cRPG

cRPG => Announcements => Topic started by: RD_Professor on January 04, 2018, 11:36:09 am

Title: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: RD_Professor on January 04, 2018, 11:36:09 am
It's been three months since I became a dev, and miraculously, the mod has not burnt down and exploded in a huge mess. Instead, it's defied my expectations and has been growing in players, despite there being many no bugs in my code or patches. My Christmas break is almost over, but that doesn't mean I'll stop working on cRPG things, in fact, once I get back to my institution of learning I'll probably start spending a whole lot more time on this.

My usual 'discussion of things' here if you want to read it.
(click to show/hide)

Now for the good stuff. Patchnotes. Real ones this time, too!
Patchnotes
0.5.2.0:
-Professor/Rider: Fix to ladder bug
-Rico: New items/pictures of items in shop
-Professor/Desire: Balance to ranged
-Professor/Desire: Tweaks to armor soak
-Professor: Fix to strat loot bug (50/50 chance this fixes it)
-Professor: Tweaks to DTV gold gain

Things to fix
-Happy hour (It'll get fixed eventually, I swear)
-Small siege towers
-Fix launcher for those having issues with it

I'm sure a fair amount of you are curious about what happened with this ranged balance patch. The short answer is changes to slots. For example, to prevent crossbowers from using both an arbalast and a weapon that can be highly effective in melee (such as military hammer), the arbalast was increased to 4 slots, restricting crossbowers to a smaller selection of sidearms, reducing their effectiveness in melee. For bows, the higher-end bows were increased to 3 slots, but, all arrows were reduced to 0 slots. By doing so, we hope to see a shakeup in the current meta of STR-archery, as now, one can take a relatively powerful bow like the composite bow, and also use some 2h weapon.
There were more changes done to each of the crossbows, in order to better balance the class, but you can read the item changes to see them.

That's right, Item Changes. I'm actually going to get around to posting them this time. But before that, please note that, like armor soak values, this balancing effort is a work in progress! I certainly hope that we nail it on the first try, but it might take a few more than that. Do remember that the ultimate goal here is not to nerf a class into Oblivion (or Skyrim), it is to provide better balance between classes.

And here you go, Item Changes!
(click to show/hide)

get it new balance like the shoes. man I'm funny
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Gnjus on January 04, 2018, 11:53:51 am
Veselov will be pleased to hear this. Well done, Prof.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: suyu on January 04, 2018, 12:37:25 pm
THANKS
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Ikarus on January 04, 2018, 12:58:35 pm
4 slots for heavy and arba, ouch fuck

but well, if it's for the greater good, alright then

at least there's a small selection of 0 slot 1h weapons now

Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Mirdan on January 04, 2018, 01:08:24 pm
Quote from: RD_Professor on January 04, 2018, 11:36:09 am

Now for the good stuff. Patchnotes. Real ones this time, too!

-Professor: Tweaks to DTV gold gain


Shat myself with glee. Was playing yesterday evening, and gaining 1k gold only to repair for 1.5k or more every time when pushing into later stages was making me cry. Thanks RD! Happy new year all.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Pandemona on January 04, 2018, 01:20:59 pm
Someone just suggested this in the server and i support as i support anything with the word respec in it, that we should get a general free respec with drastic changes like these either when the balancing process is entirely done or now. (or why not both times)  :D
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Chris_the_Animal on January 04, 2018, 01:32:45 pm
I love all your efforts on reviving this mod, Prof. I really do.
But I really dont like the 4 slots on xbows.
I mean can you remember players like Dave_UKR?
Total Badass, this dude. Headshots the crap out of people with an arbalest and then goes 1v5 Mace Massacre.

Sadly he wont come back due to the 4 slot change on Xbows :/
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Beleg on January 04, 2018, 01:53:31 pm
Quote from: Chris_the_Animal on January 04, 2018, 01:32:45 pm
Sadly he wont come back due to the 4 slot change on Xbows :/
was he gonna come back previously? I haven't seen him for a long time. Like ikarus said, as long as it serves to greater good, I'm okay with any nerf or buff. Will this patch do that? I don't know, time will tell.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Ikarus on January 04, 2018, 01:55:20 pm
Quote
Total Badass, this dude. Headshots the crap out of people with an arbalest and then goes 1v5 Mace Massacre.

sounds like me  :lol: but I guess this is a thing of the past now, you can still fight people but it's going to be quite difficult. Just try to avoid shielders if you go with mace, their shields won't break when you drum on them. And try to avoid tincans when you go axe, cause you'll glance a lot
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: ODSNG_Pander on January 04, 2018, 02:20:07 pm
Every Xbowman right now
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Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Kloney on January 04, 2018, 02:22:04 pm
I'd just like to ask why have a discrepancy between xbow slots and bow slots, all you've done is fix the slots of xbows and break the slots of bows, i'm unsure what the logic of this change was.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Chapman on January 04, 2018, 02:23:43 pm
Trading +3 Arbalest for +3 Heavy Xbow.

