Star Citizen

[Leesin]

I have to agree with Xant, I don't see the problem with it, you now have a chance to try everything out WITHOUT having to buy it with your real money, you just play the module. Why you guys seem to think this renting business has anything to do with the final game is beyond me.

[Vibe]

I was complaining about it generally, that it's a shitty mechanic. If it's for the purpose of testing and only meant to be in alpha, they should've just put it behind some amount of grind without time limits (if not just unlock them, since you want people to test them?). It's fine that they're allowing the paywalled ships to be tested, the time limit isn't though.

[Xant]

It's not like they "want people to test them", they got enough testers already just from people buying that stuff. They're doing it mostly so that people can try stuff for free. And when they do want people to test specific things, they give those things out for free, or for a considerable discount. Which people are more likely to use when they don't already permanently own the top-grade stuff.

You're not playing multiplayer AC Vibe, are you? Because I can tell you that I'm glad as hell it's a renting system, not a permanent-own system, otherwise everyone would be flying Super Hornets with six O6s 24/7. Now there'll be some variation -- which, incidentally, is much better for CIG than people just playing the one best thing forever.

[Vibe]

I don't own the game (yet), neither do I follow it really apart from this thread. So the preorder ships will be available for everyone come full release, or at least same 'power grade' alternatives (without the renting thing)?

[Xant]

I don't own the game (yet), neither do I follow it really apart from this thread. So the preorder ships will be available for everyone come full release, or at least same 'power grade' alternatives (without the renting thing)?

All ships will be available in the full game, yes. They did a limited edition sale on an alien ship, Scythe, which I think is the only ship that won't be "readily" available for everyone. Which just means you'll have to capture one in the persistent universe instead of buying it with credits (though that'll obviously work too if you buy it from other players) if you want one.

The ships people can pledge for come with starter-grade gear only, and all the ships are civilian variants/civilian ships, and have less weaponry, worse shields, etc than the military ones, which you'll have to acquire in the PU.

So right now it's pretty stupid to "pay to win" because nobody knows how long it'll take to capture a military grade ship, for example. Or how long it'll take to earn a 250 euro ship. I'd personally only pledge for a starter ship that lets you work towards something good in the actual game.

[Vibe]

All ships will be available in the full game, yes. They did a limited edition sale on an alien ship, Scythe, which I think is the only ship that won't be "readily" available for everyone. Which just means you'll have to capture one in the persistent universe instead of buying it with credits (though that'll obviously work too if you buy it from other players) if you want one.

The ships people can pledge for come with starter-grade gear only, and all the ships are civilian variants/civilian ships, and have less weaponry, worse shields, etc than the military ones, which you'll have to acquire in the PU.

So right now it's pretty stupid to "pay to win" because nobody knows how long it'll take to capture a military grade ship, for example. Or how long it'll take to earn a 250 euro ship. I'd personally only pledge for a starter ship that lets you work towards something good in the actual game.

Sounds alright then. Is the starter package price (44 EUR) also the release box price for the game or is that unknown yet? I take it you also get the release game with those packages (says Star Citizen Digital Download under info but who knows what that actually means)?

[Leshma]

I have to agree with Xant, I don't see the problem with it, you now have a chance to try everything out WITHOUT having to buy it with your real money, you just play the module. Why you guys seem to think this renting business has anything to do with the final game is beyond me.

Because I don't trust the man. He said many different things over last two years and a half. This attitude is what worries me:

Seems a pretty fair trade off - especially for a ship that others have contributed $110 for the right to fly the same ship in the PU and AC.

You need to understand that he made the first money on basis of making B2P game without microtransactions. He didn't mention them at that time, he didn't dare because he would get nothing. Selling ship packages was supposed to be Kickstarter exclusive, especially selling limited ships and those with unlimited insurance. He broke that promise couple times. Simply put, based on his actions since the first crowdfunding campaign for Star Citizen (Kickstarter), Chris Roberts is not a trustworthy person.

Now he's playing the card where he basically say that people who pay more should be above of those who don't (which does make sense) but he's saying that after two years of trying to sell idea of pledging for ships and not buying them. Even though, in reality he is selling virtual ships. That is what he did so far. Also this:

Don't forget that these contributions are what is allowing us to build a game with the unparalleled ambition of Star Citizen - no other crowd funded game comes even remotely close - by the time we're done you'll be playing a game that will have well over $100M sunk just into its development costs, including a single player component Squadron 42, that will have more play time and quality than most retail AAA first person action games.

are just words. No results so far. He claimed some form of persistent universe will be done before 2015, yet all we have is hangar and small scale arena multiplayer with fighters on two maps and some lame racing mode (Superman 64).

What REC allows us to do is give people that haven't got got the same financial resources to contribute another way in our quest to make Star Citizen the BDSSE by giving us their time to help test, balance the game and then reward them with ability to try out ships and weapons that they would otherwise have to wait until the game is finished to be able to fly.

He said credits will arrive soon after first playable version gets out and all of a sudden he says how playing alpha was always supposed to be only for those who spend real money! How can anyone trust him that won't be the same for final version?

[Xant]

Sounds alright then. Is the starter package price (44 EUR) also the release box price for the game or is that unknown yet? I take it you also get the release game with those packages (says Star Citizen Digital Download under info but who knows what that actually means)?

