cRPG
cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Game Balance Discussion => Topic started by: Keshian on May 31, 2011, 06:53:06 pm
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Currently 90% of horses used are the arabian warhorse and the courser, mainly because all the stats favor these 2 horses. A good way to bring diversity back to cavalry is to realize that the 2 fastest/most maneuverable horses also shouldn't have the highest hitpoints and armor of the unarmored horses (except destrier which is slow). Thereby I propose that new stats should make the tradeoff for higher speed is that courser has hitpoints and armor of a palfrey, while palfrey would have the hitpoints of the current courser so there is a real tradeoff of do you want the fastest or the second fastest with more hitpoints and armor going with the second fastest.
Same thing would be done with the desert horse and arabian warhorse, the two armor/hitpoints stats would be switched so that the most maneuverable horse would have slightly less hitpoints and armor than the second-most maneuverable horse.
This would bring back diversity in cavalry and bring real tradeoffs instead of everyone just riding champion coursers and arabian warhorses that can take 3-4 hits before dying (not including large speed bonus from being badly ridden). it would be nice to see palfries and rouncies and desert horses on the battlefield again.
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Aye but dont forget steppe horse...
But dont forgot that in order to make people ride other horses your would have to reduce they speed and manoeuvre since these 2 are insanely high and the main reason people ride em and a little hp nerf wont change that :lol:
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Aye but dont forget steppe horse...
But dont forgot that in order to make people ride other horses your would have to reduce they speed and manoeuvre since these 2 are insanely high and the main reason people ride em and a little hp nerf wont change that :lol:
You are right, steppe horse should get a hp/armor boost to slightly higher than desert (since +1 maneuver, but -3 speed).
I agree but some people would switch because the 1-2 less maneuver and 2-3 less speed would be worth their horses being able to survive an extra 1-2 hits, which would be a great balancing factor without being a real nerf to horses since you are just switching which horses get the benefit. So both sides win, more diversity in horses in the game.
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Push polling is the best polling. Why give the reader the option to accidentally give the wrong answer, after all? :?
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I'd only agree to this is all other arabian and courser stats stayed the same.
Also I think the courser losing 15 HP and 6 armour under your system is a bit much. Maybe 10 HP and 3 armour. But certainly not the full amount. People rarely ride coursers at full speed and they have very slow acceleration compared to all other horses. So I think the speed bonus isn't as big a deal as people think. The speed is only useful on very open maps.
However, I'd agree with the arabian changes.
I think over all they are sensible suggestions. But a straight out trade off between the two types of horses might not be the best solution. It might require a little more fine tuning.
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Nerf Arabian trash horse
In other news they won't nerf horses and lancing
lol pick your poison
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I use destrier. Its survivability more than makes up for its lower speed and manouver. Even with a normal lance i find myseld doing fin againt cav and pole users.
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I agree Kesh.
It's in line with my long standing crusade for making all items a headache to choose from, with huge variety, but with no clear BEST choice for all situations. (Like the Cookie/Tears swords pre-patch)
Choosing an item should be a dilemma of drawbacks and advantages in stats and abilities. (Not so much price, which fucks up such an ideal balance a bit)
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I agree Kesh.
It's in line with my long standing crusade for making all items a headache to choose from, with huge variety, but with no clear BEST choice for all situations. (Like the Cookie/Tears swords pre-patch)
Choosing an item should be a dilemma of drawbacks and advantages in stats and abilities. (Not so much price, which fucks up such an ideal balance a bit)
Vouching for this logic. Price really gets in the way as a balance factor.
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I would be saddened to see the courser loose HP. Largely because, as things stand, it goes down in about four or five arrow hits. In "the real world" (whatever that is), that might be OK, but in cRPG it isn't--not with the number of archers and their high rate of accurate fire.
Then again, if the cheap horses just got an HP buff, but retained their speed/maneuver, they'd be a bit OP. Still like ninjas, but now with MORE HP!
I counter-propose the entire idea of cavalry in cRPG be reworked! HP/Armor buffs for everybody, but speed nerfs everywhere. Less ninja shit, but more trampling of bitches and stand-up, horse vs man fights. I tire of hiding behind the reach of my heavy lance, and the speed and stealth of my courser.
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seriously, your horse whine threads are just beginning to be annoying... stop using realism as an argument, this is a game where balance is essential, and if you take a look at the poll chadz made - only 3% of the cRPG community think horses should be nerfed! (7% would BUFF horses)
So take a chill, stop whining about the 'super' horses, try to look at stuff from a bigger perspective and realize, that cRPG is actually balanced as it is...
Screwing 1 thing up screws everything up!
ps. this is not just an answer to this thread, it is after reading all your threads during the last 2 days - it seems like you're just determined to get horses nerfed in every possible way.
