This sounds fairly reasonable. HAs would get slightly screwed but I guess it could be compensated with something. Cavalry would still be able to perform decently.
Thank you.
As the OP mentioned, the HA's should get a slight buff. I say make the HA skill only require 3 agi again. That would mena they would use more points in it (losing other skills) AND get more accurate from horseback. I also think that HA reduces your standing accuracy (NOT native, but cRPG added) so it would also make them more different from foot archers. And this would also mean that they could take a 0 slot melee weapon without being penalized for it. Most HA now take a bow and 3 quivers, which makes taking a melee weapon a very bad choice (they need the extra ammo because of the bad accuracy when moving) but now they can without feeling they lost something.
And now to the schmerpy part:
@Odin:Ok, wall of text. Let's see what your points are:
1: You claim OP wants to nerf both heavy AND light cav.
2: You claim there is no reason to use expensive horses if you don't get anything from them.
3: You claim heavy cav is not OP and couching with them is difficult.
4: You say armoured horses are so slow that it doesn't matter how strong they are since riders die immediately by ranged etc, because of their slow speed.
5: You claim light horses rape heavy horses.
6: Then you say light horses die easily and people should be able to take a backup weapon.
7: Not all cav use shield, and that shield cav would be at a disadvantage in this since the non-shield cav have 1 extra slot.
8: You claim 1h/pole cav would disappear if these changes came.
9: You claim this would lead to more 1h cav since they would not be that affected by the changes.
10: You claim HA is still very effective and that they do not need a buff.
11: Then you claim that the people riding 24/7 heavy cav are the "respec abusers".
Ok, now for what I think about it:
1: Ok, straight out of OP:
-snip-
Reduce horse prices a bit.
Raise horse stats a bit. *EDIT*- Not buffing the horse bump.
Make horse archers alot less crappy.
Make sumpter horses 0 slots.
Make all other horses take up 1 slot.
Let's see. Reduce price (buff), raise horse stats (buff), increase HA efficiency (buff), make all horses except sumpter take 1 slot (HUGE nerf). As I see it, this is a TRADEOFF and not a NERF. But I'm gonna agree with you and say that overall, this would make horses worse (although easier to use from the price drop).
So yes, this is a bit too much. And that's why I have come with other suggestions in this thread. Please feel free to read them.
2: I agree with what you are saying. The heavy horses gives you way too little compared to their price. If I could choose regardless of money I would take a armoured horse every time, but compared to how much they cost, I agree that it's BS to take them instead. This is why I agree to the suggestion in OP.
Increase the horse stats. In one of my earlier posts I said that the
1 slot for horses should only be for armoured horses and arab/courser. I think this would be the best. It would mean that you could still take decent horses and use all 4 slots on weapons, while taking a "dedicated horseman horse" would leave you with only 3. The increased stats should then be for the armoured horses only. Buffing their armour and speed to get closer (or about the same) as the 0 slot horses. That would make the 1 slot horses be either faster/mobile than 0 slot horses (courser/arab) or armoured/stronger than 0 slot horses (heavy cav).
This would make 3 groups of horses. Horses for hybrids, horses for dedicated lancers and horses for dedicated heavy cav.
3: Couching with the Plated Charger is difficult. Mameluke is tricky and the rest is about OK. For any fancy riding/couching you would need an unarmoured one. So, guess we agree there. About them being OP. Well, compared to the other horses they are OP. The extra survivability makes them much more useful than other horses. The exception to this is the PC which, I agree, is so slow that you are MUCH easier to kill while riding it. Still not sure if they are OP, but I can understand how it is frustrating for other players to fight it.
4: Herpa derpa I talked about this in 3 xD. Gonna leave it for ze lulz.
5: This is something I am completely ok with. The best way to take out a heavy horse (apart from pike) should be light cavalry
outflanking, outsmarting and outriding the heavy cav. Heavy cav should be the best anti-infantry and straight on charge. Light cavalry should be able to get the heavy if they ride better than him. Currently this is how it is. Lots of times I've been able to outride coursers/arabs with my warhorse by simply being a smarter/better rider. It is still
easier for a light horse rider to outmanouver a heavy horse, but with skill the heavy cav can still make them miss again and again and again. But generally. Light horses should be able to outride heavy horses, but heavy horses should be better against infantry and straight on charges. Not sure how to make it more like that, but currently this is mainly how it is.
6: Well, that's the bad thing with light cav. You get more mobility and speed, but when you fuck up you fuck up. No 2nd chance here. BUT! As I said, the 1 slot only for the "good" horses would still make the "normal" horse-horsemen able to fight properly on the ground. Does this sound fair/ok with you?
7: Yeah, this would be more friendly towards no shield cav than shield cav. The 1 slot for only top tier horses would kinda help with this, but ANOTHER suggestion I came with was to
make the "couch-only" lances 1 slot. This would then give the shield cav a weapon to use while still getting some backup, while they still wouldn't be able to go full top gear without a drawback. What I think would happen is that shield cav would go for heavy horses and focus on infantry, while the no shield cav would go for arab/courser and be
Lancers.*8: Well, with some of the suggestion I added, I say the 1h/pole would get some roles there too. I'm a 1h/pole and I would change between Lancer and Heavy cav, depending on what I wanted to do.
9: 1h cav is currently the "weakest" of the horsemen, maybe apart from throwing cav. I really don't think there would be THAT many of them. Maybe just with OPs changes, but with the ones I added it would also be a place for polearm and 2h cav. HA would also again be better if they got a small buff. Check the beginning of this post for more info.
10: You are right. They still are very effective. What I want though, is to change them a bit. Give them less ammo and no penalty for using a mellee (0slot) weapon.
11: Most of the "constant PC" are those abusers, but there are also some who are just good at trading. Not talking about selling looms for gold, but buying a loomed item cheap and selling it high. I know Daergar have made loads of money doing that and he never sold any of his own looms.
Now, I think I got all your points there and since you are such a follower of
"always address everything somebody wrote", I expect you to do the same with me. Use the numbers to make it easier. If you don't care to answer I'm gonna get offended and it would show that you are a hypocrite little fuck. Which you obviously are not... are you?
* Lancers are designated anti-cav horsemen. Something like courser (1slot), heavy lance (2slot), quarterstaff (1slot), maybe a 1h instead of quarterstaff. They sacrifice foot gear for great anti-cav opportunity.
Poll