Don't know for sure, but people on the forums have been saying it will cost more on release than what the starter package costs. Also, FPS module releases next month. If you're buying the starter package, probably not worth it to go into PvP. There's some great pilots who can be competitive with an Aurora, but it's hard. All the PvE is very much doable with any ship, though.

Selling ship packages was supposed to be Kickstarter exclusive

Boohoo, people who didn't pledge in 2012 KS campaign can play the game as well. What a loss -- except it's not, literally everyone wins.

[Xant]

https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/comment/4449786/#Comment_4449786

Another CR post about REC.

[Leshma]

Boohoo, people who didn't pledge in 2012 KS campaign can play the game as well. What a loss -- except it's not, literally everyone wins.

Ship packages are packages that contain a better ship than the starting one (Aurora). What people say on forums about price rising originates from Kickstarter campaign. Base package (at that time only package that was supposed to be sold on release) was 35 USD for backers and should be 60 USD release, just like every other AAA game. But that changed with continuation of pledging for ship so I doubt there will be much difference in prices you have to pay, unless they raise the price of every package. Also, at one point you could get for less than during early KS campaign, but without singleplayer I think.

Benefits we, really backers have over you who joined later aren't lower price of ships (although expensive packages were cheaper during KS) but all the goodies that were awarded to us since first million milestone. Like Laser Pistol side arm, AMX-1 Repair Bot, Squadron 42 Mission Disk, Record Breaker Skin, Fishtank Mark 1, Midas Fish, Lifetime Insurance etc. Although I have a feeling they awarded late backers with this as well, even though they said that won't be the case.

[Xant]

Ship packages are packages that contain a better ship than the starting one (Aurora). What people say on forums about price rising originates from Kickstarter campaign. Base package (at that time only package that was supposed to be sold on release) was 35 USD for backers and should be 60 USD release, just like every other AAA game. But that changed with continuation of pledging for ship so I doubt there will be much difference in prices you have to pay, unless they raise the price of every package. Also, at one point you could get for less than during early KS campaign, but without singleplayer I think.

Benefits we, really backers have over you who joined later aren't lower price of ships (although expensive packages were cheaper during KS) but all the goodies that were awarded to us since first million milestone. Like Laser Pistol side arm, AMX-1 Repair Bot, Squadron 42 Mission Disk, Record Breaker Skin, Fishtank Mark 1, Midas Fish, Lifetime Insurance etc. Although I have a feeling they awarded late backers with this as well, even though they said that won't be the case.

Well, your feelings are certainly trustworthy and good evidence.

[Leshma]

Also, FPS module releases next month.

That was the original plan (Q1 2015). However that changed, they've said something about it during Town Hall meeting I think. Also you can follow current state of FPS module on reddit, Sandy is posting teasers on her Facebook. First of all, it doesn't look like that long teaser they have shown on Gamescom. So far only one arena has been shown and it isn't finished. Based on their slow progress with maps, it will probably be the only one. It is simulation arena, placed in open space and has markers everywhere. Looks a bit like racing track but it is placed inside a ball and has different obstacles but it is similar in theme. That implies we'll be fighting in low gravity environment, like in Shattered Horizon. So far it sucks imho.

But they might make it better if they postpone the release (think end of the years), which is most likely to happen. They certainly won't release it next month, because it is not finished.

Room system isn't done yet, 64-bit precision rework of engine is at 50% (should be finished 1H 2015 but that won't happen). Without room system they can't give us space stations to fight in.

[Xant]

That was the original plan (Q1 2015). However that changed, they've said something about it during Town Hall meeting I think. Also you can follow current state of FPS module on reddit, Sandy is posting teasers on her Facebook. First of all, it doesn't look like that long teaser they have shown on Gamescom. So far only one arena has been shown and it isn't finished. Based on their slow progress with maps, it will probably be the only one. It is simulation arena, placed in open space and has markers everywhere. Looks a bit like racing track but it is placed inside a ball and has different obstacles but it is similar in theme. That implies we'll be fighting in low gravity environment, like in Shattered Horizon. So far it sucks imho.

But they might make it better if they postpone the release (think end of the years), which is most likely to happen. They certainly won't release it next month, because it is not finished.

Room system isn't done yet, 64-bit precision rework of engine is at 50% (should be finished 1H 2015 but that won't happen). Without room system they can't give us space stations to fight in.

Source for delay? They said March quite recently. They have also confirmed that there'll be two maps on launch.

[Micah]

I really dont know what people consider p2w here ...

I for one will take my little avenger and earn some REC and work my way up to any weapon, ship or any item i want to use and test ... and i will never pay for anything and i will never ever have to pay for anything ever (aswell as i cant pay anything, since im ass poor and talentless guy with an hopelessly fucked up irl) , unless i really want to "own it" - in whatever strange way people consider to "own" anything in a world made of bits and bytes.

I will even consider myself lucky and superior compared to people who waste real money to actually shoot their own foot and miss out on the experiance to work their way towards a rewarding moment to have earned and achieved something ... also they will miss out on the skill and expertise i earn by doing exactly that; but i will not tell them - no i will tell them they are my heroes, for doing so much for the good of the community and the world overall - since im happy they waste their money for me, so i can play a better game ...

I really cant call that p2w ...

edit: additionally, when the time comes and i get bored of the game, i will simply move on with out bad sleep and second thought and without having payed silly amount of money ...

[Xant]

Avenger's an awesome ship, too bad it's currently broken in a couple of ways, and the next patch fixes those things.. and breaks some others. Will be great when it's working properly, though.