Why am I banned (Eques_Kaskar)

[Torben]

I don't understand why you guys are trying to argue against this punishment. None of the admins will budge to unban his account, but he can still play. Tell him to go buy a new cd key. If he's caught botting again, it will be an IP ban next and he won't be able to ever play(he can keep trying to log in using vpn etc but i'll just keep banning him).

I'm open to hearing community response to this and what their thoughts are, as long as the discussion stays on-topic. I do not guarantee or promise it'll affect our current decision, which is: ban stays.

[Krabat[Bruno]]

According to Krabat, who talked with us yesterday, you wanted to use the money to buy yourself some +3 items, so thanks for already admitting to that

Ehm no ! First of all I wrote to Ulfur ! And the text you just copy pasted is like in the middle of our discussion! I explained that Kaskar told me that he was going to use it for the armoury to get some loomed stuff in there( there are like 15 + items in there ...). I did never ever say that he was going to use it for himself sorry but if ulfur is already showing you our steam chat please tell him to show everthing and not only a little part . 

[Porthos]

ok, it's not like this guy is my dad or something, and i've already expressed my opinion. as much as i love PU, i don't see how claiming a leadership of a deserted clan to take the money from its bank is a crime. in fact i praise this guy's smartness and imo he dindu nuffin wrong.

anyway i just wanted to publicly apologise to cassi if the thing i've said appears to be rude to her/him/whatever it is and im surprised that i wasn't even muted for such kind of behaviour towards the official admin. i hope talks like this won't be tolerated any further

[Kalitorian]

I think he should write and unban essay where he describes the events that took place from his point of view in detail and explain what his intentions where and if anybody can back his story.
Then the community should decide.

[Thorvic]

This punishment is hard but deserved. Even if there is no explicit mention regarding clan bank management in the game rules, i presume the common sense is much more than an abstract rule, it is a fundamental principle that reinforce the existing rules ; a principle which even have a juridic value beyond the gaming sphere.

If we don't consider the "botting" thing (which has already be punished according to the game rules), that guy just stole more than 10m gold from Peasants United's bank, the most "solidary clan" ever created on this mod ; and you guys are still trying to defend him/asking for a ban lifting ? I mean, even if we can't establish the final purpose of such a money withdraw, we can presume that he committed his action with bad intentions considering the facts Uther reported in his post ; which is enough to qualify an infringement of this common sense principle.

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On the other hand, i've been reading the arguments from the ones who are defending Kaskar, are you serious guys, really ? If you are trying to find arguments to save your friend's ass, at least do it properly because your arguments are kinda weak...

- Lack of players, are you kidding me ? The mod has never been as active as it is nowadays, he won't miss anyone (well, not everyone, since some of you shown their commitment into seeing Kaskar unbanned).
- What would have happen if he did not take it, WTF By that, you admit the idea it is fine to take tons of money from a bank since no one complains about it ? So maybe you think all the players who gave/lent their money to PU Bank all agreed to finally see their investments in the pockets of a selfish cunt ?

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To conclude : ban deserved imo, and we desperately need to write more specific rules regarding clan management ; so the stupid human beings who aren't able to understand common sense rules by themselves can at least read somewhere what is wrong/authorized...

[Porthos]

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C'mon you must know that creating a bot to leech and then stealing all the gold from the 'Help New Players Clan' is a bad thing

I love how you're all mixing up these two just to make this shitty decision to look fine. But you know what the problem is? Yes, messing with bots is obviously forbidden (and nobody in this thread justified him for doing that), while claiming for leadership and taking the money from bank is not. These two are the separate actions. And no he wasn't just banned for messing with the bots at N/A - he got robbed (you took away HIS money, that he took from PU bank using the LEGAL WAY to obtain it) and banned globally. "Claim leadership" is the thing that is OFFICIALLY FEATURED by the devs team for fuck's sake. Just remove it then and the problem is solved. I just don't get it how on earth it is rightful to ban people for using a thing which is officially featured by your own goddamn side rofl

I'd be pretty sure that if I took advantage and stole all the gold from Grey Order bank after deranking everyone, and ignored all their PMs asking to be returned to a higher clan rank, that I'd be punished.

