Forcefield from 5->7 shield skill and build advice

[Rhaelys]

I just realized that you could do the following build at 36:

21 Strength
21 Agility

70 HP

7 Ironflesh
7 Power Strike
7 Shield
7 Athletics
7 Weapon Master

Super clean, and maximizes skill point usage for your attribute spread.

[San]

I was purposefully ambiguous on my first post, but I was deciding between 21/21, 24/21, and 21/24 for lvl 36. It appears 6&7 shield skill do make a large difference, and it's not really worth the 1-2 points in IF. I know that sounds obvious, but having HP >65 just looked more reassuring, although I know in practice it won't amount to much without maxing it.

21/21 would be as you described above. It indeed sounds great, but it's level 36 man. I could make something a bit more fun to mess around with. Even if I screw up and hate it, I could respec to 35 and just make a 24/18 version of my current 25/15.

For the others...

(click to show/hide)

24/21 would be

59hp / 63 Hp 2 IF

0 IF
8 PS
7 Shield
7 Athletics
7 WM

Lower HP, but I hit harder. It's okay if I use a cut weapon, but the others are superior with a blunt/pierce weapon. I plan to use both a cut and blunt weapon right now. It definitely depends on how much one can value 11 HP over 1 PS.

21/24 would be

56 HP/58 HP with 1IF
0 IF
7 PS
6 Shield
8 Athletics
8 WM- with lvl 36 bonus, 177 wpf

The neat thing is the 8Ath, which allows me to wear ~7.5 kg extra and still have >= 7Ath movement.
I would be able to move quickly in medium-heavy armor, or extremely quickly in anything lower. I could also increase my damage/decrease the opponent's with better footwork due to the acceleration. I also almost have the wpf of a lvl 30 with 9WM, which is just hilarious until that gets fixed "soon."

21/21 is safe and great, but there's something alluring about those other builds, since I know it's just not possible with levels under 36, while level 35 can have a competent 21/21 build.

[Rhaelys]

I'll avoid doing the 21/24 build because 7 Athletics should be plenty for you.

If and when the WPF/WM change comes along, 21/21 would be your best bet. If there were no WPF/WM changes planned, then I would wholeheartedly recommend something like this:

Level 36

24 Strength
21 Agility

75 Health

8 Ironflesh
8 Power Strike
6 Shield
7 Athletics
0 Weapon Master

But since we know that WM will actually be useful/necessary to single proficiency melee builds, this wouldn't be viable upon that change.

Then you have to grapple with what to cut. Max Power Strike and Max Athletics is a given, but how do you split up 14 points between 3 skills that would cap out at 22 points? You could go for 7 Shield and 7 Weapon Master, but then you'd be left with 0 Ironflesh and 59 HP, which isn't really optimal. If you want to have a nice round 65 HP, then you would take 3 Ironflesh. You would presumably also want at least 4 Shield, if not 5 for Huscarls, which would let WM hit 7 or 6.

So this build looks like:

Level 36

24 Strength
21 Agility

65 Health

3 Ironflesh
8 Power Strike
4/5 Shield
7 Athletics
7/6 Weapon Master

vs.

Level 36

21 Strength
21 Agility

70 Health

7 Ironflesh
7 Power Strike
7 Shield
7 Athletics
7 Weapon Master

So the first build gives an extra 8% damage but trades 5 HP, 2 or 3 Shield Skill's worth of coverage increase and damage mitigation, and possibly 1 WM worth of WPF. The first build maximizes the damage you can do, but trades a great deal of survivability that can't be directly compared to 8% more damage. 5 HP is a great deal; that could be the difference between death and surviving one more blow. The extra shield skill could mean the difference between getting shot in the foot or force fielding it into the nether.

This is basically the decision you have to make: do you want an extra 8% damage or a 7.7% increase in health plus the force-fielding and reinforcing of your shield? Since you know how I like to build theorycraft, you'll know that I always say "dead people cannot deal any damage"

And to address your concern that "It's level 36: I could do something marvelous with my extra points" think of it this way: You would be one of the few people to make full use of your skill points. Your build would be maximally efficient. You would be productively using 35! skill points. That in itself is amazingly marvelous.

