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Unban Essays / Re: The Greatest Unban Essay Ever Written (Expression, Freedom, Maturity, & Honesty)
« on: September 19, 2012, 08:06:00 am »
I would have posted sooner, but honestly I get a little disgusted by the politics of the forum. Especially when I have to deal with the lord of the flies-esque adminship who would rather serve their own egos instead of actually altering their clearly flawed policy that leads to blatant double standards and abuse.
In response to Canary's reply which is available here in its entirety.
http://forum.meleegaming.com/unban-essays/the-greatest-unban-essay-ever-written-%28expression-freedom-maturity-honesty%29/msg604090/#msg604090
1-A. I asked you to look at the logs (even gave you a specific time frame on when it happened) in the ban request thread involving a guy who was flagrantly TK'ing me, not to scour nearly a weeks worth of logs, completely unrelated to the actual case, for every shred of evidence you could possibly use against me. You know that. So don't try to act otherwise. I’m not impressed.
1-B. Yet you still chose to do so; through the better part of a week's worth of logs, days apart from the actual incident.
That's not a fluke. That is not a coincidence. Somebody apparently wanted to go through those logs pretty badly. You can't really say you don't want to do something when you do it anyway, in your spare time (as you put it), without any reasonable explanation.
Saying "we looked through the better part of a week's logs because you asked us to check up on this particular incident doesn't hold up to objective scrutiny. Saying one thing and doing another doesn't exactly give you a whole lot of credibility on this issue.
2. Implying that the community would be allowed to harass me to their hearts content while leaving me unable to respond in kind is a blatant double standard. The kinds of which I have been pointing out in the admins own behavior for a while now.
3. This is a strawman argument. You are directly accusing me of "willfully" and intentionally trying to alienate entire servers. This is entirely false.
Furthermore, the server has gray areas because you haven't boiled things down to the point where they would eliminate behaviors of obvious double-standards. This mod has been around 3+ years. It isn't really an "ongoing process" if no work is actually being done on it. Sadly, it takes a situation like this to make you realize/admit these gray areas lead to nothing but double-standards in rulings and abuse at the discretion of the personal feelings of the moderator staff. That is the nature of corruption at the very core of its concept.
I'm glad you're at least semi-acknowledging this in your post.
We’ve gone from:
http://forum.meleegaming.com/na-%28official%29/unban-spookpalace-38515/msg595222/#msg595222
"The server guidelines for behavior contain several grey areas that require human judgment and common sense. We won't be making them black and white and robo-responses simply because Spook has made a spectacle of himself."
To:
Canary: “The rules have gray areas because we're still discovering and establishing the boundaries for them, it is an ongoing process. You, actually, are helping.”
Not sure if you actually legitimately mean what you’re saying here. Not sure if you're actually going to do anything about it or just leave things as they are to make things more convenient for yourselves. But it is an improvement over what another admin previously said (to give credit where it is possibly due).
However, two months from now, if we see nothing has been done to narrow down the rules despite this whole “spectacle,” we will ABSOLUTELY know if you are flat-out lying to everyone right now or not.
4. Here’s the part of Canary’s post that gets really interesting.
Canary, here, literally uses the arguments of people who have been put up on the ban request forum, by me personally, for intentionally TW/TK’ing me after throwing a tantrum. These same people were guilty of the same infraction of rules (trash talking) that they accused me of and that you’re basing the meat of your argument off of. The difference is that I didn’t throw a tantrum and TK/TW anybody.
Canary, if you’re going to use the excuses (not even actual arguments) of guilty hypocrites, who are about to be hanged in their own ban threads for intentional tk’ing, I’d say your position and argument is in some serious fucking trouble.
Also, it is kind of convenient that you willfully chose not to actually link where the arguments were coming from, like you did initially, so people couldn’t put two and two together.
5. You can believe in expression of freedom and still care about someone’s feeling. Believing in the freedom to express yourself doesn’t mean you are an outright sociopath if that is what you’re attempting to imply.
6. This section is great because it is one fallacy followed by another (the second in the form of another strawman argument). First off, trash talk doesn’t give you the right to TK somebody. Repeated trash talk doesn’t give you the right to TK somebody. Do I ever TK anyone intentionally for trash talking me? No. Do I ever TK anyone intentionally for repeatedly trash talking me? No; hence, the painfully obvious logical fallacy here.
As for the strawman argument?
“You are a negative impact on this community and you've made it clear that you intend to continue to be so.”
