Author Topic: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?  (Read 5839 times)

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Offline BlueKnight

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #90 on: September 29, 2012, 03:42:07 pm »
0
What......


Back in the day everyone brought a long spear up their ass and would follow around in huge groups over heading through their team mates and hitting the enemy. It was pretty much uber abused by everyone, honestly pretty much became a necessity for melee fights to have at least a few pike guys behind their team mates using over head spam that wouldn't touch your team mates due to awesome warband mechanics (that got fixed thankfully)

That's what I remember.
Ye it was abused but currently there are more longspearmen than that time.

EDIT: Also we might talk about different times. All in all it's like 2 years so I mean like 1 year ago.

EDIT2: Don't know how it is and was in NA.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2012, 03:45:44 pm by BlueKnight »
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Offline Chris_P_Bacon

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #91 on: September 29, 2012, 03:43:39 pm »
0
What......


Back in the day everyone brought a long spear up their ass and would follow around in huge groups over heading through their team mates and hitting the enemy. It was pretty much uber abused by everyone, honestly pretty much became a necessity for melee fights to have at least a few pike guys behind their team mates using over head spam that wouldn't touch your team mates due to awesome warband mechanics (that got fixed thankfully)

That's what I remember.
There's a reason no sheathe weapons happened, and if I remember correctly, this is it. +1 Mori, you sexy, sexy beast.


Also there are totally not "more longspearmen". I know *maybe* 6 dedicated longspear/pikemen, and that's including me, and I'm not really dedicated at all. There may be some people who pick it up for a round or two and then drop it, but they are insignificant.

Offline Herkkutatti666

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #92 on: September 29, 2012, 07:31:00 pm »
+1
Everything was good back then when you could have pike, flamberge, bow and arrows at same time ;_;
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Offline sF_Guardian

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #93 on: September 29, 2012, 07:35:40 pm »
-1
Game is fine atm, really fine :)

I play less and less but have fun when I do,
really feels nice with less heroes and more tactics,
some tweakin at Greatswords, SpamBecDeFrance and Steel Pick wouldn`t hurt though :D
I don't want to give a feedback to molly neither i want to ban him,I wanted to give advise high authorities to take his admin rights.Panos you monkey wrench where would u put this topic enlighten me you cancer fuck.

Offline Rebelyell

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #94 on: September 30, 2012, 12:31:46 am »
0
Game is fine atm, really fine :)

I play less and less but have fun when I do,
really feels nice with less heroes and more tactics,
some tweakin at Greatswords, SpamBecDeFrance and Steel Pick wouldn`t hurt though :D

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Offline OzyTheSage

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #95 on: September 30, 2012, 08:10:45 pm »
-1
*Skips  most of the thread*

As a person who used to use the pike longspear a lot (even during the 'pocket pike' days mentioned before, abusing overheads on not just the pike longspear but other weapons it affected as well) I'm just going to say that almost any fight you encounter with a few of these is going to give anybody but maybe a shielder a hard time. Even a shielder pretty much won't get a chance to attack if the pikeman isn't retarded.

When they fixed the overhead problem they also changed the hitboxes so that polearms hit teammates even more, so swinging or stabbing around teammates has become incredibly hazardous. Plus the fact that they get stuck on every little tiny thing within a 10 meter radius when you try to swing makes it a huge pain. Finally polearms generally have a shorter reach than 2 handers and are a little slower(?) makes them less useful (Am I making this up? It seems to be true from my experience). This only really effects pikemen who have a quarterstaff as backup, but it means people who use shield+spear as a support weapon (1 handed thrust has longer reach) get... shafted when it comes to fighting without teammates. I suppose it sort of enforces the idea that polearms are meant to be sort of formation fighting weapons and support, I've never seen anyone with a greatsword trying to lolstab enemies over their teammate's shoulders, which is something pikemen and hoplites can do even with the hitbox changes.

Nowadays you can carry a bamboo spear (Pike: 300, longspear: 245, bamboo: 200 weapon length) and a 'dueling' polearm and still be relatively effective despite the lower damage and reach because of polearm stagger opening enemies up for attack by more damaging teammates, or interrupting attacks that would hit teammates. But honestly, the longspear has 26 pierce, pike has 24, and bamboo spear has 25 and an overhead so the damage isn't too big of a deal, it's just the length you have to account for.

As for dumbing down the game, I've seen people with (long)awlpikes spamming stabs throughout enemies and cutting them down like nothing, which is a little more worrying to me than people with a pointy metal thing on a big stick. Sometimes it is a matter of knowing when to block down, or even know when the pikeman will strike so you can chamber his attacks.

Now one of the larger problems people have is the spin stab. The spin stab is where the pikeman will stab you at maximum range, then jump backwards to gain some distance from you while stabbing (usually they run facing away from you to get a better jump, then spin in midair to stab). This means they can stab you (and you usually block the first one) and then as you close the distance on them with an attack ready to go, they jump out of reach and poke you. Usually it hits and they can rinse and repeat, but if you just keep blocking for a little longer they won't be able to jump again and you can start hacking away. The problem really come when you're hugging against the pikeman. Sometimes they can still manage to stab you even though the tip of their weapon is 4 meters behind you when they chamber their attack. It's an oddity with the M&B engine, I believe, and sometimes you're lucky and it will just glance off your armor. (EDIT: Also, if you're hugging them, you're generally running towards them which the game might give them a movement damage bonus, which means it doesn't glance...?)

Keeping in mind I haven't played as a 'dedicated' pikeman longspearman in... probably over a year, so what I'm saying may not exactly be quite as valid as it used to be... I will say that I've been seeing more pikemen in siege so they can poke through breakable doors, killing anyone who gets near so it's next to impossible to progress... yeah...
« Last Edit: September 30, 2012, 08:14:54 pm by OzyTheSage »

Offline San

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #96 on: September 30, 2012, 08:49:15 pm »
0
I don't really notice an increase in difficulty (on NA) compared to before, but it's a lot more difficult to predict when you get hit since stabs hit instantly now. You can't look at your opponent's animation (if they're holding) since you would have already been hit by the time you notice the animation release. Before, they would jump and spin to attack. Now, they only need to jump back. If they jump back, there's a large chance they will hit you first, so it just takes a lot more time to try to kill them before one of their teammates come. In a way, longspear was nerfed, but some earlier counter tactics against them have also been nerfed.

I still think it's very possible to rambo, even when some of the other good players are on.

Offline SMEGMAR

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Re: Have long stabbing weapons dumbed down the game?
« Reply #97 on: October 10, 2012, 08:35:08 pm »
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>nope.jpg


   Alas, the game was already dumbed down by all the slow ass animations and co. where a single fight between two good players would turn out to be an endurance test rather than e-skill or visual memory.


   This dumbing down on the bright side, encouraged team-play and the multiplicity of "classes".

>Le meme arrows rule! xD
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