cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Pandor_Archer on January 09, 2011, 07:13:27 pm
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throwings and xbows much deadly, i am 6 IF and brigandine and dieing from 3 darts... and 1 bolt with siedgexbow
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Actually , after playing for a while, i still consider archers dangerous. When they will be able to heirloom arrows/ bows it'll be even more dangerous. Fix not needed imo.
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heirloom arrows gives only more arrows , and to heirloom you need to play 10\24 ) i with boodkins + warbow need 6-7 arrows to kill tank)
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Being an archer is too frustrating at the mo so i rerolled the new OP - 2H + throwing :rolleyes:
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Being an archer is too frustrating at the mo so i rerolled the new OP - 2H + throwing :rolleyes:
same :?
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I think Archery is finally really well balanced. I got a 30lv archer -> so im not trolling here.
Crossbow would need some increasement for costs and reload time and throwing nerf for dmg.
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bow if you go str damag is ok but unreal targeting , if you go agi and 6PD some armor dont even feel your atacks with warbow!
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Cry moar.
I have to ride down a naked afk leech 4-5 times at full speed with my heavy plated charger. And then I have to repair him for about 3.500 gold.
If someone had told me about the plan to remove the horse charge, I would have a level 31 archer now and get way way way more kills. But who cares.
Press tab once in a while, and you will see the good archers are still on top of the scoreboard. You just need to change your playstyle a bit, then you will get (almost) the same amount of kills as before the patch.
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I'm pretty fine with archers atm.
Due to good (or really bad) timing, I started an archer build a week before the patch came out. So I can't really compare the current archer standards to pre-patch archery. Still, I've had no difficulty leveling up or getting some kills. The only problem I have is that I kind of suck. Just a little...
I'm also going for a 2h/archer hybrid, which means not all of my WPF will go into archery, which means I'm less accurate then other archers. And if I, an inexperienced archer who refuses to put all my WPF into archery, am capable of getting kills, then dedicated archers who don't suck can get kills too. If I can do it, you can do it. The ONLY thing I have trouble with is long range archery. Targets that are more than a certain distance away are VERY difficult to hit, which often leads me to spam arrows in my enemy's direction. It's probably my 130 WPF that's the problem though.
tl;dr: I suck and an a 2h/archer hybrid. If I can do it semi-decently, you can probably do it much, much better.
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3 cheers for the other guy eh?
But srsly we need to do something about throwers.. :|
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I'd only change it so that PD doesn't give wpf penalties - that way, people could choose to make a slower, less accurate but more damaging high PD archer, or make a more accurate, quicker firing, kiting type archer but with bad damage.
Btw, I made a archer postpatch (rather, respecced my existing twohander into one), but with powerstrike and some (50) polearm wpf. I can still get kills with a bow (using a strongbow, 6 PD) despite being fairly lowlevel (so agi suffers), and of course, as long as you have powerstrike you're not really handicapped in melee either (and sometimes it's just easier to come in and slash a few people in melee, anyway, rather then eg fire into melee fights like a retard).
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the plan to remove the horse charge, I would have a level 31 archer now and get way way way more kills. But who cares.
What plan?
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I'm pretty fine with archers atm.
Due to good (or really bad) timing, I started an archer build a week before the patch came out. So I can't really compare the current archer standards to pre-patch archery. Still, I've had no difficulty leveling up or getting some kills. The only problem I have is that I kind of suck. Just a little...
I'm also going for a 2h/archer hybrid, which means not all of my WPF will go into archery, which means I'm less accurate then other archers. And if I, an inexperienced archer who refuses to put all my WPF into archery, am capable of getting kills, then dedicated archers who don't suck can get kills too. If I can do it, you can do it. The ONLY thing I have trouble with is long range archery. Targets that are more than a certain distance away are VERY difficult to hit, which often leads me to spam arrows in my enemy's direction. It's probably my 130 WPF that's the problem though.
tl;dr: I suck and an a 2h/archer hybrid. If I can do it semi-decently, you can probably do it much, much better.
