cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: LordLargos on July 11, 2014, 08:00:47 am

Title: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: LordLargos on July 11, 2014, 08:00:47 am
Most of you already know my opinion on the topic so I won't go on and on about
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how it's far too accurate, because I want to hear your opinion on it.

I don't know if it will have a great enough effect, but my idea is to divide HA skill effect by 2 and allow points to be invested for every 3 agility attributes instead of 6.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Grumbs on July 11, 2014, 11:20:46 am
Maybe we could have duplicates of the bows and make one set "can't use on horseback" and the other set are usable, but they have worse stats. So first set none can be used from horseback, then the others some can be but they are worse versions
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Strudog on July 11, 2014, 01:48:48 pm
make wpf not damage related and make PD not take away from WPF, so archers have the choice of being accurate and do little dmg or hit hard and have worse accuracy.

This game should be balanced on the philosophy of counter-balance, archers should not be able to hit hard and have very good accuracy.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: BlindGuy on July 11, 2014, 03:49:57 pm
Quote from: Strudog on July 11, 2014, 01:48:48 pm
make wpf not damage related and make PD not take away from WPF, so archers have the choice of being accurate and do little dmg or hit hard and have worse accuracy.

This game should be balanced on the philosophy of counter-balance, archers should not be able to hit hard and have very good accuracy.

Have to agree that the all or nothing nature of archery is a bit silly. But also any more nerfs to HA would make it completely useless. And it does need to be there, just as horse crossbow does: Twats need a way to express themselves.

Personally, I would love to have admin for a day, or get a script installed on c-rpg.net: Put WPF into crossbows: character banned, put WPF into archery and get riding skill: account ban. But thats just my opinion for an easy fix.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: MURDERTRON on July 11, 2014, 07:52:38 pm
Quote from: Grumbs on July 11, 2014, 11:20:46 am
Maybe we could have duplicates of the bows and make one set "can't use on horseback" and the other set are usable, but they have worse stats. So first set none can be used from horseback, then the others some can be but they are worse versions

Only half the bows are good anyway.  Make all the good bows foot archer only then adjust the stats of what's left to be designated HA bows.  No need to add new it's.

I realize this will also create a dearth of bows for low level archers, but we all know low level archery is useless much like how low level riding is worthless until 4.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Geon on July 12, 2014, 05:06:19 am
The class doesn't really need anymore nerfs. As far as accuracy goes anyone who has played HA on more than an STF should know how annoying it is to hit people anyway(Especially with all that dancing going on). Most HA opt to use the Nomad/Tatar bow so damage with even bodkins is negligible on most targets. So what else is there really left to nerf? Horses again?

I think the real problem people just don't know how to deal with HA. The people who rage the most are 2h heroes who don't carry a shield and expect to be able to jump slice kill everyone in one hit. I've never really had any problem dealing with HA on my other characters. People just need to use more tactics against HA(Trees, wells, rocks, fences, and bushes come to mind).

I don't deny that HA can be annoying, but I don't agree at all that the class is game breaking. If there were no ranged cavalry the servers would be over run with lancers, and 1h/2h cavalry. Every class brings a balance to the game.

I understand that delaying at the end of round is what causes most of the rage. However in reality every class delays at the end of rounds. HA just do it in a little more annoying way.

Anyway that's just my opinion as a long time HA, and I'm sure it doesn't matter to most of you. Sorry for shitty the shitty formatting.


Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: MURDERTRON on July 12, 2014, 05:30:11 am
Quote from: Geon on July 12, 2014, 05:06:19 am
I don't deny that HA can be annoying, but I don't agree at all that the class is game breaking. If there were no ranged cavalry the servers would be over run with lancers, and 1h/2h cavalry. Every class brings a balance to the game.

Have you seen Gigglebyte on his horse lately?  When I play my hoplite, I can't stab him as he charges me, because the second I drop my shield, he shots me, interrupting my stab.  Then he still runs me over with an armored horse.  When I play my 9Ath build, he just runs away because he is faster, shooting over his left shoulder with ridiculous accuracy.  It's going to be the same for a 1h shielder.