End my suffering please

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Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Algarn on January 04, 2018, 02:27:01 pm
So now, I got the ability to use my 3 slots bow, two stacks of bodkin arrows, and a long one handed ? Why.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: bensai on January 04, 2018, 02:51:47 pm
what are the new items that are added? I can't see em

also why nerf accuracy on arbalest? even with 150 wpf and a +3 arb my crosshair bloom felt kind of big for the "cRPG AWP"
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Beleg on January 04, 2018, 03:16:16 pm
Quote from: Algarn on January 04, 2018, 02:27:01 pm
So now, I got the ability to use my 3 slots bow, two stacks of bodkin arrows, and a long one handed ? Why.
So the archers aren't completely helpless when a melee player catches up to them? Maybe they should have a fighting chance? It's not like you're gonna be able to slay experienced melee players left and right just because you have a nice, long weapon; having no weapon points in 1h.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 04:58:11 pm
Quote from: Beleg on January 04, 2018, 03:16:16 pm
So the archers aren't completely helpless when a melee player catches up to them? Maybe they should have a fighting chance? It's not like you're gonna be able to slay experienced melee players left and right just because you have a nice, long weapon; having no weapon points in 1h.

Then why is it fair to remove them from xbow? Shouldn't xbows have a fighting chance too?
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Finse on January 04, 2018, 05:08:13 pm
Xbows do, they do dmg while having power strike, archers can have it to, but wont do any dmg at all
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Beleg on January 04, 2018, 05:16:09 pm
Quote from: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 04:58:11 pm
Then why is it fair to remove them from xbow? Shouldn't xbows have a fighting chance too?
they should, I didn't say otherwise. But are we sure they can't fight at all with this patch?

I'm not an expert at melee so I have to ask. Which one is better: having a mediocre (0 slot) 1h weapon and weapon points, or having a good weapon but no points?
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Butan on January 04, 2018, 05:21:29 pm
Quote from: Chris_the_Animal on January 04, 2018, 01:32:45 pm
I mean can you remember players like Dave_UKR?
Total Badass, this dude.

Baddassest delayer  :P
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: zottlmarsch on January 04, 2018, 05:56:21 pm
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Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: the real god emperor on January 04, 2018, 05:58:20 pm
The problem I have is weapons like Katzbalger or Nieuweidao getting 0 slots. It seemed like it was meant for 2nd best sword in that type, like arabian arming sword, but Katzbalger and Nieuweidao.. are the best weapons of their type.

Also archers now being able to use any 1 slot weapon is going to be painful. Especially with the STR archer meta. Archers didn't need a slot change, imo. They were doing quite good what weapons were available to them, and if they wanted a bigger and better weapon they could always sacrifice some of their ammo.

Other than that arbalest getting 4 slots is a good change. Limiting them to 0 slots weapons. And the balance between arbalest and heavy xbow can easily solved with upcoming changes.

Gud patch imo.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Nightingale on January 04, 2018, 06:01:28 pm
you all might be jumping to conclusions about the inaccuracy of the arbalest. I suggest looking in server at the result of its accuracy nerf and realize it’s still entirely viable as a long range weapon. Just not pin point accurate at max investment anymore. Don’t see any issue with this. As back when I started playing xbow it was less accurate than it currently is at.

The slot changes to bow where originally meant to be like the changes to xbow but professor suggested giving archers better choices in side arms and I agree that it’s an option worth exploring.

A 0 slot weapon now is still better than a 1 slot side arm for xbowmen bc they can invest more freely into melee stats where archers can not.

Because of how the damage to accuracy ratio works with xbows it’s basically sitting where heavy is just barely more accurate. Than arb. Intention is to make people rely on less damage for long shots.