I am also a positive impact on this community. However, I’m pretty sure I made it abundantly clear that I want the rules to be reformed to eliminate subjective rulebook abuse by the admins and to keep them from being protected by their obvious mistakes and practices of double standards. I’m pretty sure I’ve mentioned that I would be happy to turn in any trash talkers if you made it completely illegal. I am eager to form a solution. That doesn’t translate to what you’re trying to insinuate. The impression that I’m getting is that you don’t want to tackle this subject. If that is the case, why are you an admin? Do you not want to make the rules fairer for EVERYONE? Do you not want to eliminate possible abuse by your fellow admins and yourself? Do you not want to eliminate the corruption that goes on?
What is really curious in this segment is that you said I “push the limits” and not “break the limits.” That appears to me to be a Freudian slip. Seems to me it runs contrary to everything you’re trying to specifically state and prove; not exactly a great way to build an argument.
http://www.fallacyfiles.org/strawman.html
7. This last final list is so laughably desperate I can’t even believe you’re trying it. However, if you want me to specifically address each one of these bullet points, it’s just going to continue to prove how laughably absurd your entire argument has become when actually challenged.
Hell, let’s give an example on the first one just for fun:
The ENTIRE point of CRPG is to fight (either to kill or to claim an objective). Did you honestly even think before putting this list together? Honestly? You are definitely not helping your case with this type of nonsense.
Canary, I’m not intentionally trying to embarrass you here, but if this is the best you’re going to scrape together against me, you really have nobody to blame but yourself.
I can tell your heart isn’t in this argument. Frankly, I think everybody knows I’ve basically wrapped up the win for philosophical debate here (especially if this is the best initial response you can bring against me). It just really depends on if the admins will listen to reason or just abuse their positions of power to get their way and re-secure their own pride. They’d be proving my entire point by doing so.
We all know the unban essay forum is nothing more than a venue to publically humiliate someone. You’d be perfectly happy eating a lie from me that you know is a lie just so you could feel a little bit bigger about yourselves; various individuals in the community included.
You aren’t dealing with a kid here. I have your job in the real world. I’m highly trained for it. I have years of experience in it. Frankly, I could do your job better than you. Put me to the test if you don’t believe me.
I’m not going to write some bullshit essay degrading myself, my family, where I come from, my values, etc.. like I’ve seen others do just so you can feel a little bit bigger and just so the community can feel like they are getting their satisfaction. If you have a hole in your self esteem, I suggest you go exercise and lift weights. If you have a grudge and want to have it out with me, I suggest you save it for playing against me in the game. Don’t abuse your position. Don’t abuse the system. If you want to solve this issue, I’d be more than happy to work with you, but I’m not going to shit on myself to make you feel better about whom you are.
Respect has to be earned, and you certainly aren’t earning it with anybody who can think for themselves and can see what you mods are doing; which dozens of people here can already.
If you want use the poll method of deciding what essay is good or not, we should use that method for deciding who stays as admin. Only we set the standard a little higher considering that with their power, they should be held to a higher standard. Then we make the poll system completely open to everyone so we can all see who votes. Then we filter the voting system so that no admin can vote for another admin and that no clan member can vote for another clan member or for someone in an allied clan. We remove the penchant for corruption that is already there.
If we played by those rules, how many of you admins would be thrown out on your ass? Definitely a vast number of you.
So if you want to live by the sword of lynchmob polling, you better be prepared and willing to die by it. However, I think that is the last thing the current admins genuinely want. You do not want to be held accountable, but you want to be freely entitled to hold everyone else accountable by subjective criteria you write yourselves. That’s called hypocrisy and corruption. I used to live in Illinois, and we know all about that game.
Finally, the cherry on top of this post.
I present everyone in the community and in this topic with yet another example of the exercise in routine double standards; only this time it was performed even with a clear black and white rule that allowed for no subjectivity.
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Some petty, small-minded admin rewarded me last week with a 50% warning because I broke the double-posting rules in my own unban thread.
Notice the cutesy little immature message left to me that embodies the “well… so there!” attitude that runs amok when you let non-trained children enter a position of power usually because their other friends invite them aboard. Now notice that the first two replies in this topic, we’re currently in, broke literally the same rule and has no warning level. There were multiple people in this thread who broke that same black and white rule, yet I was the only one punished by it.
So I just want to thank that particular admin, who probably doesn’t have the balls to step forward and defend himself, for proving me exactly right yet again.
I literally could not have asked for a better example handed to me.
Thank you.
My final question in this reply to admins is this:
If you can’t even avoid blatant double standards and abuse, with clearly-written black and white rules such as brought up above, why should the community allow you vaguer, more subjective rules to employ your abuse with? Why should we give you the leverage and insurance to be as corrupt as you want to be when clearly you haven’t even gotten a handle on the most simplistic of rules that you created?
If there’s a problem with CRPG, it doesn’t lie within the community. I think I just proved that pretty clearly.