Against an archer, he moves faster and is more maneuverable making him harder to hit, while drawing with the same speed.  He can constantly interrupt crossbower's reload unless he is up some stairs and behind cover.

He can shoot from outside a thrower's effective distance with higher range and accuracy.

He doesn't have to go anywhere near infantry.

There is no one on one counter, and if ever presented with a team of archers, he will simply go to the other side of the map and pick off targets there while his team hopefully kills all the archers.

So unless he's being an idiot and runs into some trees or a rock or whatever tactics you're talking about, how do you stop him?
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Hirlok on July 12, 2014, 05:58:41 am
Introduce random horse flu.

Horse slow, shivering (= terrible accuracy), and walking backwards. Plus 4x repairs when it is ill.

The pandemic will last until only hardcore HA is still playing.

...and while at it, affect all horses. Annoying beasts.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Geon on July 12, 2014, 06:25:41 am
Quote from: MURDERTRON on July 12, 2014, 05:30:11 am
Have you seen Gigglebyte on his horse lately?  When I play my hoplite, I can't stab him as he charges me, because the second I drop my shield, he shots me, interrupting my stab.  Then he still runs me over with an armored horse.  When I play my 9Ath build, he just runs away because he is faster, shooting over his left shoulder with ridiculous accuracy.  It's going to be the same for a 1h shielder.

Against an archer, he moves faster and is more maneuverable making him harder to hit, while drawing with the same speed.  He can constantly interrupt crossbower's reload unless he is up some stairs and behind cover.

He can shoot from outside a thrower's effective distance with higher range and accuracy.

He doesn't have to go anywhere near infantry.

There is no one on one counter, and if ever presented with a team of archers, he will simply go to the other side of the map and pick off targets there while his team hopefully kills all the archers.

So unless he's being an idiot and runs into some trees or a rock or whatever tactics you're talking about, how do you stop him?

This entire post can just be summed up with "git gud m8". I'll try to beak it down at least.

First of all Gigglebyte is a great horse archer. Yeah he uses an armored horse, and take makes it a bit tougher to take him down. However he does have to pay to ride it. Normally I use an arabian horse which does die a lot faster obviously.  Though the point of this isnt really to argue about how overpowered or not heavy horses are.

In regards to getting shot before you get your stab off that takes a  bit of practice/timing to pull off. Also why are you trying to chase a horse on foot? Humans can't run faster than horses. HA vs Archer battles are rough, but it really depends on the terrain. Sure on flat ground in an open field the ground archer is at a disadvantage, but most of the time archers aren't in an open field. Xbows should always be behind cover whenever possible, and besides they can pretty much 2 shot any horse or HA. Most throwers use shields which makes them very tough targets. You have to get in close to kill them - in their range. If they aren't using a shield (like my thrower) then they probably shouldn't be going after HA or really any archers for that matter.

I'm not going to address infantry, because it makes no sense for them to counter HA. Grab a shield and cover your archers.

I feel like you are just getting annoyed at the few "great" HA. People don't complain when a good melee or cavalry go 20+ kills in a map with little to no deaths.

So really what point are you making? You're complaining about the tactics that HA can use. Which is all you can really complain about, because HA damage is low, and accuracy is really only mediocre at speeds more than a trot.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Strudog on July 12, 2014, 08:15:47 am
all HA's are fine apart from Yumi HA's, they have good accuracy and good damage which to me is really shity considering you can't do much about them. And before you say you i don't know what i am talking about, i have probably played HA more than 90% of the community.
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Switchtense on July 12, 2014, 12:22:36 pm
Quote from: Strudog on July 12, 2014, 08:15:47 am
all HA's are fine apart from Yumi HA's, they have good accuracy and good damage which to me is really shity considering you can't do much about them. And before you say you i don't know what i am talking about, i have probably played HA more than 90% of the community.

YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!
Title: Re: What to do about horse archery?
Post by: Inglorious on July 12, 2014, 01:01:13 pm
Every damned time I try to catch one...
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