Please to make balance for 1H

[Macropus]

2h animations are far superior from the game mechanic point of view.
1h animations are superior from the human factor point of view.
I mean, 2h does glance less, very fast going animations etc, but they all look the same and easy to block. 1h swings are all very different, good for different situations (left for spam, right for overreach, overhead for surprise, stab for... well, just another attack direction I guess), but with 1h you have to be very accurate with your hits, wrong attack angle and you get glance. Overall I think 1h and 2h are pretty balanced. 

Now on topic - I've never had a problems with kicking with my 24-18 shielder build using NCS.
Short weapon users might experience more problems with that, but I don't really think it's a balance problem.

[Konrax]

If you're good at dodging kicks, you're bad at the game, that's what you're saying? Where's the logic behind this sentence?

If you didn't notice how much of an impact the new kicks have had on shielders then you are bad.

I was almost impossible to land a kick on before the patch, now people land them all the time like it's almost a magical bs attack.

[Falka]

How does 1h have superior animations?

1h animations are much harder to block. When I was 2h I had hard time breaking good player's block. In order to do that I had to carry out some fancy moves and tricks (and I failed most of the time ). As a 1h I do only basic feints, hold a swing from time to time and still it's pretty easy to land a hit.   

Stab and rightswing glance all the time. Leftswing is good but very easy to block and overhead misses the target quite often. 1h has some of the worst animations in my opinion.

Meh, I don't agree with you. "overhead misses the target quite often" Ok, let's say it's true. But how 1h overheads are worse in comparison to 2h or pole? I'd say they're easiest to land becuase 1h weapons have the best turn rate (thanks to low weigtht and short length). And if you say left swing is very easy to block then which animation is hard to block according to you? Sure, people expect left swing (that's why I spam overheads), but it doesn't change it's still very fast attack. I have also no problem with stabbing (and I'm just a mediocre player, very far from being "a pro", so it can not be that hard), especially for a shielder 1h stab is very useful.

[Berserkadin]

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PS: Animations are balanced.

[Kafein]

Meh, I don't agree with you. "overhead misses the target quite often" Ok, let's say it's true. But how 1h overheads are worse in comparison to 2h or pole? I'd say they're easiest to land becuase 1h weapons have the best turn rate (thanks to low weigtht and short length). And if you say left swing is very easy to block then which animation is hard to block according to you? Sure, people expect left swing (that's why I spam overheads), but it doesn't change it's still very fast attack. I have also no problem with stabbing (and I'm just a mediocre player, very far from being "a pro", so it can not be that hard), especially for a shielder 1h stab is very useful.

1h overheads are the hardest to land because of three factors, that actually translate into just one : the effective hitbox. When someone does a overhead, they usually move their mouse to adjust and maximise their chances of hitting. The amount of space covered by the weapon horizontally (aka its reach), the turn speed and the duration of that active state define a surface. This surface is equal to the weapon lenght squared, multiplied by the active time, multiplied by the turn speed and multiplied by a pi factor that doesn't matter. The active time multiplied by the turn speed gives you an angle (the maximal angle that your weapon will travel during its active state if you just keep on turning as fast as possible), and multiplied by the squared reach of the weapon and pi, that's a surface The critical point now, is that you want that surface to be maximal, because the larger it is, the higher the chances of the opponent being at some point present in it, the easier it gets to hit. The reason why 1h are so bad at this is : shortest lenght (which matters a hell of a lot because squared), fastest speed, and thus shortest active time. Their higher turn rates do not compensate for this (they do, but very little considering turning faster also means you have to be more precise when you turn, which only moves the problem without solving it).

Of course, this analysis doesn't take into account everything at play here but I hope it explains a little.

About the topic of this thread, I think kicks are slightly too easy to land. The most logical fix IMO is to make them shorter in effective duration. Running into someone in the middle of a french cancan doesn't magically put you out of balance.

[Falka]

1h overheads are the hardest to land because of three factors, that actually translate into just one : the effective hitbox. ...

Your explanation sounds reasonable though on the other hand 1h overheads are hardest to block and thanks to short length really useful in clusterfuck

[Pentecost]

I play a 35 1h/pole character frequently, a 29 non-heirloomed 1h/2h character sparingly, and a non-heirloomed 1h STF (as a testing/handicap character) semi-frequently. All three characters have access to shields, although I usually forgo bringing them on the latter two unless the situation demands it.

I haven't really had a problem with kicks since they were changed. Yes, they are easier to land now (which indeed has resulted in me being kicked more often than in the past) but the fact that my opponent can't block while he's kicking more than makes up for this in my book. I've found that as long as I know my opponent and know whether or not he is going to attempt to kick me, I can avoid the majority of kicks without too much trouble.

If an issue does in fact exist with 1h right now, I think it has less to do with game mechanics than with item balance.

1h weapons are currently balanced around the assumption that you will be using them with a shield, and a shield is a very powerful and useful thing to have on NA1 or EU1. It's because shields are so good that 1h weapons necessarily have lesser damage and range compared to other weapon types; if this were not the case, shielders would be too powerful.

The problem is that not all 1h pure melee players are shielders, and the ones who aren't are playing something that comes off as half-baked for anything other than duels. This is not to say that swashbuckling sucks, because it doesn't. If you are skilled and daring, you can get good results with it, but your average player is just going to feel as though he is playing a gimped 2h. Where am I going with this?

