Archery Nerfed

[Leshma]

Why don't you try it yourself, smartass?

Then go back and tell us how eaze it was

Edit: I don't own many bows, cause I'm not dedicated archer, I'm just playing one this gen.

Gorath aren't you, by any chance, lost brother of Fasader and Paul? Cause, honestly, you have no clue how some classes work atm, just like those two guys. Thank god you're not in the balancing team.

[Gorath]

Why don't you try it yourself, smartass?

Nubby_McNubbins
Previously:
Perforated_Prostate
lolezstylin
MoneyShot

I play an archer alt all the time Lesh.  Whenever I'm feeling lazy and don't want to work at getting kills by chambering, blocking, utilizing footwork or anything else.  I just get on my archer, grab my longbow, find a roof or hill I can camp with the other ranged and start pew pewing away at all the people without gunsbows to shoot back with.  It's like playing an FPS against people that don't get firearms to shoot back with.

[Tears of Destiny]

I remember MoneyShot... hmm. Had no idea that was you.

[gazda]

COOKIES

[Leshma]

So you're telling me to man up, grab my hammer and go for those 4 guys who have 150 wpf each and some long weapons which hurt 3 times as much as my ps 3 hammer.

And no, I can't waste even 50 wpp cause I need it for my longbow which isn't precise enough even with 163 wpp!!!

And of course that I need those 30-36 arrows. My job is to kill horses and xbowmen and I need a lot of arrows for that.

Not everyone is super pro archer like you Gorath, who can kill every tincan with 2 headshots in a row, who own every cav player with just one arrow, who...blah blah blah

And you can't get up high hill, hit R and shoot like there's no tomorrow. First, there are xbowmen down there, somewhere in the bushes whose projectiles fly straight (so you have to dance polka while givin'... erm shooting heads off) and second you can't hit shit from such distance even with 163 wpp and a longbow. Even if you hit for every low medium guy you need two such shots.

Basically, you came here telling me how archery is super easy mode just because every two weeks you get drunk and get on your shitty alt which doesn't have anything heirloomed and you OWN everyone! How yes no! You own everyone just like Michael owns everyone all the time, on every map and with every class, but he likes to play hardest possible class Teh elephant where he can't score enough to be first cause of dem pikemen...

Full of shit, that's what you're last two posts are. Stop trolling and maybe we can have nice and proper discussion about mod balance, otherwise you're just looking foolish.

[Gorath]

So you're telling me to man up, grab my hammer and go for those 4 guys who have 150 wpf each and some long weapons which hurt 3 times as much as my ps 3 hammer. 

This was not the scenario in question.  I also SPECIFICALLY mentioned that your 4ps, hammer, and 1-50 wpf are more than enough for a 1v1.  Now you're bitching about going after a 4v1...
Stop raging.

And no, I can't waste even 50 wpp cause I need it for my longbow which isn't precise enough even with 163 wpp!!! 

Then you're bad.  Sorry, simple as that.  If you NEEEEEEEEEED a fucking fully closed laser sight single dot fucking x-hair like a damned railgun in order to do well then you're just bad and whining.
Stop raging.

And of course that I need those 30-36 arrows. My job is to kill horses and xbowmen and I need a lot of arrows for that.

2 bags of arrows are fine.  The 0 slot hammer is more than enough to kill any infantry barring the most plated 3x heirloomed asshole.
Stop raging.

(click to show/hide)

Not everyone is super pro archer like you Gorath, who can kill every tincan with 2 headshots in a row, who own every cav player with just one arrow, who...blah blah blah

And you can't get up high hill, hit R and shoot like there's no tomorrow. First, there are xbowmen down there, somewhere in the bushes whose projectiles fly straight (so you have to dance polka while givin'... erm shooting heads off) and second you can't hit shit from such distance even with 163 wpp and a longbow. Even if you hit for every low medium guy you need two such shots.

Basically, you came here telling me how archery is super easy mode just because every two weeks you get drunk and get on your shitty alt which doesn't have anything heirloomed and you OWN everyone! How yes no! You own everyone just like Michael owns everyone all the time, on every map and with every class, but he likes to play hardest possible class Teh elephant where he can't score enough to be first cause of dem pikemen...

Full of shit, that's what you're last two posts are. Stop trolling and maybe we can have nice and proper discussion about mod balance, otherwise you're just looking foolish. 

Huge raging whine of bullshit and drivel.

Now you just look and sound childish.
Stop fucking raging.

[Leshma]

Yeah, I'm raging and acting childish.

You, on the other hand, are always right, acting mature and calm and...

I'm out, keep nerfing archery cause Great Gorath the Warcleaver Guy says so...

[Gorath]

Yeah, I'm raging and acting childish.

You, on the other hand, are always right, acting mature and calm and...

I'm out, keep nerfing archery cause Great Gorath the Warcleaver Guy says so...

I didn't say nerf archery here.  You should try looking up my posts in the forums where I actually say that I believe ranged is pretty balanced in general now.  Melee and cav as well.
I simply don't like the AMOUNT of ranged spam/players.  I've stated quite a few times that overall I think we're in a pretty good state of balance other than INTERNAL balance issues.
I also never said I'm always right, or any of that other shit. 
Yes you are acting like a raging child at this point though.
All I pointed out was that there is nothing in the game that is preventing you from doing something other than the cheap-shit run and shoot method you were defending.  It's valid and archers are going to do it, but they don't HAVE to.  They CHOOSE to.