Also pls note that missile speed increase is not a dmg buff.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:23:46 pm
I don't agree on missile speed not affecting damage, speed has always affected damage. (For as far as I know)
Also, with more missile speed (compared to last version), faster reload and more acc than an arb a heavy xbow, with less str req is way better. As it frees up a point for extra WPF, which means I can reload even faster.

Compared to a heavy xbow, an arb is pretty useless now.

And I can run away faster. Which I'll need with these weak melee weapons. Let's be honest, having some Power strike doesn't turn a Flanged mace into something strong.

Though having archers with an awkpile and other strong weapons isn't really balanced either. Maybe fix the req for a bow to be good is the way to prevent all the STR archers.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Paul on January 04, 2018, 06:32:58 pm
Quote from: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:23:46 pm
I don't agree on missile speed not affecting damage, speed has always affected damage.

Explain please.

PS: I just found out that I have a +3 arba on one of my chars. I think it might even be Dave's.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:53:16 pm
Quote from: Paul on January 04, 2018, 06:32:58 pm
Explain please.

PS: I just found out that I have a +3 arba on one of my chars. I think it might even be Dave's.

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Was told speed = damage. Or does that not go for ranged? But then how does damage increase if people run towards me on a horse?

But hey he probs tested it so I might be wrong.

PS: Sell the Arba now before you're stuck with it forever.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sharpe on January 04, 2018, 06:53:28 pm
Quote from: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:23:46 pm


Though having archers with an awkpile and other strong weapons isn't really balanced either. Maybe fix the req for a bow to be good is the way to prevent all the STR archers.

We're not jumping to conclusions, an hour of testing on EU 3 has brought us to this conclusion.

You do realize that archers always had the option to take a bow and an awlpike right? If I wanted to to use a 2 slot two handed sword or a polearm in unison a longbow, rus bow, or yew longbow, all I had to do was use  0 slot regular arrows. Now, if you're going to say but Sharpe, those aren't god tier bodkin arrows. You're right. However, if I wanted to accomplish the same build with the aforementioned two slotted weapons I just needed to use the composite or horn bow (which are underrated bows). So the option was always there, it just makes 0 fucking sense to do it -- that is unless you enjoy glancing on your stabs and swings, or tickling your enemies to death.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:54:50 pm
Quote from: Sharpe on January 04, 2018, 06:53:28 pm
that is unless you enjoy glancing on your stabs and swings, or tickling your enemies to death.

Like xbows have to now
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sharpe on January 04, 2018, 07:00:50 pm
Quote from: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:54:50 pm
Like xbows have to now

So when archers were/are put in that situation it's okay, but as soon as xbows are, it's suddenly a huge issue.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Paul on January 04, 2018, 07:05:25 pm
Quote from: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 06:53:16 pm
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Was told speed = damage. Or does that not go for ranged? But then how does damage increase if people run towards me on a horse?

But hey he probs tested it so I might be wrong.

PS: Sell the Arba now before you're stuck with it forever.

I have made long-ass posts on how it works. Changing shot speed does nothing directly to damage. When looking closer there is a difference though when shooter/targets moves or if there is a height difference. BUT with high shot speed launchers like the arba/h.crossbow this difference is very small.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Westwood on January 04, 2018, 07:06:06 pm
You know what Prof you're a good boy who is doing a lot of fine work on this mod you just say the word and I'll treat you to some burgers at Dick's.
I also like New Balance btw (https://tinyurl.com/yd9j3k25)
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Gurnisson on January 04, 2018, 07:07:02 pm
Quote from: Sharpe on January 04, 2018, 07:00:50 pm
So when archers were/are put in that situation it's okay, but as soon as xbows are, it's suddenly a huge issue.

Because archers can use their ranged weapons while kiting. Xbows are engaged when they've used their one shot.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 07:10:20 pm
Quote from: Sharpe on January 04, 2018, 07:00:50 pm
So when archers were/are put in that situation it's okay, but as soon as xbows are, it's suddenly a huge issue.

Never said it was okay.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sharpe on January 04, 2018, 07:17:39 pm
Quote from: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 07:10:20 pm
Never said it was okay.

Qui tacet consentire videtur

Quote from: Gurnisson on January 04, 2018, 07:07:02 pm
Because archers can use their ranged weapons while kiting. Xbows are engaged when they've used their one shot.