Edit: I realized that 21 Strength and 7 Ironflesh only gives 70 HP, not 75 as I first thought. The difference of 5 HP between the two builds definitely makes choosing much more difficult!

[Matey]

Possible with almost 3 years of exp. I only retired twice. 600k-1mil+ from a strat battle also helps. I still have 80 million left, which will take ~4-6 months.

I think I want to try out 21/24 at this point. I might change my mind.

Ignore Rhaelys, he is str my old friend.

24 Agi is the minimum for a good shielder cause 8ath is fucking amazing. It just gets better though! I decided to go for 15/27 for my 35 build! You could always do 18/24 for your 36 and just pump the IF up.

[Falka]

Having 59 or even 56 hp at lvl 36 is just wrong 

"dead people cannot deal any damage"

[Taser]

Possible with almost 3 years of exp. I only retired twice. 600k-1mil+ from a strat battle also helps. I still have 80 million left, which will take ~4-6 months.

I think I want to try out 21/24 at this point. I might change my mind.

I'm just surprised you're actually considering it. I mean lvl 35 is insane by itself. I mean next we'll have canary saying he's going to 37 for shits and giggles at his gen 1.

But if you're shooting for it, good luck. I would do 21/21 with maxed stats like rhaelys pointed out or 21/24 myself at that high a level. I've found that agi serves shielders far better than str for surviving. But I got to admit I rocked the 24/18 build a while ago and loved the fuck out of it. I did dislike the lower ath I had with it but 21/21 was a nice balance with lots of hitting power and decent ath to chase people down.

[CrazyCracka420]

I just got to level 34 tell me if you think this was smart:

Level 34 (before adding attributes/skills):

21/18

2 IF
7 Power Strike
5 Shield
6 Athletics
6 Riding
6 Weapon Master

I could have went for a 24/18 (with 8 powerstrike) at level 35 build...which was tempting, but it's another 100 million xp before I would hit 35 (not sure that will happen, and if it did, it would be another 6+ months)

So instead, I decided to convert the attribute into two skill points, and dumped 3 skills into IF, bringing me up to 5 IF...was that the right move?

[Rhaelys]

I just got to level 34 tell me if you think this was smart:

Level 34 (before adding attributes/skills):

21/18

2 IF
7 Power Strike
5 Shield
6 Athletics
6 Riding
6 Weapon Master

I could have went for a 24/18 (with 8 powerstrike) at level 35 build...which was tempting, but it's another 100 million xp before I would hit 35 (not sure that will happen, and if it did, it would be another 6+ months)

So instead, I decided to convert the attribute into two skill points, and dumped 3 skills into IF, bringing me up to 5 IF...was that the right move?

Yes. Since you're taking riding, you benefit from having additional skill points. Converting for 24 Strength would strain your skill point pool too much.

[Phew]

...was that the right move?

You chose 10% more defense now over 8% more offense like a year from now, seems like a good choice to me. Almost every build ends up with a choice between 7 IF and 3 more str+1 more PS. So you're talking like 20-25% more defense vs. 8% more offense. Unless you play in cloth (and get 1-shot by everyone anyway), it seems like a no-brainer.

[Rhaelys]

was that the right move?

To put real numbers into perspective, going for a 24/18 build would have given you 1 extra Power Strike but forced you to sacrifice 7 skill points. Those skill points could be 5 IF + 2 WM, reducing your health by 7 and your available Weapon Proficiency Points by 150. That might not normally be an unfavorable trade, but you are also cav, and if I remember correctly you have more than one weapon proficiency, which greatly increases the value of having an extra 2 WM.

Converting extra skill points to attribute points can sometimes be a reasonable path, but usually in limited circumstances (ie only sacrificing Ironflesh or WM w/ 1 melee proficiency for 3 Strength (which = 3 HP) and 1 more PS... although with WPF/WM changes it will be more important to invest as many points into WM as your build allows).