Basically, whether through the addition of new mechanics or gameplay elements or something else, I would be in favor of changes that would decouple the balance of 1h as a class of weapon from the balance of shielders--a way of making 1h weapons better without making shielders (or ranged hybrids for that matter) better. Balancing 1h weapons solely around the efficacy of shielders makes about as much sense as balancing 2h solely around the efficacy of longswords and balancing polearms solely around the efficacy of glaives.

Also, as a general aside, I'd just like to say that whoever was responsible for the dynamic turn speeds deserves a medal. It was the best feeling ever to finally be able to land good stabs with my Italian Sword again.

[Matey]

Basically, whether through the addition of new mechanics or gameplay elements or something else, I would be in favor of changes that would decouple the balance of 1h as a class of weapon from the balance of shielders--a way of making 1h weapons better without making shielders (or ranged hybrids for that matter) better. Balancing 1h weapons solely around the efficacy of shielders makes about as much sense as balancing 2h solely around the efficacy of longswords and balancing polearms solely around the efficacy of glaives.

Also, as a general aside, I'd just like to say that whoever was responsible for the dynamic turn speeds deserves a medal. It was the best feeling ever to finally be able to land good stabs with my Italian Sword again.

I've said it before... but... I want them to add a nice 4 slot 1h weapon... or just some 2slot 1hs that have "cannot be used with a shield". Give em stats a bit closer to 2h and let swashbucklers have at it! I say 2 slot minimum though so that archers and xbows dont all use em as sidearms.

[Tibe]

1h without shield has always been a personal passion of mine. My char has a descent shieldingskill and good ammount of WPF in polearms and 1h both, just incase one class gets nerfed into oblivion while im in the middle of leveling.

 I must say 1h is simply hard as fuck now. Before it was just difficult and slightly underpowered, but if you really was skilled you could handle it. Now its about as akward as showing up to a wedding in my gimpsuit. Players are giving you too much shit when you are 1h. Weaponstun, backpedal slashspamming, kickspamming, nudgespamming, instalolstabbing.......Oh god.

But then again, when I look at the native stats, it appears to me that 1h was ment to be more of a supportweapon anyway. Like more of a sidearm than an acctual primary weapon. C-rpg did this class more justice than it ever had to begin with and I am thankful for that.

[Rebelyell]

when 1h beats 2h it is because of skill
when 2h beats 1h it is because 2h is op, 1h is up kicks bad animations ect ect ect

all the time everyone complain how 1h is worse at everything that 2h, it is slower shorter
lower damange, just everything

no one says a word about shield, to be honest who need a shield, it dosent block multiple atacks directions arrows lances, jsut nothing of that

but hey it slowes you down and makes you attacks slower to!!!! WTF SERIOUSLY

just look at attack directions

left swing  who cares it is fastest atack in the game it is so short omg omg I can't play anymore

overhead can't make it faster(unlike with other weapons, like longbow)
who care it looks slower than it hits or you can mistake it wit left swing,
90% of players still cant block it without shield, never hits the ground(maybe with some longer 1h swords) and you make 180 with that, pff useless shit

right swing is just utter bullshit, slowe omg omg,
slowe galnce and only outreach all other weapons and atack wit same lenght weapon or maybe even a bit more, who needs that

stab.... is the best atack that 1h have, but i dont want play hOPlite with sword QQ

1h wit xbow suck because there is mace and military hamer that is not  op 2h and 1h are up.
1h suck
ect ect





l2p factor dosen't matter because it is not skill based game... oh wait, hmmm

[Lemon]

Kicking is sorta like a lolstab.

[Falka]

when 1h beats 2h it is because of skill
when 2h beats 1h it is because 2h is op, 1h is up kicks bad animations ect ect ect

all the time everyone complain how 1h is worse at everything that 2h, it is slower shorter
lower damange, just everything

no one says a word about shield, to be honest who need a shield, it dosent block multiple atacks directions arrows lances, jsut nothing of that

but hey it slowes you down and makes you attacks slower to!!!! WTF SERIOUSLY

just look at attack directions

left swing  who cares it is fastest atack in the game it is so short omg omg I can't play anymore

overhead can't make it faster(unlike with other weapons, like longbow)
who care it looks slower than it hits or you can mistake it wit left swing,
90% of players still cant block it without shield, never hits the ground(maybe with some longer 1h swords) and you make 180 with that, pff useless shit

right swing is just utter bullshit, slowe omg omg,
slowe galnce and only outreach all other weapons and atack wit same lenght weapon or maybe even a bit more, who needs that

stab.... is the best atack that 1h have, but i dont want play hOPlite with sword QQ

1h wit xbow suck because there is mace and military hamer that is not  op 2h and 1h are up.
1h suck
ect ect

l2p factor dosen't matter because it is not skill based game... oh wait, hmmm

Hurr durr Bobby

[rufio]

I could add knockdown when getting hit during a kick.

you could also just nerf the silly cone the kicks have, no skill, blocking while being able to kick was better than this shit

[Paul]

I can't nerf kick cone. The changes are evil cmpcraft with WSE. Annoy cmp for changes to kicking. Good luck, but remember Panos.

[San]

What makes WSE difficult for anyone but cmp to work with?