Unless said xbow outruns the pursuing melee, and finds a place to reload the xbow. Or they can pull out the sidearm they have the proficiency for.

But I see your point.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Blackbow on January 04, 2018, 07:32:13 pm
lol less str requirement on xbows !!
good job nightingale for giving more agi to your class
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Quote from: RD_Professor on January 04, 2018, 11:36:09 am
For bows, the higher-end bows were increased to 3 slots, but, all arrows were reduced to 0 slots. By doing so, we hope to see a shakeup in the current meta of STR-archery, as now, one can take a relatively powerful bow like the composite bow, and also use some 2h weapon.
i'm maybe missing something but those change on bows will change nothing
the str meta will stay like this and none will use 2h because to deal enough damage(with bow) we need to invest for a minimum of 24 str and spend most wpf in archery... at the end archers dont have enough wpf for 2h wich make melee very slow, i guess people will keep going for faster 1h ... just my opinion will see if meta change but i have big doubt

to me the only way to change str archery meta is too revert what have been done by previous devs... during old times
agi/wpf was needed for accuracy, now it's power draw who rly make you accurate...
and 6pd was enough to deal decent damage... nobody at this time had in mind to put more powerdraw because they had to put a lot in wpf

thx for all the work
in my country we have one month to say it so
happy new year to all !
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Úlfur on January 04, 2018, 07:46:24 pm
Increasing requirement would help actually, but hey, memes I guess.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Nightingale on January 04, 2018, 07:51:58 pm
again. increasing strength requirement would only force crossbowmen to take builds with 7 or 8 power strike with 7 or 8 iron flesh and be an actual melee build with a very minimal loss in accuracy. That is definitely not nerfing their melee component of the class but rather buffing it to retarded levels.

I did not decrease the two higher tier xbows that people will utilize from afar.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Blackbow on January 04, 2018, 08:06:44 pm
Quote from: Nightingale on January 04, 2018, 07:51:58 pm
again. increasing strength requirement would only force crossbowmen to take builds with 7 or 8 power strike with 7 or 8 iron flesh and be an actual melee build with a very minimal loss in accuracy. That is definitely not nerfing their melee component of the class but rather buffing it to retarded levels.

I did not decrease the two higher tier xbows that people will utilize from afar.

you just made them more accurate and harder to catch (high ath) and still have tons of wpf  to spend in melee (way to much compare to other ranged)
so nothing change they will still be op in melee

but what can i say to someone who have been item balancer during one year and did nothing till someone decide to do your job
and you finaly wake up and cried... you always managed to save your class and keeping it far above other ranged class

btw long time ago if i remember most powerfull xbows was around 21 str and everything was fine...
to me it's clear you just gave to xbowers more wpf and ath and less resistance but like most of xbowers are hiding snipers it should change nothing
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Nightingale on January 04, 2018, 08:34:38 pm
Quote from: Blackbow on January 04, 2018, 08:06:44 pm
you just made them more accurate and harder to catch (high ath) and still have tons of wpf  to spend in melee (way to much compare to other ranged)
so nothing change they will still be op in melee

but what can i say to someone who have been item balancer during one year and did nothing till someone decide to do your job
and you finaly wake up and cried... you always managed to save your class and keeping it far above other ranged class

btw long time ago if i remember most powerfull xbows was around 21 str and everything was fine...
to me it's clear you just gave to xbowers more wpf and ath and less resistance but like most of xbowers are hiding snipers it should change nothing

Again your buddy's/your balance did not work like at all. go look at the changelog and realize how fucked it was.

Also please keep in mind that the item compiler was broken for more than a year and chadz had to actually come back and fix it b4 anyone could make any balance changes. Raylin just jumped the gun and released a patch without discussing it with anyone. Yeah he too saw that his patch failed and had enough merit to revert his changes on his own. Xbow was overly nerfed. Archery was overly buffed. You had the entire active population of the mod requesting revert. I already listed the changes I have done to my own class and none of them are buffs. - but what more can I say to someone so delusional as yourself? -

Not so long ago (like 4 months ago) Arbalest was 22 strength requirement and heavy was sitting at 19 strength with xbow at 16. The reason it is not there now is; because the average level was reduced by 5 levels. @level 37 I was able to have the same build as I do now. So nothing has changed in terms of balance from 22 to 16. Except I lost 3 power strike. In terms of balance, You do not want a class that can deal high damage values (18-50) depending highly on armor to have 7 power strike for close quarter combat.

and again I did not change the difficulty of Heavy or Arbalest. I only swapped the accuracies of Heavy and Arbalest. If that experiment that Professor and I wanted to try does not work as intended then we will revert heavy's stats and move it back to lower accuracy.