WIth the wpf soft cap, dedicated archers only have 20-25 higher wpf then you and if they have a powerdraw to actually use a decent bow to kill people other then peasants the power draw nerf makes them less accurate then your archer probably is.
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Archers are much more fun now that they aren't forced to hover near the action in order to collect XP. I'd venture to guess that archers are leveling 3-4 times faster now than they were pre-patch. Maybe even more. Damage vs plate has been nerfed, but overall, people are wearing less armor and thus archers should be more effective.
WIth the wpf soft cap, dedicated archers only have 20-25 higher wpf then you and if they have a powerdraw to actually use a decent bow to kill people other then peasants the power draw nerf makes them less accurate then your archer probably is.
I think the PD effect on accuracy needs to be dropped to 10% versus the current 14%. It isn't possible to use a longbow or warbow with any sort of reliable accuracy, even in a pure build, at 180.
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WIth the wpf soft cap, dedicated archers only have 20-25 higher wpf then you and if they have a powerdraw to actually use a decent bow to kill people other then peasants the power draw nerf makes them less accurate then your archer probably is.
Kesh, good archers only need 150-160 wpf to be deadly, even with 6 PD. Sometimes with even less PD.
I have no idea what your issue seems to be with it.
I think the PD effect on accuracy needs to be dropped to 10% versus the current 14%. It isn't possible to use a longbow or warbow with any sort of reliable accuracy, even in a pure build, at 180.
Well, with the current soft cap at 150, I find that it isn't that difficult to shoot people with a warbow.
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bow if you go str damag is ok but unreal targeting , if you go agi and 6PD some armor dont even feel your atacks with warbow!
erm.....bullshit. I got lvl 30 archer, 140 wpf bow, 60 wpf 1h, 40 wpf 2h. This guy does it all: Makes STUPID amounts of money: Snipes peoples faces, theres NO armour you can buy that a hit from warbow or longbow wont make you rock back, and thanks to 18 str 20 agi (21 at lvl 31) I regularly just ditch my bow and rape people in melee, with 1h and 2h weapons. I have all the armours I want, and literally, when Im doing good, its me at the top of one team, Finn on the other, he will tell you, archers melt faces now.
I can outsnipe STUPID archers using strongbow and lesser bows, it insults me that they even bother. Same with Xbows, the hunting and almost fire faster than longbow, but NOONE offers real competition to 18 str archers, we are the great unwashed, killing who we want at range or in melee. Although speed of fire is down, accuracy seems to be UP. You can make your archer godlike by lvl 22, if not 15.
Also Im gonna retire soon as poss, and rebuild with 100% of wpf in archery....then I dont know, but I imagine it will be annoying to try to siege MY castle.
Throwing dmg DOES need nerfing tho....bloody KNIVES can 1shot peasants......
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erm.....bullshit. I got lvl 30 archer, 140 wpf bow, 60 wpf 1h, 40 wpf 2h. This guy does it all: Makes STUPID amounts of money: Snipes peoples faces, theres NO armour you can buy that a hit from warbow or longbow wont make you rock back, and thanks to 18 str 20 agi (21 at lvl 31) I regularly just ditch my bow and rape people in melee, with 1h and 2h weapons. I have all the armours I want, and literally, when Im doing good, its me at the top of one team, Finn on the other, he will tell you, archers melt faces now.
I can outsnipe STUPID archers using strongbow and lesser bows, it insults me that they even bother. Same with Xbows, the hunting and almost fire faster than longbow, but NOONE offers real competition to 18 str archers, we are the great unwashed, killing who we want at range or in melee. Although speed of fire is down, accuracy seems to be UP. You can make your archer godlike by lvl 22, if not 15.
Also Im gonna retire soon as poss, and rebuild with 100% of wpf in archery....then I dont know, but I imagine it will be annoying to try to siege MY castle.
Throwing dmg DOES need nerfing tho....bloody KNIVES can 1shot peasants......
Wow, someone is exaggerating.
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what bit? :P
Seriously, I can post some screenshots of scores at mapchange if you want?
And ok, maybe knives dont ONESHOT peons, but 2 will kill for sure...
