thing to Canadians.
 
Separation by water would still allow clans to interact if they had access to a port-city, and any serious invasion would be possible, but only under the unification of all nations on one continent.

cRPG events are run almost exclusively by EU folks, and at times that NA players can definitely make. I've participated in about 8+ scrimmage matches, three 150 player battles, 1 Fallen tournament, several multi-clan training sessions, and organized FRAPS/video shootings since the beginning of the year despite my living in CST (no clue what info led you to deduce that I was not American; in fact, my post itself implied that I was an NA player, not to mention that you've skewered me countless times before in cRPG).

So no, I absolutely stand by my assertions because my experience speaks for itself. Evening events in Europe are afternoon events for North America. Plus, there hasn't been any argument with the REAL point of my post- you have to have diverse players and timezones regardless of fighting people in your hemisphere or in another. That's the nature of Strategus and it won't change because of a split, therefore, none of the issues being raised are going to be fixed by a split. Suggest another solution that works (set or negotiable times for battles, for example) or just DEAL with it by finding an ally across the pond. As you say, I should know- and I do. It works, it makes things more fun. So you're agreeing with me? Your point is muddled, PZ. You seemingly promote internationalization on one hand, and then argue for dumbing down Strategus with an ineffectual solution in the other. Why?

Plus, port cities are fucking stupid because it takes the dev team 7 months just to hit to Power On switch for Strategus with virtually nothing being changed. I'm teasing, of course, but there's still a take-away point here. Keep it simple. Geography changes are easy and do the same damn thing as this peculiar "port" idea that seems to persist despite very obvious reasons for being unfavorable.

Soldier_of_God. You state that you have Risen as EU allies. Then say that you didn't want to have to fight EU pings... that's a self-contradiction. You don't, hence your alliance with Risen. That's what you're supposed to do, what makes Strategus interesting and complex.
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Offline [ptx]

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #126 on: July 13, 2011, 05:20:10 pm »
0
As far as i understand, the idea of 2 continents is that you can still fight on other continents battles, if you so badly want to, but you are NOT forced to do so, if you wish to actually do something in strategus, like, attack a neighboring faction.

Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #127 on: July 13, 2011, 05:25:29 pm »
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I am against two separate continents simply because of massive powerblocks like the Northern Empire. I know that EU has their own powerblock from old strat but it makes up a smaller percentage then the NA version...

And again, what about clans that are big for both EU and NA? I don't want the Fallen split.
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Offline [ptx]

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #128 on: July 13, 2011, 05:28:47 pm »
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Tod, Northern Empire said that they would split up, if there was a separate strategus or at least a continent for them. AFAIK, they only exist cuz of the shared strat.

Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #129 on: July 13, 2011, 05:29:55 pm »
+1
Tod, Northern Empire said that they would split up, if there was a separate strategus or at least a continent for them. AFAIK, they only exist cuz of the shared strat.

ptx, I don't believe them to be perfectly blunt.
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Offline Soldier_of_God

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #130 on: July 15, 2011, 08:19:00 am »
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first, i'm not dead set against it.

The reason why I was against it is that
a) strategus is not first and foremost a war simulation, it's a medieval simulation, war only happens sometimes. That's why I claim that pings are not the most important thing. There's still diplomacy and trade.
b) Two worls would be impossible for me to maintain. It's simply not intended to be running on a dpulicated server.

We will probably go for the continent approach or something like that. Either way, it's further down the road and not planned for the next big release because we have other things to do for that :)

Im curious, why would it be impossible to maintain?

If having a Dup server is the problem, why not just make a strat map with two sections, one NA one EU that runs on the same server? surely it would not be too hard to force all eu's or na's to spawn and stay on one continent?

Offline Blondin

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #131 on: July 15, 2011, 04:24:36 pm »
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Im curious, why would it be impossible to maintain?

If having a Dup server is the problem, why not just make a strat map with two sections, one NA one EU that runs on the same server? surely it would not be too hard to force all eu's or na's to spawn and stay on one continent?

Seriously it's may be not hard, but it needs a lot of work (create and code the map, code the spawn, code water...) it's pretty useless, there is more important things to do, first release the new Strategus, after that we can talk of splitt the community.

I don't know why NA clans are so much affraid of EU...?


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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #132 on: July 15, 2011, 04:32:21 pm »
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ptx, I don't believe them to be perfectly blunt.

Honestly, I expect them to split up on their own now that ATS can't buy the other clans with land they had from before under their brave strategy of complete neutrality during the entire last strategus.

But on the main point, you literally could duplicate the map of Calradia, attach it to the western ocean and have 2 continents.  Having every map have 1 copy somewhere else is not a big deal and you could proabbly do this in one night and be set.  Its funny already you have to give more deference to small EU clans than large NA clans and vice versa if you are from EU, because fighting with 200 ping is extremely costly in troops and equipment.

You can always refine it down the road.  I have to tell you its already getting insanely crowded on this small map.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2011, 04:34:36 pm by Keshian »
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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #133 on: July 16, 2011, 11:28:40 am »
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this is a good idea, there is no point in having fight at 5 am
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Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: Split NA players from EU players.
« Reply #134 on: July 16, 2011, 05:17:21 pm »
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this is a good idea, there is no point in having fight at 5 am

Sure there is, it represents night-time attacks! :lol:
I'm not normal and I don't pretend so, my approach is pretty much a bomb crescendo.
Death is a fun way to pass the time though, several little bullets moving in staccato.
The terror of my reign will live on in infamy, singing when they die like a dead man's symphony.