I made Arb and heavy xbow 4 slot to reduce the OP-ness as you'd put it in their weapon choices. *which does not currently effective archers or any other class in a negative way. So I'm sorry for nerfing the combat effectiveness of xbow? which is what was asked? lol. *I shall buff it immediately*

- jokes aside you can expect to see changes between arb and heavy's current position and if the whole slot thing for archery doesn't work out a slight change to slots will occur.
- revisit available side arms for arb/heavy

Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sagar on January 04, 2018, 08:41:28 pm
So now is not possible to use 2H weapon with Heavy Crossbow or Arbalest ...
For example I spend 9 loom points on: Lombardic Sword, Fighting Axe and Executioner Sword to be able play 2H xbower.
There need to be some 0 slots swords with secondary 2H mode (Crusader Sword for example) or make Lombardic Sword 0 slot again at last.
It is kind of strange that range now can only use 1H weapons.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Asheram on January 04, 2018, 08:45:47 pm
I don't understand why the hunting and light xbows were nerfed all around, I thought it was the heavier xbows people complained about. I can't find it now as I'm at work but Nightingale even said in one of his posts that they do hardly any damage.
Found it-
Quote from: Nightingale on June 21, 2017, 01:30:45 pm
Hunting xbow-Light xbow don't really adequately fill any niche.
Hunting does barely enough damage to even be considered a weapon at all. Good for almost nothing maybe make the enemy worry about being shot? idk.
Light xbow does a small sum of damage but can reload rapidly allowing the user to make full advantage of low investment/ high mobility. Also, a go-to for ranged cavalry.

P.S. Oh and thanks for work on mod.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Dupre on January 04, 2018, 08:50:10 pm
All I see is a bunch of crying. Typical crpg community response when any kind of balancing is done. Why don't you guys stop paying attention to the forums and test out the new changes for a week. After a week, give the balancers some constructive feedback.

If you were an xbower and would like a respec, let me know. Typically we would roll out a respec with the balance changes but couldn't do it this time. We'll make sure to give out respecs too all builds effected by any future balance changes.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: bensai on January 04, 2018, 08:54:30 pm
woah thats some big lip from a ghost
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sagar on January 04, 2018, 09:03:07 pm
Quote from: Dupre on January 04, 2018, 08:50:10 pm
All I see is a bunch of crying. Typical crpg community response when any kind of balancing is done. Why don't you guys stop paying attention to the forums and test out the new changes for a week. After a week, give the balancers some constructive feedback.

So can we have small patch/fix with one 0 slot 2H (1H with secondary mode, for example Lombardic) so some of us can actually try new patch.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Dupre on January 04, 2018, 09:29:32 pm
Balance team is already working on changes so i'm sure you will see a patch today or tomorrow.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Kloney on January 04, 2018, 09:44:17 pm
Quote from: Kloney on January 04, 2018, 02:22:04 pm
I'd just like to ask why have a discrepancy between xbow slots and bow slots, all you've done is fix the slots of xbows and break the slots of bows, i'm unsure what the logic of this change was.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Bobthehero on January 04, 2018, 09:49:52 pm
I keep on failing to connect to servers, what do?
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Yeldur on January 04, 2018, 09:52:46 pm
Very surprised to see that Archery just got a buff, this will make my experiment all that more interesting. Especially as archers can now use the spamovaklion, making them all that more powerful.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sagar on January 04, 2018, 10:00:59 pm
Quote from: Dupre on January 04, 2018, 09:29:32 pm
Balance team is already working on changes so i'm sure you will see a patch today or tomorrow.

That's great.  :D
I really appreciate the hard work of the developers, recently devoted to this mod.
I just wanted to point out this 2H zero slot possibility.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: njames89 on January 04, 2018, 10:18:38 pm
Keep up the good work lads.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Asheram on January 05, 2018, 12:39:44 am
I updated my other post sry for the double post/quote myself thing.

Oh and thanks for work on mod.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Gristle on January 05, 2018, 01:44:27 am
Quote from: Sagar on January 04, 2018, 08:41:28 pm
So now is not possible to use 2H weapon with Heavy Crossbow or Arbalest ...
It is kind of strange that range now can only use 1H weapons.