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Well, I'm currently using a Strongbow+bodkins, have PD6 and 117 wpf (using mail nerfs this somewhat) and it's alright as long as I aim carefully, and the damage is decent. I'll probably go for PD7, as well, since I'm fine with the accuracy. Also have 6 PS & 60 polearm wpf, which is enough for decent meleeing as well. I'm fairly happy how it performs, really, although it did suck before 6 PS & PD (18 str made it fun, really). 12 agi makes it a bit rough... but eh, movement and attack speed is already decent at that level.
I'll try a warbow or longbow when I have 15 agility, probably.
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Wow, someone is exaggerating.
+1
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All we need is Pierce damage. We dont need to speed up we dont need more damage its all about Pierce. Trust me i played a 220 wpf archer and i agree with decreasing our shoot rate but its not much fun trying to kill a tank with 6-7 arrows. Its like to play as a Fly, flying around and get on enemies nerves. Frustrating!
Its just ridiculous. My proposal is to decide between bodkins with pierce damage or large bodkin pack after retirement.
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No one noticed that arrows act as homing missiles? Really?
The main reason why I stopped playing my archer is not the dmg nerf but stupid auto-aim. Random close range head shots anyone? No, you are not that good ego-maniac, your dices just rolled in your favour and you scored head shot without proper aiming. You know you didn't have time to aim but it happens every so often regardless.
And arrows making sudden curves towards target even though your aim was off and should have missed?
I've had an archer for a long time before this patch and it required much more skill to score a hit before. I've heard it even required more skill when c-rpg came to life but I wasn't there to witness.
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All we need is Pierce damage. We dont need to speed up we dont need more damage its all about Pierce. Trust me i played a 220 wpf archer and i agree with decreasing our shoot rate but its not much fun trying to kill a tank with 6-7 arrows. Its like to play as a Fly, flying around and get on enemies nerves. Frustrating!
Its just ridiculous. My proposal is to decide between bodkins with pierce damage or large bodkin pack after retirement.
And how many shots do you think it should take to bring down someone who spends tons of money on protection and cannot retaliate at your range?
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I suggest multishot for archers. Arrows should split up and headshot 3 nearby targets on impact. :lol:
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I m a lvl 23 archer (18 strengh/15 agility, 136 archery, 22 TH, 3 Athletics/6 PD/ 5WP) Yes, I m not the best archer around, but archery feels (for me) now after the update much better. The only thing I would change is cut damage back to pierce. My accuracy is not great, but I get 8-11 kills per game now using warbow and a Green Tunic over Mail (SIEGE). Before the update I used ge 7 kills tops (yea, pretty crap). And something else, I can get 3-4 shots from other archers at the chest and I'll be able to survive, however, I only survive 1-2 shots from a xbow tops (hate those guys with xbows :P). So please, change cut to pierce, it would help a lot.
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heirloom arrows gives only more arrows , and to heirloom you need to play 10\24 ) i with boodkins + warbow need 6-7 arrows to kill tank)
Welcome to the world of the one hander... only your job is less risky.
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I think Archery is finally really well balanced. I got a 30lv archer -> so im not trolling here.
Crossbow would need some increasement for costs and reload time and throwing nerf for dmg.
+1
Archery is exactly were it should be..
Xbows needs a damage nerf, throwing prolly could use the same jack off animation as archery has.... throwing needs to slow down
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Changing bows back to pierce with most people wearing much less armour would make them hillarious. If anything, crossbows and throwing could use some adjustments, archery is fine tbh.
It's not like archers are particularly problematic to play, you have fun shooting people, get some kills, then switch to melee once melee approaches (6 powerstrike for the win), get some more kills (or die if it's someone who has better blocking skills, but oh well), then back to archery or keep fighting together with the infantry... eh. In fact, it's quite fun (mostly I play my archer and my horseman nowdays).
