Best lance for cavalry

[Supreme_Leader]

Of the four that can do manual attacks:

Double lance
130 length
32 pierce

Light lance
175 length
27 pierce

Lance
180 length
28 pierce

Heavy lance
190 length
23 pierce

The vanilla lance looks the best of these. Does the 10 length on heavy make an enormous difference?

[Smoothrich]

The vanilla lance looks the best of these. Does the 10 length on heavy make an enormous difference?

Yes, it does.  Cav is all about outranging your opponent or throwing off your target with speed and timing, unless they are unaware.

So fighting other cav and going for big plays against 2handers and polearmers, every bit of reach counts.

However with the damage nerf to heavy lance, it is pretty weak unless loomed.  I would recommend a Lance if you are new to cav since it does more damage and the higher speed is easier.  I'd also suggest you switch to Heavy Lance once you get better so you can do better against other cav and aware infantry, or if you could try a MW one.

[CrazyCracka420]

I always preferred the 10 length on the heavy lance, even with 10 less speed, and quite a bit less damage.  Just because as cavalry, it's very nice to be able to reach out and touch the other lancer coming at you.

The current damage of the heavy lance is 23 pierce damage, which is terrible.  And after they nerfed it, I started playing around with a lance (which does 28p, and my +3 heavy lance did only 26pierce after the nerf).  And decided to give it a try.

I ended up trading my +3 heavy lance and +1 wisby gauntlets for someone's +3 lance.  And it was the best trade I've ever made.  I love the speed and damage of the lance.  I basically try to avoid going head to head versus enemy cavalry, but I still will do it because I'm competitive as hell.  Sometimes I win because my lance gets to full extension before the heavy lance, other times I can throw off their timing by changing speeds and/or direction.

And honestly, a good cavalry lancer knows that you help your team the most by supporting your infantry.  Supporting your infantry usually means attacking enemy infantry when your infantry is engaging them.  Or else keeping off enemy cavalry who are swarming your infantry.  You can do both very easily with the lance (enemy cavalry will be trying to kill your infantry as you lance their faces).  Even when you're running screens on the enemy cavalry, you're better off not engaging them as either person has a puncher's chance of winning the 1v1.  If you go and die right away to another cavalry lancer, you're hurting your team a lot (considering you could take out 3-5 engaged enemy infantry pretty easily if you play your cards right).

The extra damage of the lance is nice versus infantry as well.  I wasn't even 1 hitting people with 6 ps with a normal heavy lance in strat battles, even when aiming for their heads.  And the extra speed is nice as well if you're going through an infantry line and want to be able to stab one or two more people than you'd have been able to get off with the heavy lance.   Also it's saved me at least once being able to get my lance out quickly when my horse is stopped and I have a cavalry lancer bearing down on me. 

In the end, 23 pierce is just too low to justify me using it over a lance.   And I'm doing better now with my +3 lance, than I ever did with the +3 heavy lance before it was nerfed to shit.  Even if they made the +3 heavy lance back to 29 pierce damage, I'd probably stick with the lance now that I'm used to it.  In the end though, heavy lance versus lance, or even light lance, all have strengths and weaknesses.  It's just a matter of how you want to play the class that really matters most for picking the weapon.

[agweber]

Even when you're running screens on the enemy cavalry, you're better off not engaging them as either person has a puncher's chance of winning the 1v1.

I found this statement hilarious. Overall great post as well.

I'm definitely a noob lancer, but I just wanted to chime in one generation I was a hoplite/lancer support cav, and the Light Lance performed considerably better than the regular Lance when I hit the ground. I was almost always staying with our teams infantry so when I went down I usually had time to get back up and hoplite. The light lance is noticeably faster for a hoplite than the regular is, but it doesn't shine as bright on horseback unless you're playing a playstyle where you're stabbing many times in very quick succession.