It's as if they don't want hybrids to use the best weapons of two different classes.

I do think free exchanges need to be given out when a weapon is suddenly made unusable to you. Otherwise, it just collects dust in your inventory. The marketplace isn't an answer, as nerfed weapons lose most of their value.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Uther Pendragon on January 05, 2018, 02:42:25 am
Quote from: Bobthehero on January 04, 2018, 09:49:52 pm
I keep on failing to connect to servers, what do?

have you tried selling yuor arbalset 3+?
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Renay on January 05, 2018, 03:05:09 am
Terrible change with the arbalest slots used. All you do is force everyone to use the same boring melee weapon or run away till the flags get capped.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Rico on January 05, 2018, 04:06:43 am
are you guys suggesting that Rider complaining 15 times a day about crossbows on the servers, discord and the forum through his 3 accounts does not perfectly reflect the opinion of all of cRPG? :shock:

if you think 4 slots for arbalest and heavy crossbow is too much of a restriction, try stirring 10% of the shit Rider is stirring every day and you'll get heard
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Gandalf77 on January 05, 2018, 11:45:39 am
Quote from: Rico on January 05, 2018, 04:06:43 am
are you guys suggesting that Rider complaining 15 times a day about crossbows on the servers, discord and the forum through his 3 accounts does not perfectly reflect the opinion of all of cRPG? :shock:

if you think 4 slots for arbalest and heavy crossbow is too much of a restriction, try stirring 10% of the shit Rider is stirring every day and you'll get heard

hmmm mainly I talked about dmg that xbows were doing because of retarded speed bonus and values of armor soak factor and that they can deal big dmg in melee with blunt weapon because of tons of wpf and ath. Actually I dont like the idea of 4 slot arbalest and 0 slot shields also 0 slot bodkins but it is the beginning so I understand there are going to be more balance patches for it. I already can see archers with 3 packs of arrows in strategus and longbow, thats gonna be such a joy for them playing in defense :D

Rico you should try to play cav when there were so many xbows on the server, all you could do was to hide somewhere and when you tried to kill someone he could one shoot you with arb :P
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: bensai on January 05, 2018, 04:20:35 pm
Quote from: Renay on January 05, 2018, 03:05:09 am
Terrible change with the arbalest slots used. All you do is force everyone to use the same boring melee weapon or run away till the flags get capped.

not like having a 3 slot arbalest make your choice of weapons much spicier. most xbowmen went for the 1 slot two handers like the mace or executioner sword of lombardic sword 2h-mode
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Sagar on January 05, 2018, 10:38:55 pm
Playing couple hours with +3 Arbalest and +3 Steel Bolts and it is impossible to make a kill, even on light armored opponents 25 to 35 body armor.
Melee players play as if the range does not exist on the server, so I guess it can be said that something wrong with the balance.
I played as 2H xbow armed with cudgel, and I can say it completely useless.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Jona on January 05, 2018, 10:47:04 pm
Quote from: Nightingale on January 04, 2018, 07:51:58 pm
increasing strength requirement would only force crossbowmen to take builds with 7 or 8 power strike with 7 or 8 iron flesh and be an actual melee build with a very minimal loss in accuracy. That is definitely not nerfing their melee component of the class but rather buffing it to retarded levels.

See, here you're assuming that a build such as 15-24 is inherently worse in melee than 24-15, which is inherently untrue. Combine a fast 1h weapon like the liuyedao with 24 agility and the light armor that most xbowers wear, and you've got yourself a potent melee threat, even with "only" 5 PS. Arguably, that's a better option than the inverse, where a lightly-armored xbower is stuck with minimal mobility and a short weapon.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Renay on January 05, 2018, 11:47:16 pm
Quote from: bensai on January 05, 2018, 04:20:35 pm
not like having a 3 slot arbalest make your choice of weapons much spicier. most xbowmen went for the 1 slot two handers like the mace or executioner sword of lombardic sword 2h-mode

Well, it gives you the choice out of every one hander, quite a few 2handers and some polearms. So yeah, it does actually make a difference. Now everyone is limited to the 0 slot weapons, which arent a lot or they will just take 3 stacks of steel bolts and run away to find new ones after they used them all.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Rico on January 06, 2018, 04:31:32 am
Quote from: Gandalf77 on January 05, 2018, 11:45:39 am
Rico you should try to play cav when there were so many xbows on the server, all you could do was to hide somewhere and when you tried to kill someone he could one shoot you with arb :P