Basically, for me, an archer is like a normal infantryman with less wpf and some less points (and a bow+arrow to upkeep, so less armour) which is a bit worse at melee but can shoot at range. I went str and PD first (12 agi, 18 str), and the accuracy (with strongbow, atm, I'll try warbow when I grind the money) resembles old crossbow reticule at the moment - but it's not really a problem, since you can fire quite quickly regardless and you could still hit people at range with the old crossbow anyway, since the arrow/bolt often goes into the center regardless of reticule size.
Of course, I suspect the "I'm going to roll with 30 agi and run and shoot" people are less effective without autocannon of doom light bows.
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what bit? :P
Seriously, I can post some screenshots of scores at mapchange if you want?
And ok, maybe knives dont ONESHOT peons, but 2 will kill for sure...
isnt that the best thing about having 9 pt? :wink:
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isnt that the best thing about having 9 pt? :wink:
Of course after putting so many points in str, a dedicated melee will tear you apart with their speed. This is the problem I've been having. There are a few characters out there who are so much faster than me, it is impossible for me to fight them without help. I can block their attacks, but I cannot strike back. And I've only devoted half my character to throwing.
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grey was raping face on one of the empty servers, although I dont remember him getting kills with bow mostly 1h sword and no shield ;)
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Yeah bow is OP when theres few people.....So I just cut ppl with Knifey, the Niuweidao, but since I got 70 1h and 40 2h, I use langes messer and katana also, all the fast weapons, Iron Mace also, just to get the edge back on dedicated melees
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Bows arent OP for the following reasons:
-VERY cheap equip, you are making easy money as archer.
-Low speed and damage.It´s hard to kill much as archer, you are somewhat more a support class.
-High WPF investment before effective.You really need high agi as archer with almost exclusively WM-points invested in Archery to get good accurate.
Crossbowery and throwing need very slight nerfs imo, Bows are fine.
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Cut damage on bows is just stupid and makes absolutely zero sense. The rest of the nerfs should balance them properly but i just can't get my head around cut damage on an arrow. (which also makes bows only do double instead of triple damage on headshots...)
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the thing is; cut deal dmg as pierce should, blunt is kinda good as it is, then we have pierce....
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Im fine with leaving cut for bows, EXCEPT if its possible: When using bodkins, keep the + dmg at 2 BUT make the attack PIERCE....
dont know if this can be done....
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Actually the Game goes to much in an no Realism way and thats poor!I am Fine if the Damage scale from Bows get lowered but cut Damage with a Bow!!!???
In same like the Talking about Mirror Damage by Tking thats Really nonsense i was Playing M&B because realistic Game play but the new things are nonsense!
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Kesh, good archers only need 150-160 wpf to be deadly, even with 6 PD. Sometimes with even less PD.
I have no idea what your issue seems to be with it.
Well, with the current soft cap at 150, I find that it isn't that difficult to shoot people with a warbow.
i can say that person is skiled only in native , those archering not even clost to native and if you play cRPG more then in native you can rlly loose your skill) plz fix it give archers more wpf
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throwings and xbows much deadly, i am 6 IF and brigandine and dieing 1 bolt with siedgexbow
lies
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It's not lies, I have 5 IF and am getting 1 shotted in light and med armor. That's fine, xbows take forever to reload and it's easy enough to interrupt them on the reload. Bows as of the latest patch are good, I'm enjoying myself as an archer again. Managed to get 18 kills to 10 deaths which I think might be a personal best for me ;)
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It's not lies, I have 5 IF and am getting 1 shotted in light and med armor. That's fine, xbows take forever to reload and it's easy enough to interrupt them on the reload. Bows as of the latest patch are good, I'm enjoying myself as an archer again. Managed to get 18 kills to 10 deaths which I think might be a personal best for me ;)
THAT may not be lies. But 6 IF in Brig getting 1-shotted anywhere but the head is.
I have a dedicated xbowman with 135 proficiency in xbow, using a siege xbow. The only people I 1-shot are nakeds/light armor, or headshots. Everyone else either needs to be hurt already, get shot again, or get finished off with my sword.
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Everyone already uses Bodkins.
As Lv. 28 Archer I know these things.
And Archers only make big bucks due to the requirement of cheap-ass armor, mmkay?
:mrgreen:
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I used barbed or khergit arrows.