I know i am riding champ arabian wahorse myself, and might make you say that i'm just promoting my own class, but i do, like many others right now, actually think is overall is balanced, and as i said; screwing one thing will screw the whole balance. Don't touch anything.
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seriously, your horse whine threads are just beginning to be annoying... stop using realism as an argument, this is a game where balance is essential, and if you take a look at the poll chadz made - only 3% of the cRPG community think horses should be nerfed! (7% would BUFF horses)
So take a chill, stop whining about the 'super' horses, try to look at stuff from a bigger perspective and realize, that cRPG is actually balanced as it is...
Screwing 1 thing up screws everything up!
ps. this is not just an answer to this thread, it is after reading all your threads during the last 2 days - it seems like you're just determined to get horses nerfed in every possible way.
I know i am riding champ arabian wahorse myself, and might make you say that i'm just promoting my own class, but i do, like many others right now, actually think is overall is balanced, and as i said; screwing one thing will screw the whole balance. Don't touch anything.
No offense but this wasn't a horse nerf thread, it was a rebalancing among the horses so that lower tier horses get the health/armor stats switched with higher tier horses, which keep their higher maneuverability and speed so that people will actually use more than just 2 horses (90% of cav right now) but all the horses. NO NERF INTENDED! Post this on other thread.
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Torp.
People are complaining because your horse is OP as in close to impossible to defeat without a 245/300 lenght pike
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No offense but this wasn't a horse nerf thread, it was a rebalancing among the horses so that lower tier horses get the health/armor stats switched with higher tier horses, which keep their higher maneuverability and speed so that people will actually use more than just 2 horses (90% of cav right now) but all the horses. NO NERF INTENDED! Post this on other thread.
but the way you want to do this is by nerfing the 2 top horses, not buffing the other horses - and that works as a nerf for, as you said, 90% of cRPG cav.
buffing the other horses, and maybe combine it with a very small nerf of the two top horses could be asolution to add more variety though.
Torp.
People are complaining because your horse is OP as in close to impossible to defeat without a 245/300 lenght pike
that is in no way true, when i get dismounted i often kill these with my damned one-hander.
and again; take a look at chadz poll and see what people really think
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but the way you want to do this is by nerfing the 2 top horses, not buffing the other horses - and that works as a nerf for, as you said, 90% of cRPG cav.
buffing the other horses, and maybe combine it with a very small nerf of the two top horses could be asolution to add more variety though.
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I think you missed the whole thread. Basically all the other unarmored horses stats get boosted, you switch palfrey's health and armor with courser, so palfrey is slower still but has a little better survivability to balance. Same thing with Arabian and desert. And steppe/sumpter/etc. unarmored horses get slight hp/armor boost accordingly so the slower/less maneuverable the horse the better the hp/armor among the uanrmored horses, rather than fastest horse also has highest hp/armor after destrier. The armored horses already are balanced like this for the most where plated charger is slowest but also highest hp/armor and warhorses are faster but lower hp/armor. Its a tweaking, but the overall stats are if anything raised on horses but they are redistributed so there are no longer 2 obvious choices for horse selection that every cav guy uses.
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but you if your suggestion goes through, the best horse will not be as good as the best horse is now, which result in a general cav nerf, since people wont be able to use as good a horse as they do now.
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but you if your suggestion goes through, the best horse will not be as good as the best horse is now, which result in a general cav nerf, since people wont be able to use as good a horse as they do now.
So your actually saying that the arabian courser is the best horse, even though it's less expensive than the Destrier and all armored horse. And you find it normal ?
Anyway, i also think Horses should get looked at. I wouldn't mind at all if 2 or 3 horses with different stats, but somewhat balanced, would have the same price. All for the sake of variety and balance. (even if people with x3 horses would probably still play their heirloomed horse instead of others)
Take away the extra health from courser and Arabian, and give it to the Palfrey, is a good idea. You want speed and maneuver, okay, but don't also have more health.
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So your actually saying that the arabian courser is the best horse, even though it's less expensive than the Destrier and all armored horse. And you find it normal ?
Anyway, i also think Horses should get looked at. I wouldn't mind at all if 2 or 3 horses with different stats, but somewhat balanced, would have the same price. All for the sake of variety and balance. (even if people with x3 horses would probably still play their heirloomed horse instead of others)
Take away the extra health from courser and Arabian, and give it to the Palfrey, is a good idea. You want speed and maneuver, okay, but don't also have more health.
i am simply saying that most people use arabian warhorse and courser, and that they therefore are considered the best horses compared to the price.
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I read another suggestion that I think is the better. Lowering Speed/Maneuvers of horses due to its % of HP left.
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The Arab warhorse and courser is simply just OP as hell and thus its the only ones you see it would be stupid not to ride one yourself..
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The Arab warhorse and courser is simply just OP as hell and thus its the only ones you see it would be stupid not to ride one yourself..
i actually see more rounceys out there since people cant afford the upkeep