[San]

It's been a few days, and I decided to switch my STF from 18/21 with ~50 body armor to 15/24 65 body armor. Weight was increased by 10, which simulates an increase of 5 weight in armor and a 5 weight shield to compare what my main will be using, increasing from 55 body armor to 64 body armor. Even with 2IF and 15 strength, 54Hp, I was tanking quite a few hits. The 8ath allowed me high levels of control, even with higher armor. I feel 7ath and high armor might not be as fast as I want, since I want to be comparatively faster than my opponent, not the same/less speed, although I still haven't tested that yet.

It was safe to say that my performance more than doubled. My 18/21 with medium/low body armor had a KD of 2.5:1, and after the last 5 maps, my 15:24 with high armor had 5.8:1. The higher weight didn't change the great amount of acceleration I had. Being able to manipulate speed bonus on myself with high armor really helped mitigate a lot of damage. 21/24 on my main is looking quite great now, despite the low Hp, although I would only be able to increase shield skill to 6 at most.

Right now, 21/24 > 24/21 >>> 21/21. 2 Shield skill + 7-11 Hp doesn't compete with avoiding more attacks and killing enemies with less swings. Since shield skill doesn't affect melee forcefield, higher ath allows me to catch archers, and higher armor reduces arrow damage if I do get shot in a blind spot. Of course, 21/21 is the most future-proof if any changes occur to IF and shield. So in the end, kudos to Matey and Rustyspoon in the agi shielder lobby.

[NuberT]

Ignore Rhaelys, he is str my old friend.

24 Agi is the minimum for a good shielder cause 8ath is fucking amazing. It just gets better though! I decided to go for 15/27 for my 35 build! You could always do 18/24 for your 36 and just pump the IF up.

this. Sadly I didnt had the balls to go for 15/27 after my respec, so its only 18/24, but I am very certain, that effectivity will be pretty much the same while 15/27 would be way more fun.

[Matey]

It's been a few days, and I decided to switch my STF from 18/21 with ~50 body armor to 15/24 65 body armor. Weight was increased by 10, which simulates an increase of 5 weight in armor and a 5 weight shield to compare what my main will be using, increasing from 55 body armor to 64 body armor. Even with 2IF and 15 strength, 54Hp, I was tanking quite a few hits. The 8ath allowed me high levels of control, even with higher armor. I feel 7ath and high armor might not be as fast as I want, since I want to be comparatively faster than my opponent, not the same/less speed, although I still haven't tested that yet.

It was safe to say that my performance more than doubled. My 18/21 with medium/low body armor had a KD of 2.5:1, and after the last 5 maps, my 15:24 with high armor had 5.8:1. The higher weight didn't change the great amount of acceleration I had. Being able to manipulate speed bonus on myself with high armor really helped mitigate a lot of damage. 21/24 on my main is looking quite great now, despite the low Hp, although I would only be able to increase shield skill to 6 at most.

Right now, 21/24 > 24/21 >>> 21/21. 2 Shield skill + 7-11 Hp doesn't compete with avoiding more attacks and killing enemies with less swings. Since shield skill doesn't affect melee forcefield, higher ath allows me to catch archers, and higher armor reduces arrow damage if I do get shot in a blind spot. Of course, 21/21 is the most future-proof if any changes occur to IF and shield. So in the end, kudos to Matey and Rustyspoon in the agi shielder lobby.

I still think you are crazy for wearing that much armour though! Embrace the joy of running around in blue pajamas and hacking hapless archers apart!

[Erzengel]

this. Sadly I didnt had the balls to go for 15/27 after my respec, so its only 18/24, but I am very certain, that effectivity will be pretty much the same while 15/27 would be way more fun.

I respecced from 18/24 to 15/27 a while ago. 15/27 is awesome for battle/siege, but really sucks in strategus imho. 18/24 is nice because it allows you to make good use of medium/heavy armor if you have some IF. You can also use most swords. 15/27 is limited to much fewer weapons. Just get 8 shield skill and a Steel Buckler and you won't notice a huge difference compared to 15/27. Both are awesome builds, though.

[Turboflex]

pfft agi for catching archers? that's what jarids are for.