New Conquest

[woody]

Helms deep not my favourite map. Conquest - not my favourite mode. An hour on it today and it was really enjoyable. Worked very well. Well done Fips, made it work.

[Fips]

-1

How dare you to tell me i did something good.

[Joseph Porta]

This thread just doesn't feel right.

[NejStark]

I do like the mode, and the above can appealing if you are wanting to play for the long haul, but I think it should be on a separate server.

I still find the rounds a bit too long, or like the time limit should be scaled per map, based on their difficulty (or average time it takes to take the whole lot) for attackers.

The good thing about battle and straight siege is the wallowing x1'er can change their fate and gain multi with a heroic charge, sneaky manoeuvres, or good teamwork, but conquest is more of a slog, for minimum 15/20 mins.

[Phew]

I've long been an advocate of Conquest; I think it combines the best elements of siege and battle without the major negatives of either. So I'm glad it has captured Fips' attention again, and good work on the recent improvements.

That said, the current implementation is incompatible with the multiplier system (even with the minimum x2). Why should the outcome of a previous siege map be the difference between x2 and x5 for up to the next THIRTY minutes? And then if you do have an x5 but have to go, you feel compelled to leech, because 30 minutes of x5.

I say:
-Reset every Conquest map change so that attackers have x1 and defenders have x5
-After each flag is taken, attackers gain a multi and defenders lose one
-Winner of the map gets an additional discrete gold/XP reward (like DTV)
-Limit each map to no more than two rounds (2.5 hrs of Helm's Deep is too much for anyone)

This way, attackers still have motivation to capture flags even if the map/teams otherwise give them no chance to win the map. Also, defenders would be compelled to do something other than team death match until they are holed up at their last spawn, at which point they might start coordinating as a team (the current status quo).

[[ptx]]

Issue with above is that it gives the motivation to capture/defend flags - but not actually win the round. Why take that last flag, when you can just farm X5? Or why defend it, if you can just lost and go back to X5? Completely counter-productive.

[Phew]

Issue with above is that it gives the motivation to capture/defend flags - but not actually win the round. Why take that last flag, when you can just farm X5? Or why defend it, if you can just lost and go back to X5? Completely counter-productive.

-Winner of the map gets an additional discrete gold/XP reward (like DTV)

There is your answer.

The multiplier system rewards performance in a given round with increased rewards in the next round. That's fine in Battle or Siege with ~2-3 minute rounds, but with 30 minute rounds, it only benefits no-lifers. Therefore, I think we need a reward system for conquest that provides immediate rewards for capturing/defending flags, combined with a discrete gold/XP reward for winning the round.

[Fips]

Problem with the whole thing is the multi system itself and as long as there is noone capable of getting rid of it just having base x2 for conquest was the best solution. Yes, big maps are at a huge disadvantage there, but then again, you only repair once every 45 minutes on the big one for example. And x2 is just fine xp-wise. Not to mention it's actually x4 because double xp. If you want to have the multi system implemented right (with flag capping, countdown timers for def n all that stuff) you would need someone to know the siege beta code very well, which is another thing we are lacking right now, so yeah. It will probably stay this way and i think it's still better than not having conquest at all.

[Joseph Porta]

Issue with above is that it gives the motivation to capture/defend flags - but not actually win the round. Why take that last flag, when you can just farm X5? Or why defend it, if you can just lost and go back to X5? Completely counter-productive.

Maybe an XP and Gold bonus upon round won before end-time could give incentive to capture that last flag?

[_Tak_]

Fips there is one issue with conquest i don't like, maybe its intended? For example i just joined a game, started with x1, won a round, then map changed to conquest. I now start with x2 although i won a round from last map. This should be x3 right? since new players start with x2 once conquest starts.

feels like all the hardwork on last round is wasted since you start with x2 anyway

[Fips]

x2 is the minimum, if you've won x2 the last round yeah, it could be x3 instead, but i don't know how easy it is to implement. Gotta ask Tydeus.

[Thahost]

sorry wrong post section but could someone of the admins come to EU2 and change map its bugged again

sorry i know wrong thread but dont know how to tell you otherwise

[Thahost]

thx

[Tydeus]

thx

np

For future reference, irc is the fastest way to get a hold of an admin for issues like this(Jony_the_Grey knew.)

http://forum.melee.org/index.php?action=chat