Oh right, you are cav and complain about ranged, nice luxury problems :D

I am noob cav, but even I can backstab 1 guy who isn't aware of me every round, then my horse dies somehow and I use my average melee skills with my only-slightly-worse-than-the-average-infantry-guy dismounted-cav-character to get my second kill, and boom, I'm an average player who just killed 2 average players for no other reason than paying 2,014 gold upkeep once every three rounds off my 10 million gold stash I accumulated in light armor on DTV and through trading on the marketplace, but it's not so bad cuz I get valor for couchlancing that archer who scored two headshots the round before, so chances are I won't have to scam another noob on the market again for another while

friendly reminder that in a better world, a 2:1 KD means you are a solid player and not just another average joe on a horse

don't get me wrong, ranged players have an unfair advantage over infantry by game design as well because they get their ranged weapons and they still a get melee weapon on top. at least I feel like ranged players need to commit their builds more to being ranged than a cav guy who only pays riding skill and upkeep, but he can just choose to spawn without a horse and still be a decent foot soldier if he wishes to

also I'll never understand why people rage when they get shot but they're perfectly fine with being stabbed in the back by a lance from horseback. they should calmly accept both and bring a light shield and 1 slot boar spear that anyone can equip, or if they refuse to use the slots available to them and absolutely ask to get shot and couchlanced, they should at least complain equally about both and not only about getting shot

but you know, that all said, I still don't ask for a cav nerf in 3 different places 5 times a day and make a meme out of "OP couchlance no counterplay lul" and rally my homies to hop on the bandwagon. I just patiently wait till the global gold amount decreases and cav becomes more expensive to play. I stay true to my own playstyle and think of the strength of some other playstyles as a positive challenge I need to overcome if I want to be a better player. I welcome you to try the same, because in the past, balancers have actually listened to the community's QQ, and they have come up with their own distorted ideas of how to "improve", "save" or "fix" cRPG. this is how Tydeuses are born, they feed on little Rider tears.

cRPG balance should just be reverted to the good old days where each class had something OP about them and the mod still had players, and then never be touched again.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Rebelyell on January 06, 2018, 04:32:33 pm
Arbalest was able to 1 shot champion plated charger(I have no idea how it works now), damange output on that weapon is insane bro.
With porper build xbowers are able to be good with ranged weapons and with melee, so far best hybride class.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Ikarus on January 06, 2018, 05:44:54 pm
Quote from: Rebelyell on January 06, 2018, 04:32:33 pm
Arbalest was able to 1 shot champion plated charger

now now, let's not drift away into the fantasy world here :)
I never managed to one shot an elephant aka plated charger in all my years and I spent all that time with +3 arba and +3 steel bolts. Mostly I even avoid shooting chargers because they're a waste of time and bolts. I even doubt that it's possible (and don't think that it ever was possible) to twoshot a plated charger even if it comes at you full speed and you hit it in the head while riding a donkey for bonus speed

Truly xbows have been meme weapons lately but please don't come up with urban myths like this, it's a bit daunting that even after this impact of a patch people still stomp on the class like this

Quote
so far best hybride class.
not anymore

but let's just give the new setup a chance for a couple of weeks before we discuss balancing further
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: oguz on January 07, 2018, 12:54:11 am
fix new char more skill problem pls. thanks.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Gristle on January 07, 2018, 02:02:01 am
Killing a horse typically takes 2+ bolts (of my very limited 8) and I get nothing for it besides the knowledge that I turned you into infantry for a bit.
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Larvae on January 07, 2018, 03:02:39 am
i loomed a hassun yumi back in time,when i made a char which should become later a horsearcher.now that bow is useless since it cant be used anymore on horseback.will i get that loompoint back,which ive spent already in that bow ?
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: jergu on January 07, 2018, 09:21:46 am
Prolly wrong thread but i can't hold back anymore...
I AM THANK YOU! I have regotten i veteran tiddy so that i get 1 free spam evertime i join server :)))))
Title: Re: 0.5.2.0, New Year, New Balance(tm), New Beginnings
Post by: Gnjus on January 07, 2018, 03:26:02 pm
Quote from: Rico on January 06, 2018, 04:31:32 am
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