“Spook, out.”
*Throws the mic into the air and turns his back as it explodes behind him ; showering the night air with the sparkling image of an American Bald-Eagle giving the middle finger to Vladimir Putin*
In response to Canary's reply which is available here in its entirety.
http://forum.meleegaming.com/unban-essays/the-greatest-unban-essay-ever-written-%28expression-freedom-maturity-honesty%29/msg604090/#msg604090
1-A. I asked you to look at the logs (even gave you a specific time frame on when it happened) in the ban request thread involving a guy who was flagrantly TK'ing me, not to scour nearly a weeks worth of logs, completely unrelated to the actual case, for every shred of evidence you could possibly use against me. You know that. So don't try to act otherwise. I’m not impressed.
1-B. Yet you still chose to do so; through the better part of a week's worth of logs, days apart from the actual incident.
That's not a fluke. That is not a coincidence. Somebody apparently wanted to go through those logs pretty badly. You can't really say you don't want to do something when you do it anyway, in your spare time (as you put it), without any reasonable explanation.
Saying "we looked through the better part of a week's logs because you asked us to check up on this particular incident doesn't hold up to objective scrutiny. Saying one thing and doing another doesn't exactly give you a whole lot of credibility on this issue.
2. Implying that the community would be allowed to harass me to their hearts content while leaving me unable to respond in kind is a blatant double standard. The kinds of which I have been pointing out in the admins own behavior for a while now.
3. This is a strawman argument. You are directly accusing me of "willfully" and intentionally trying to alienate entire servers. This is entirely false.
Furthermore, the server has gray areas because you haven't boiled things down to the point where they would eliminate behaviors of obvious double-standards. This mod has been around 3+ years. It isn't really an "ongoing process" if no work is actually being done on it. Sadly, it takes a situation like this to make you realize/admit these gray areas lead to nothing but double-standards in rulings and abuse at the discretion of the personal feelings of the moderator staff. That is the nature of corruption at the very core of its concept.
I'm glad you're at least semi-acknowledging this in your post.
We’ve gone from:
http://forum.meleegaming.com/na-%28official%29/unban-spookpalace-38515/msg595222/#msg595222
"The server guidelines for behavior contain several grey areas that require human judgment and common sense. We won't be making them black and white and robo-responses simply because Spook has made a spectacle of himself."
To:
Canary: “The rules have gray areas because we're still discovering and establishing the boundaries for them, it is an ongoing process. You, actually, are helping.”
Not sure if you actually legitimately mean what you’re saying here. Not sure if you're actually going to do anything about it or just leave things as they are to make things more convenient for yourselves. But it is an improvement over what another admin previously said (to give credit where it is possibly due).
However, two months from now, if we see nothing has been done to narrow down the rules despite this whole “spectacle,” we will ABSOLUTELY know if you are flat-out lying to everyone right now or not.
4. Here’s the part of Canary’s post that gets really interesting.
Canary, here, literally uses the arguments of people who have been put up on the ban request forum, by me personally, for intentionally TW/TK’ing me after throwing a tantrum. These same people were guilty of the same infraction of rules (trash talking) that they accused me of and that you’re basing the meat of your argument off of. The difference is that I didn’t throw a tantrum and TK/TW anybody.
Canary, if you’re going to use the excuses (not even actual arguments) of guilty hypocrites, who are about to be hanged in their own ban threads for intentional tk’ing, I’d say your position and argument is in some serious fucking trouble.
Also, it is kind of convenient that you willfully chose not to actually link where the arguments were coming from, like you did initially, so people couldn’t put two and two together.
5. You can believe in expression of freedom and still care about someone’s feeling. Believing in the freedom to express yourself doesn’t mean you are an outright sociopath if that is what you’re attempting to imply.
6. This section is great because it is one fallacy followed by another (the second in the form of another strawman argument). First off, trash talk doesn’t give you the right to TK somebody. Repeated trash talk doesn’t give you the right to TK somebody. Do I ever TK anyone intentionally for trash talking me? No. Do I ever TK anyone intentionally for repeatedly trash talking me? No; hence, the painfully obvious logical fallacy here.
As for the strawman argument?
“You are a negative impact on this community and you've made it clear that you intend to continue to be so.”
I am also a positive impact on this community. However, I’m pretty sure I made it abundantly clear that I want the rules to be reformed to eliminate subjective rulebook abuse by the admins and to keep them from being protected by their obvious mistakes and practices of double standards. I’m pretty sure I’ve mentioned that I would be happy to turn in any trash talkers if you made it completely illegal. I am eager to form a solution. That doesn’t translate to what you’re trying to insinuate. The impression that I’m getting is that you don’t want to tackle this subject. If that is the case, why are you an admin? Do you not want to make the rules fairer for EVERYONE? Do you not want to eliminate possible abuse by your fellow admins and yourself? Do you not want to eliminate the corruption that goes on?
