Author Topic: The classes and the maintenance (realism discussion)  (Read 614 times)

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Offline nuffen

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The classes and the maintenance (realism discussion)
« on: February 15, 2011, 06:47:39 pm »
+1
I think its very unfair that some girls or guys can play with their top/favorite gears all the time without having to take realism into consideration.

Since realism is an argument in crpg, imho the price of the items should be based on what the would cost compared to the class income in the middle ages.

I am aware that other players would prefer other gear, but I got a trustworthy source on what some builds costs. These are no fantasy builds, these are real builds and the gear he used is the gear those chars were most effective (in his hands):


Heavy Cavalry: (rich noble knight) Light Lance 1910 (gold), Long Spiked Club 3174, Black Armor 34239, Black Greaves 4629, Great Helmet 6723, Mamluk Horse 59986,
sum 110661


Archer: (poor robber whos close to dying of hunger) Leather Jerkin 669, Khergit Leather Boots 143, Nomad Bow 3156, Bodkin Arrows 4215, Bodkin Arrows 4215, Pickaxe 240
sum 12638


2h "poor but skilled fighter": Leather Jacket 84, Khergit Leather Boots 143, Nodachi 10589
sum 10816


Polearm "poor but skilled fighter": Leather Jacket 84, Khergit Leather Boots 143, Long Hafted Blade 4622
sum 4849


1h-shield (footsoldier): Leather Jacket 84, Khergit Leather Boots 143, Heater Shield 2712, Military Sickle 2468
sum 5407


(Light) Lancer (mongol): Light Lance 1910, Khergit Leather Boots 143, Heater Shield 2712, Khergit Lamellar Vest 3342, Long Hafted Blade 4622, Sarranid Horse 23982,     
sum 36711


Crossbowman/2hHybrid (rich nobleman without horse): Leather Jerkin 669, Khergit Leather Boots 143, Sniper Crossbow 17477, Steel Bolts 2136, Longsword 5123, Nordic Shield 1064,
sum 26612


With all those chars the same player ends up with the same kill death ratio in the long run. Some builds need more time than others to become good, but when he compared them at level 30, its all the same. This will be same for most other players. For players that only ever have played archer, it might be a bit different, they might need some time to get used to melee, but he was talking about the long run anyway.

So I dont see why one build has only to pay the unrealisticly high upkeep of 4849 for peasant-gears, and another for 110661 noble knight-gear, when the nobles in the middle ages had a lot more income compared to the peasants than this.


I know the goal of the upkeep system was to make it harder for the nobles and easier for the peasants. I think it works very good, and Ive enjoyed a lot more diversity in combat-style and armor after the patch. But I dont think it goes far enough. I still see tincans (rich noble) going around paying way too little. We all know chadz a communist, we read it all the time, everywhere. Why cant we have equality amongst the masses? Remove those rich nobles, double the prices of the heavy horses and the heaviest armor, it should pay as much as it did for the medieval nobles!

I am talking about realism this time, its just not okay that some people can play the mod ALL THE TIME without any historical accuracy, and others can do it all the time.

I dont like it, but I would be able to accept the nobles having some hunter-days when theyve earned enough to pay realisticly amount of money. Shared suffer, you know and so on.
I dont like it, but I would be able to accept to ride my shitty Rouncey when at least the archers had to suffer a bit, too. Shared suffer, you know and so.

This mod should have more realism to it, all the time

Also, compare archer and crossbowman, not fair neither. (missing argument)

Or 2h and polearm "Ninja", ninjas are way too easy to kill with some proper spamming!
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Offline Ganon

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Re: The classes and the maintenance (realism discussion)
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2011, 07:03:35 pm »
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Hmm countertrolling nice

+1

and..

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Offline Gorath

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Re: The classes and the maintenance (realism discussion)
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2011, 07:09:47 pm »
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Hmm countertrolling nice

+1

and..

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+1

Upkeep is fine.  Goretooth has to save up to run around as the kraken by playing a poor archer first.  Upkeep is doing it's job for the most part.  If we were going to take realism into consideration then there would only be a handful of people that could play as knights, all of the peasants would remain peasants (you couldn't be born a peasant and become a knight.  They'd execute you for trying) forever.
And I should be nice or polite to anyone.... why exactly?

Offline Ganon

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Re: The classes and the maintenance (realism discussion)
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2011, 07:15:59 pm »
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Realism would mean stategus fief owners would be rich and could afford anything, and strong clans could hand out gold to their members to have them wear top gear all the time. That would also make strategus more interesting.