Nerf archers more pls

[VeritasQ]

    Today i just realized that i cannot jump anymore while pulling spring ... And guess what ? Im not trying to absorb cavalary attacks anymore because im not able to move . Im not even moving somewhere else cuz cavalaries cannot miss attacks cuz im not able to jump somewhere else while they are charging me .

        Im begging you for this as archer . Pls nerf archers more . Even you can remove bows and arrows because those aren't useful anymore . I rather use pillow instead of bow . And give us marshmellows instead of arrows !

[Joker86]

Yeah, those archer nerfs went a bit out of hand, lately. I admit this.

The problem are a few things, mainly that one single archer is heavily UP, half of a team being archer is heavily OP (and you can't balance this by effectivity/deadliness, obviously, but still the devs try), and the general problem of the different gameplay for the classes on battle mode, which puts infantry at a "fun disadvantage". It's partially the infantry players' own fault, but also the fault of the battle mode design.

The best solution I could come up with was changing battle mode to conquest mode (= capturing three or five flags on the map). The new game mode would need a new reward system as well, and the combination of all those measures could change/fix almost all problems. Infantry would not be that much of a disadvantage any more in terms of picking their target or preventing of being picked compared to archers and cavalry, increased rewards for taking flags would favour infantry and make the class more popular again (= less incentive to play archer => less problems of combined archer fire increasing the effectivity exponentially) and would bring a nice change to the general gameplay on the servers.

This time I tried to keep it as short as possible. I'd be honestly surprised if everybody who reads this gets what I mean.

[Panos]

fuck you and your wall texts dude. 

[Kafein]

So what, you don't manage to dodge cav ?

1) Most archers still pull it off
2) If not cav, who's going to kill you ?

[Ulter]

Joker's right, a very good proof of it is that archers have never been that much of a problem on siege, where to win a team doesn't have to kill all the opponents, but capture an objective instead.

That idea could actually allow to stop ridiculous nerfs of some classes (cavalry, archers, HA..) because it gives infantry an opportunity to take an exclusive role in the game which is capturing the objectives, without the neccesity of facing impossible odds against some classes (kiting archers, mounted archers/crossbowmen)

Hopefully ,that simple change could allow for switching the course of current game balance to something better, more realistic and more fun without ruining it.

[Gurnisson]

I preferred being able to jump while drawing, with the drawing animation reset while doing so, but not being able to jump ain't that much of a problem. You should still be able to dodge cav with your movement while drawing your bow.

Also, loomed archers are not underpowered at all. Non-loomed ones are, and I would hope for that to change, but I doubt it.

[Jarlek]

Question: Why should you be able to dodge and attack at the same time with a ranged weapon?

Dodging cav is still easy. Just don't expect to be able to shoot and dodge at the same time.

The only one that should get jumpshooting back is throwers. Needs more love.

[Ptolemy]

The weight increase for bows and arrows makes it damn near impossible to dodge a horse - especially if it's an Arabian. This means that not only can a shielder chase and usually catch my archer with 7 ath, a couching horseman will be almost guaranteed to kill me. Makes having athletics on an archer almost pointless now - might as well switch to 10PD longbowmen, since the arrows do so little damage and you normally can't out-run a pursuer anyway.

Of course, if you do that, your WPF is so low that you can't hit where you're aiming regardless and woe is you if you don't have +3 bodkins.

[Nordwolf]

Don't remove battle. Please. Never.
Only thing I can think about is just a bit of reworking of a flag system.

About archery - anything about it should be looked at in the context of battlefield, not single player vs. player situation. I mean, kiting won't be a problem with a battle flag system for those who are thinking about winning and not getting as many kills as possible.

[HappyPhantom]

The problem I see with archer build is, you need relatively high strength for good powerdraw, eg at least 18, and you need high athletics for the amount of wpf required. Would be better if you could get away with around 15 strength and be able to use high tier bows.

[VeritasQ]

Question: Why should you be able to dodge and attack at the same time with a ranged weapon?

Dodging cav is still easy. Just don't expect to be able to shoot and dodge at the same time.

The only one that should get jumpshooting back is throwers. Needs more love.

I didn't meant that archers suppose to shoot while jumping . My point is archers still should be able to jump while pulling spring . After new update its kind a impossible because space button is becoming disabled when i try pull the spring . Sometimes i cannot measure that am i going to able shoot the cavalary before he hits me therefore i need that jumping back . After new update for archers there is only 1 chose left againist cavalary ----> hiding ( not even escaping ) .

[Ronin]

fuck you and your wall texts dude. 

The evolution of Joker:
He was writing walls of text, now he's writing fences of text.

[Jarlek]

I didn't meant that archers suppose to shoot while jumping . My point is archers still should be able to jump while pulling spring . After new update its kind a impossible because space button is becoming disabled when i try pull the spring . Sometimes i cannot measure that am i going to able shoot the cavalary before he hits me therefore i need that jumping back . After new update for archers there is only 1 chose left againist cavalary ----> hiding ( not even escaping ) .

I knew exactly what you meant. Both dawing and shooting while jumping is retarded as an archer, same for crossbowmen.

Before, you could just keep on drawing and shooting with cav charging you, no problems at all. It was ridiculous. Now, you have to dodge when someone charges you and THEN start drawing. Much more balanced and fair.

Look, it's not hard to dodge cavalry. Just don't DRAW when you try to dodge them. Ptolemy says he can't dodge a horseman with 7 athletics and bow+arrows. Bullshit. If I can dodge cav with 20 armour weight and 17 equipment weight (shield, 2 jarids and a sword) with only 6 athletics, then you should have no problem with 7 athletics. Fuck, even on my HA I still have no problem dodging enemy cav, and that's with 3 stacks of bodkin and 0 athletics. It's not archers being unable to dodge cav: It's you failing at dodging cav.

[Latvian]

i read only 1st post, all i got to say is quit crying archers, i cant describe how retarded is ability to shoot while jumping, crawl back to matrix nerds. I have archer alt and i have never even made jumpshot when that was possible, devs did right thing to remove it, you can use legit 1h o slot weapons now, so it should be enough to make you stop crying.

[Angellore]

(...) i cant describe how retarded is ability to shoot while jumping (...). I have archer alt and i have never even made jumpshot when that was possible, devs did right thing to remove it (...).

(...) Both dawing and shooting while jumping is retarded as an archer, same for crossbowmen.

Yeah, I agree. Devs also should remove attacking while jumping for infantry, because this also has no sense at all. If you want to attack, stay on the ground, don't jump like a monkey.
You can't put proper force to strike when you are not standing on the ground, so they should remove this sillyness from the game!