Lolwhat? The guy wasn't deranking anyone, he just used the OFFICIAL FEATURE. Imagine that you got your clan taken off due to your inactivity - now tell me: who's fault is this if not your own? Why this guy should've listen to anyone of the folks who forgot about managing their own clan, I just don't get it at all. He was in his own right to do whatever he wanted with the money he got. And tbh even if he'd be not that nice to rebuy the banner slot for dem peasants, if he turned out to be kind of complete douche and would make some hilarious banner with a giant cock and something like "PU SUK COKS STUPID FEGITS" in the middle it still would be fine and legit in my eyes (but probably it would lead him to a rightful ban or at least to a banner change enforcement) because the only ones who should be ashamed really are the PU leaders, not this fine young gentleman (who is a closest friend of mine btw, thanks, Thorvic ).

And finally I don't get this line as well (gosh, how did I missed it even ):

Let me explain the problem:
I looked over your characters who were part of Peasants United and didn't see any deposits which would amount to 10mln gold, so this was not your money. If I am wrong, please do post some pics of the bank deposits you've done in the past in that clan, I could very well have overlooked something.
- you took the money from a clan that wasn't yours. I would understand if you just wanted to get back what you deposited first, but that was not the case.

What do you even mean with this, Uther? Sinse when clan banks works like this? WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS LITERALLY xD. Since when the only people who can take the money from the bank are the ones who deposited in it? And why they can take stricly only the ammount of the gold that they have put into? Just wwwhhhaaaat? Clan's money is the clan's money, it's not like it still belongs to the people who did the deposits. The guy took the leadership over the clan via the official method (not scam, all fair), and now it is HIS CLAN and HIS MONEY. Every single golden coin, every fucking one of them. This is just fucking retarded why I'm even trying to explain such obvious things haha You guys just screwed yourselves and now trying to act like it's all fine. Good luck with this. Im outta here, thanks for good laughs anyway

p.s. at this point i regret bothering about this case tbh, and it's as clear as day that there's no way you'll let this guy to keep the money, so just ignore this. and sorry for being salty and pesky again, sometimes i just can't handle my temper on the spur of the moment, it seems

[Viscount]

One half wants him unbanned the other wants him banned.
Honestly this man knew this was gonna happen. you should know this a lot if your even botting.
of course its gonna be a well known rule of a ban, 2nd you stole money from a clan completely not yours. we all know how this makes people make you think you are an idiot.

and lastly you even had these bots saying and doing actions. we all know your trying to do this shit so they don't look like botting.
They were timed and the logs im sure report all the spam repeated thing.

This guy deserves to be banned for even botting and lying that he never knew botting was against the rules.
He's lying to us all that he never knew about it since these two bots were made to look like their active players.

1 bot would walk side to side then nudge and type a word
while the other goes to side until it reaches into a corner

This prevented players from joining into the battle. this should be a global ban reason here.
You lied to most of us, including admins ~ this is a other reason for a ban.
You stole money from a clan~ Retarded ass reason why you would even do that.

[Krabat[Bruno]]

and ignored all their PMs asking to be returned to a higher clan rank, that I'd be punished.

he hasn’t  got a massage by a admin that warned him!

[Krabat[Bruno]]

This punishment is hard but deserved. Even if there is no explicit mention regarding clan bank management in the game rules, i presume the common sense is much more than an abstract rule, it is a fundamental principle that reinforce the existing rules ; a principle which even have a juridic value beyond the gaming sphere.