What is really curious in this segment is that you said I “push the limits” and not “break the limits.” That appears to me to be a Freudian slip. Seems to me it runs contrary to everything you’re trying to specifically state and prove; not exactly a great way to build an argument.
http://www.fallacyfiles.org/strawman.html
7. This last final list is so laughably desperate I can’t even believe you’re trying it. However, if you want me to specifically address each one of these bullet points, it’s just going to continue to prove how laughably absurd your entire argument has become when actually challenged.
Hell, let’s give an example on the first one just for fun:
- “Fighting or challenging someone to fight in a public place”
The ENTIRE point of CRPG is to fight (either to kill or to claim an objective). Did you honestly even think before putting this list together? Honestly? You are definitely not helping your case with this type of nonsense.
Canary, I’m not intentionally trying to embarrass you here, but if this is the best you’re going to scrape together against me, you really have nobody to blame but yourself.
I can tell your heart isn’t in this argument. Frankly, I think everybody knows I’ve basically wrapped up the win for philosophical debate here (especially if this is the best initial response you can bring against me). It just really depends on if the admins will listen to reason or just abuse their positions of power to get their way and re-secure their own pride. They’d be proving my entire point by doing so.
We all know the unban essay forum is nothing more than a venue to publically humiliate someone. You’d be perfectly happy eating a lie from me that you know is a lie just so you could feel a little bit bigger about yourselves; various individuals in the community included.
You aren’t dealing with a kid here. I have your job in the real world. I’m highly trained for it. I have years of experience in it. Frankly, I could do your job better than you. Put me to the test if you don’t believe me.
I’m not going to write some bullshit essay degrading myself, my family, where I come from, my values, etc.. like I’ve seen others do just so you can feel a little bit bigger and just so the community can feel like they are getting their satisfaction. If you have a hole in your self esteem, I suggest you go exercise and lift weights. If you have a grudge and want to have it out with me, I suggest you save it for playing against me in the game. Don’t abuse your position. Don’t abuse the system. If you want to solve this issue, I’d be more than happy to work with you, but I’m not going to shit on myself to make you feel better about whom you are.
Respect has to be earned, and you certainly aren’t earning it with anybody who can think for themselves and can see what you mods are doing; which dozens of people here can already.
If you want use the poll method of deciding what essay is good or not, we should use that method for deciding who stays as admin. Only we set the standard a little higher considering that with their power, they should be held to a higher standard. Then we make the poll system completely open to everyone so we can all see who votes. Then we filter the voting system so that no admin can vote for another admin and that no clan member can vote for another clan member or for someone in an allied clan. We remove the penchant for corruption that is already there.
If we played by those rules, how many of you admins would be thrown out on your ass? Definitely a vast number of you.
So if you want to live by the sword of lynchmob polling, you better be prepared and willing to die by it. However, I think that is the last thing the current admins genuinely want. You do not want to be held accountable, but you want to be freely entitled to hold everyone else accountable by subjective criteria you write yourselves. That’s called hypocrisy and corruption. I used to live in Illinois, and we know all about that game.
Finally, the cherry on top of this post.
I present everyone in the community and in this topic with yet another example of the exercise in routine double standards; only this time it was performed even with a clear black and white rule that allowed for no subjectivity.
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
Some petty, small-minded admin rewarded me last week with a 50% warning because I broke the double-posting rules in my own unban thread.
Notice the cutesy little immature message left to me that embodies the “well… so there!” attitude that runs amok when you let non-trained children enter a position of power usually because their other friends invite them aboard. Now notice that the first two replies in this topic, we’re currently in, broke literally the same rule and has no warning level. There were multiple people in this thread who broke that same black and white rule, yet I was the only one punished by it.
So I just want to thank that particular admin, who probably doesn’t have the balls to step forward and defend himself, for proving me exactly right yet again.
I literally could not have asked for a better example handed to me.
Thank you.
My final question in this reply to admins is this:
If you can’t even avoid blatant double standards and abuse, with clearly-written black and white rules such as brought up above, why should the community allow you vaguer, more subjective rules to employ your abuse with? Why should we give you the leverage and insurance to be as corrupt as you want to be when clearly you haven’t even gotten a handle on the most simplistic of rules that you created?
If there’s a problem with CRPG, it doesn’t lie within the community. I think I just proved that pretty clearly.
“Spook, out.”
*Throws the mic into the air and turns his back as it explodes behind him ; showering the night air with the sparkling image of an American Bald-Eagle giving the middle finger to Vladimir Putin*