cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Corsair831 on February 10, 2018, 10:08:06 pm
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So Professor was talking recently about a new XP system, i don't know what's already been discussed, or what's even possible, but i did have an idea for what could be kinda cool
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On EU_3 we have a formula which gives people rank based on the rank of the player they kill.
The idea for the new XP system is that every player gets a 'rating'.
This rating would be based on a mixture of factors,
- Your win:loss ratio in games
- The rank of players you kill/die to (you gain more XP for killing a higher ranked player, you lose more for dieing to a low ranked player; the same system currently in place on the duel server)
- [Side thought, we already have a 'Score' system in-game, it may be possible to use the average of that which a player finishes with at the end of a round over time as a player's rating]
You gain XP based on,
- How much damage you do to a player, (with you getting more XP the higher the player's rating). This is to prevent people trying to last hit and get all of the XP for a kill
- If you kill a player (as in score the last hit), you get more XP based on their rating
- If you win a round you gain an amount of XP
- This would obviously favour higher level players, so lower level players get more XP (e.g. if a level 20 player kills e.g. Baozi they get 1000 XP, however if a level 34 player kills Baozi they get 300 XP etc.)
- So that's effectively a higher multiplier the lower your level; you get more XP for winning a round for example if you're a lower level player
I think that this XP system would reward people for how much they contribute to their team winning. I don't know if it's even possible to programme, because i'm a code noob, however it might be cool. Just a thought, let me know what you think
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that doesnt really work out well for people low level though. how is a level 10-15 supposed to do enough damage to get any exp :D the xp per round would have to be massive to make it even worth playing
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I like the idea but it needs to be worked on. KD and WL ratios should not be considered because it will be abused (or it should be cleared before changes). I have 1.7 KD ratio because I've done a lot of bullshit with no gear or just dying randomly after my last retire (I only have like 260 kills according to website) and you know that it's far from my usual KD when I tryhard. So people will get a reward for me like for one of those guys who charges in the very beginning of round and kill 1-2 unaware peasants and dies which is also unfair.
I think that not to make it extremely difficult to implement we should use current point system instead as a measure.
XP: damage done x (level + current points + average points per round) (if lost x 0.5, if won but died x 0.75, if survived x 1) x gen bonus.
Let's take average situation:
You kill a guy with 60 hp (21 str, 2 IF) of lvl32 who has 15 points per round average and already made 10 points:
60 x (32 + 10 + 15) = 3420 xp
You deal full damage to a strength whore of 85 hp (30 str, 10 IF) of lvl35 who has 120 points in the last round and average of 30 points per round (I highly doubt anyone will ever have even 20 average points per round):
85 x (35 + 120 + 30) = 15725 xp (which is 1 tick of x5, sounds fair since you deal full damage to someone who is the most important enemy)
that doesnt really work out well for people low level though. how is a level 10-15 supposed to do enough damage to get any exp :D the xp per round would have to be massive to make it even worth playing
Add separate bonus for points: 1k xp (x gen bonus) for each point earned during round so even peasants can get some points by staying close to actual fights.
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Rather than make it HP based make it a percentage of their HP. 1% of HP = 1 point.
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All these major suggestion threads you would think there's a paid team working on this game.
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I like the idea of effort based rewards, like a score based exp gain. It would probably make the game fall back into a similar style to the 2010 system i suppose, but i think it encourages a lot of good play. Maybe make wins/losses give out score to the teams, and reward flag captures with score. Make incentives for objectives.
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rip playing for fun, now you actually have to be a try hard. gg.
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Don't like the idea of xp/gold based only on your rank, besides people that are bad in this game (like me and Corsair) will get fucked in terms of experience gained.
Question is if we want to have main pool based on time tickets (which is not the best idea) or fixed amount per round (like we have on DTV). Of course bonus from actuall performance is great, but only as a small bonus and rather low compered to gain based on team vicotry/lose condition multiplied at the round end either by 1 or 2.
Actuall numbers are to be considered, there was "xp barn" system in the past and that is a good start, as it promotes sticking with your team. Professor has few years of data to query so I guess he can find a fair solution.
We need to be patient, as it is not going to happen any time soon I guess.
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I like the idea but it needs to be worked on. KD and WL ratios should not be considered because it will be abused (or it should be cleared before changes). I have 1.7 KD ratio because I've done a lot of bullshit with no gear or just dying randomly after my last retire (I only have like 260 kills according to website) and you know that it's far from my usual KD when I tryhard. So people will get a reward for me like for one of those guys who charges in the very beginning of round and kill 1-2 unaware peasants and dies which is also unfair. - that's the point though, you only get a very small amount of XP for charging spawn and killing peasants, you get much more for killing better players
I think that not to make it extremely difficult to implement we should use current point system instead as a measure.
XP: damage done x (level + current points + average points per round) (if lost x 0.5, if won but died x 0.75, if survived x 1) x gen bonus.