You need 24 agi or more to catch up with longbowman. Reason why I run is simple, I'm forced to use Hammer with no wpf and with 3 ps. Gimme at least 5 ps, 100 2h wpf and a longsword and I'll gladly fight any of you.

Blame slots for every archer running away. Remove slots and I'll fight even with 1 wpf.

Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)
Strength: 18
Agility: 18
Hit points: 53

Unused skill points: 5
Skills to attributes: 2

Power Strike: 6
Athletics: 6
Power Draw: 6
Weapon Master: 6

Two Handed: 100
Archery: 134

There.  Longsword, Horn Bow, 1 bag of arrows.
Oh, not good enough?  Then that's your CHOICE.  You're not forced to do anything.
Hell, I want to be able to carry a 2her for duels, shield for anti ranged, longspear for anti cav and great maul for anti shields but I can't do that either so I'm FORCED to deal with being vunerable to things as well.

[KING_UGBERT]

I haven't really played Mount and Blade since the patch.  I just check the forums once in awhile to see if archery arrow speed is fast again.  I can get plenty of kills with slow arrows, but it just isn't fun anymore.  I'll check once in awhile to see how things pan out. 

/salute to all you archers who still play, KING UGBERT

[Adalwulf]

lol wtf is  this drama. i'm doing just fine as an archer with MW rus and barbed arrows....it's easy....tin can or not...it just takes getting used to.

[MrShine]

lol wtf is  this drama. i'm doing just fine as an archer with MW rus and barbed arrows....it's easy....tin can or not...it just takes getting used to.

Missile speed is something that takes getting used to... to a point.  But against aware opponents it literally becomes a crap-shoot at anything beyond mid-short range.  Too much can happen by the time you fire to the time the arrow reaches the intended location that you can't be a consistent shot unless your enemies are standing still or are moving in a predictable straight line. 

Sure things might glance less now but with cut changes it takes a silly amount of arrows to kill someone in heavy armor, even mid-heavy armor.  This coupled with the arrow upkeep changes coupled with the missile speed nerfs have made non-longbow archers much much less functional as a whole.

Pre-patch I went 15/24 MW horn bow/MW bodkin arrows and was pretty effective.  My post-patch archer gen was 18-21 and I noticed a substantial decease in general effectiveness; I had to hit people more often and it took more arrows fired per hit.

It simply isn't worth it right now, not compared to other classes that are more useful and infinitely more enjoyable.

[Adalwulf]

not true at all...you just have to know how the player will react...all players dodge left or right in a normal pattern and I nail them 70% of the time. Also when i'm scoring top 5 in frags I'd hardly say archery is ineffective.

[Xant]

Missile speed is something that takes getting used to... to a point.  But against aware opponents it literally becomes a crap-shoot at anything beyond mid-short range.  Too much can happen by the time you fire to the time the arrow reaches the intended location that you can't be a consistent shot unless your enemies are standing still or are moving in a predictable straight line. 

Sure things might glance less now but with cut changes it takes a silly amount of arrows to kill someone in heavy armor, even mid-heavy armor.  This coupled with the arrow upkeep changes coupled with the missile speed nerfs have made non-longbow archers much much less functional as a whole.

Pre-patch I went 15/24 MW horn bow/MW bodkin arrows and was pretty effective.  My post-patch archer gen was 18-21 and I noticed a substantial decease in general effectiveness; I had to hit people more often and it took more arrows fired per hit.

It simply isn't worth it right now, not compared to other classes that are more useful and infinitely more enjoyable.

So what, you should be able to hit people at long range consitently while they're dodging? 

Also BS @ your "silly amount of arrows". Rus bow and long bow kill in 2-4 arrows even if the other guy is wearing heavy armor. And about long bow? On my archer I preferred the Rus Bow, good enough damage and faster. You're also not EU so you don't see the archers who top scoreboards consistently with rus bows..

[Siiem]

Let's not forget Jambi with his heirloom rus bow and arrows going around one hitting people. It gets fucking deadly. And I'm not talking about headshots here.

[MrShine]

So what, you should be able to hit people at long range consitently while they're dodging? 

Also BS @ your "silly amount of arrows". Rus bow and long bow kill in 2-4 arrows even if the other guy is wearing heavy armor. And about long bow? On my archer I preferred the Rus Bow, good enough damage and faster. You're also not EU so you don't see the archers who top scoreboards consistently with rus bows..

I don't think archers should be able to consistently score hits at long range,  but from personal observation with 3.5 generations as an archer before the patch and 1 generation after the patch I noticed a substantial decrease in my overall effectiveness as an archer.

And yes, with a masterwork horn bow and masterwork bodkin arrows (which incidentally does the same amount of damage as a +0 rus bow w/ +0 bodkins...) I did have to hit people 4-6+ times if they wore mid-high/high level armor.  I can't recall a single time I 2 shot someone in heavy armor unless I hit them in the head or it was a cav player who I plugged at point blank range with speed bonus.

Being pigeon-holed into using a rus or long bow as an archer shouldn't be required in order to be effective.  Not to mention that bodkin arrows now break to the point of being literally unsupportable as a consistent part of a build... anyone using them consistently will be bleeding gold  that gen (lost 45k leveling to 30 with them). 

Did archery need some changes? Perhaps. But there were too many nerfs in too many facets of the archery game that all came at once.  The result?  Underpowered archery.