If we don't consider the "botting" thing (which has already be punished according to the game rules), that guy just stole more than 10m gold from Peasants United's bank, the most "solidary clan" ever created on this mod ; and you guys are still trying to defend him/asking for a ban lifting ? I mean, even if we can't establish the final purpose of such a money withdraw, we can presume that he committed his action with bad intentions considering the facts Uther reported in his post ; which is enough to qualify an infringement of this common sense principle.

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- Lack of players, are you kidding me ? The mod has never been as active as it is nowadays, he won't miss anyone (well, not everyone, since some of you shown their commitment into seeing Kaskar unbanned).
- What would have happen if he did not take it, WTF By that, you admit the idea it is fine to take tons of money from a bank since no one complains about it ? So maybe you think all the players who gave/lent their money to PU Bank all agreed to finally see their investments in the pockets of a selfish cunt ?

First of all he has got a punishment for the Botting already ! 1year ban on the Na Servers                                     And I meant by what would happen if he did not take it? First of all there was nobody leading the clan ! And the money in the bank would have stayed there for ever. If there is nobody leading the clan the bank won’t get used for the new players! But Kaskar was doing something! He was probably even going to buy loomed stuff for the clan but we will never know because you are all not trusting me nor Kaskar and there was also nobody asking him about that pquestion !!! And then the lack of players .... throvic I don’t know how long you already play but we had days with over 300 players and nowadays we have got 1 thrid of it we did not had to ask for going on siege to play it or asking for eu7 and shit ...

[Kaskar]

I'd be pretty sure that if I took advantage and stole all the gold from Grey Order bank after deranking everyone, and ignored all their PMs asking to be returned to a higher clan rank, that I'd be punished.

Which PMs ? No admin wrote me any PM.

I even wrote a PM to no_rules_just_play_cRPGhelp, if he wants to have the clan leadership back, but he still doesn't answer.

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[Kaskar]

To that botting thing at the NA servers:
To make everything clear about this. I was on the empty NA1 and didn't want to stay still while leeching. To make my character move and hit air and stuff, I used the macros from a programm of my mouse drivers. It recorded the keys, which I press on the keyboard (hit and block was on the keyboard too) and the mouse driver gave out the keyboard signals in a loop, again and again to make my character move. I didn't have to modify the game data. The NA bann was for the NA servers and not for EU and was for one year.
I feel sorry for it and can understand, why people are judging me for that. I don't know why I did it exactly, but I think it was because I thought people wouldn't really feel offended if I am leeching. Since then I already played some hours and didn't leeched again.
I promise, that I will never do that again in the future and I can just repeat, that I think that the NA ban is just fair for my bad behavior.

[Viscount]

I never said to explain to me how you did it.
I'm just saying you are lying about not knowing it being a rule.
The server was empty because no one could join because of you nor kick you by themselves. they needed 3 people.

Krabat stop making up things. he was clearly gonna use the money for himself.
the clans not unactive it has active users. Don't defend a moron who fucking stole  a lot and also botted.

People like them should stay banned. He's a terrible influence around the community.

[Krabat[Bruno]]

I'm just saying you are lying about not knowing it being a rule.

Its not a rule ! So how should he know about rules that are not existing ?!

- second, you took out the money from The Peasants United clan bank, which is not outright forbidden and I can understand why you did that

[Viscount]

Maybe read more besides jumping to conclusions, that was for the botting.
Botting should be a global ban anyways. he should be banned for a year for every server,
just like every game out there that bans bots for every server.

[Uther Pendragon]

I'm locking this thread, as per my earlier post. Decision stays, no unban.

If you have problem understanding our decision, please read this again, carefully:

not outright forbidden

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outright - just as using green arrows wasn't outright forbidden - but guess what was forbidden? Modifying game files to your own profit.

If your common sense is not working, here are some more specific guidelines. This is not an explicit list, common sense always overrides disputes. Do not come crying "it's not prohibited in the rules" if you invent a new creative way to be an idiot and get punished.

Do not come crying "it's not prohibited in the rules" if you invent a new creative way to be an idiot and get punished.