Let's take average situation:
You kill a guy with 60 hp (21 str, 2 IF) of lvl32 who has 15 points per round average and already made 10 points:
60 x (32 + 10 + 15) = 3420 xp
You deal full damage to a strength whore of 85 hp (30 str, 10 IF) of lvl35 who has 120 points in the last round and average of 30 points per round (I highly doubt anyone will ever have even 20 average points per round):
85 x (35 + 120 + 30) = 15725 xp (which is 1 tick of x5, sounds fair since you deal full damage to someone who is the most important enemy)
Add separate bonus for points: 1k xp (x gen bonus) for each point earned during round so even peasants can get some points by staying close to actual fights.- yes, interesting, but what i was suggesting was that you automatically get XP if your team wins or loses, but the lower your level the greater the multiplier (we already have a multiplier for x2 for under level 26 i believe, so having say a 4x multiplier for anyone under level 15, 3x under level 25, 2x under level 30 and x1 under level 32, etc. might be interesting
rip playing for fun, now you actually have to be a try hard. gg.- isn't it more fun when people actually try to win though :P
All these major suggestion threads you would think there's a paid team working on this game. - hey man, i love the work the team's doing, they're doing great, they were just thinking about a new XP system they might like and i'm just giving them a possible suggestion :)
Rather than make it HP based make it a percentage of their HP. 1% of HP = 1 point. - yes that's a better system, otherwise you'd get more points for killing tincans
Don't like the idea of xp/gold based only on your rank, besides people that are bad in this game (like me and Corsair) will get fucked in terms of experience gained. - aah but what you could do then is give players of a lower rating an XP multiplier so that they weren't getting completely screwed over in XP, but still not getting as much as the players doing very very well :)
Question is if we want to have main pool based on time tickets (which is not the best idea) or fixed amount per round (like we have on DTV). Of course bonus from actuall performance is great, but only as a small bonus and rather low compered to gain based on team vicotry/lose condition multiplied at the round end either by 1 or 2.
Actuall numbers are to be considered, there was "xp barn" system in the past and that is a good start, as it promotes sticking with your team. Professor has few years of data to query so I guess he can find a fair solution.
We need to be patient, as it is not going to happen any time soon I guess.
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Just leave it as it is imo :mrgreen:. People like it. No need to complicate things even more.
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Sry Corsair wasn't trying to be a jerk its just that your suggestion sounds like it would be a lot of work but maybe its not as I have no idea how to code and stuff.
I think they should disable the gen system and give everybody the gen 16 xp bonus and give small xp bonus for fighting in a group, kind of like how it used to be where people got xp for kills and if you were near them you got a little xp too.
Or just disable the multiplier system like it is in strat, and give good xp like it is in strat.
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Sry Corsair wasn't trying to be a jerk its just that your suggestion sounds like it would be a lot of work but maybe its not as I have no idea how to code and stuff.
I think they should disable the gen system and give everybody the gen 16 xp bonus and give small xp bonus for fighting in a group, kind of like how it used to be where people got xp for kills and if you were near them you got a little xp too.
Or just disable the multiplier system like it is in strat, and give good xp like it is in strat.
Lol no probs, it's just i saw Professor or one of the others saying they were thinking about how to change it (i have literally no idea whether a system like this would be easy to implement or really hard hahaha i'm a noob), and i thought this might be a cool suggestion if they still wanted ideas :)
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that doesnt really work out well for people low level though. how is a level 10-15 supposed to do enough damage to get any exp :D the xp per round would have to be massive to make it even worth playing
Leeching double XP on EU4?
Edit: In the past I've suggested ELO rankings to determine both XP gain and levels/skills but Meow said it was utterly stupid idea and he would never play such a game. He was probably right. But such system would glue players to the screen because you'd need to be present and performing in order to keep your rank, levels, skill points etc. Basically it would favor skilled players over less skilled. No amount of time investment would ever get you an advantage over more skilled fighter.
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Leeching double XP on EU4?
Edit: In the past I've suggested ELO rankings to determine both XP gain and levels/skills but Meow said it was utterly stupid idea and he would never play such a game. He was probably right. But such system would glue players to the screen because you'd need to be present and performing in order to keep your rank, levels, skill points etc. Basically it would favor skilled players over less skilled. No amount of time investment would ever get you an advantage over more skilled fighter.
Well, current XP/gold system was implemented in order to fix the other problem: better performance than others => more xp than others you get => faster get better stats than other players => again even better performance => again even more xp. When they implemented current system - they hit the other edge of the problem: no matter how you perform you fully depend on the team, valor thing can give you a chance at least but still not enough. There is no feeling of being rewarded for playing well now.
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IMO current XP system does not need any changes.
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Not sure why the XP system would need changing. Also any XP gain related to damage and kills just doesn't play out well and only encourages individual performance rather than solely team based, which is why we ended up with the current XP system to begin with.
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Not sure why the XP system would need changing. Also any XP gain related to damage and kills just doesn't play out well and only encourages individual performance rather than solely team based, which is why we ended up with the current XP system to begin with.
If we use current point system as a base - it's not entirely related to damage. You gain points by being close to enemies that get damaged => team fights bring more points.
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If we use current point system as a base - it's not entirely related to damage. You gain points by being close to enemies that get damaged => team fights bring more points.
We already did that years ago, it basically just encouraged two huge blobs and less flanking and tactics in general. Every single round just two blobs, because everyone feels they need to get max XP lol.
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enough to break the game, until your changes everything was fine