[CrazyCracka420]

Hilarious just the way it's worded, or because it seems contradictory?  I have always referred to (and heard it referred to) a "Puncher's chance" if either side has a chance of winning.  But I just googled the term and see that other people refer to a "puncher's chance" as something that is a very small chance of happening.

What I meant, was that in a 1v1, heavy lance vs heavy lance, even if you're better than the other guy, he still has a chance to get you.  Since I had A.D.D. and because I'm super competitive, I'll still take those chances more than I should (if I was to play "strictly" by the book and by the odds of helping my team win).

[Inglorious]

Get a Great Lance and out range and out damage everyone

Purely my own opinion and my personal favorite lance

1 Shot kill everyone but the +3 plate users


Only one or 2 draw backs are, that if you go head to head with another horseman, you need to either aim for the horse at the last moment, or get kill shot. The latter is scarier and exhilarating to do. And the other is that you have no thrust, and it is only couch-able. But it makes up for itself in being able to outrange the LOLstabbers and what have you's. If they jump to hit you, raise your lance. Makes it easier to get kills if they jump IMO.

[CrazyCracka420]

Yes, the great lance is also a very great lance to use from horse back.  The length and damage kick ass. 

For someone new trying it out, watch out for heavy lances still being able to out reach you if they time it perfectly (depending on where you're aiming as well as how you are both positioned).   I like to use the great lance in strategus battles, it's got some very nice length.  It's also nice in battle for a change of pace, but you're attacking people a lot less frequently than with stabbing lances, and you are trying to avoid other cavalry usually.  I usually end up getting distracted with a great lance and not as useful as i'd be with my lance.

[Torben]

the heavy lance stab outreaches the great lance.  in my opinion the latter is a support weapon for 1h cav only,  a great one however.

as the stats are atm,  you should consider the heavy lance if you must attack 2h heroes head on or do fast hits on plane maps as the speed bonus is usefull with it.  in any other situation,  the lance is the better choice. 

wall of text why the lance outclasses the heavy atm and in the right hands:

(click to show/hide)

even in a head on lancer duel,  the lance wins over the heavy lance,  as a skilled vanilla lancer can outmaneuver the slow stab animation of the heavy lance and then close in and strike with his considerably faster lance whilst the heavy lance is steal in its stab animation,  making a block impossible. (the aformentioned scenario accures in low speed encounters which happen when two apponents know of the others strength and enter this reaching game,  its not the usual encounter but kind of a "duel" situation. this slow encounter also disfavors the heavy lances,  whos' damage is greatly dependent on speed bonus.) this however only goes for master level cavs,  so you want to consider it if you should want to stick to lancing and think current lance stats will be arround for a while.

even the light lance can be a viable choice if you want to do lots of backstabbing and off-horse hopliting like mentioned above
happy new year btw, 

[Inglorious]

Great lance in strategus battles are game changers.

Score instant kills on unsuspecting infantry and archers. Smash shields and ward off enemy cavalry. Very much so a support weapon. I rack up more kills with the great lance in strat battles than I would as a pikeman anyday.

Wish more people actually bought them


As for the lance. I approve its use over the heavy. Especially if you are on a budget. Other than that, if you have the money to blow, and you feel the extra 10L makes you a cav god, then go for it. I've lanced and been lanced down by both, either way.

[Osiris]

when i hear punchers chance its a term for boxing the other guy could be a better boxer but the fight is 50-50 because he has a knockout punch 

[Equal]

i have to reccomend the heavy lance, it has the best reach in lancer duels, and a perfectly timed heavy lance can take out a great lance (did it once, exhilirating).

honestly i dont get 6 PS until level 30 and i will admit i dont often get 1hkos on armored targets but it takes no less than 3 on anyone with 4/5 PS (granted on a courser)

speaking of courser, if you want to lance cav (effectively) use 5+ riding horses only (destrier, cataphract, courser) courser is my favorite but can get taken down earlier in rounds, destrier/cataphract will last longer .. another benefit of a 5 riding build is 7 PS (21/15)

[Shemaforash]

in cRPG? Lance.