cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Realism Discussion => Topic started by: Tiger on June 19, 2014, 04:41:16 am
Title: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Tiger on June 19, 2014, 04:41:16 am
Well the Long Bow better bow down to the Yumi Bow :P
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Dionysus on June 19, 2014, 09:25:08 am
Hammers and screwdrivers. They are both tools, but they do different jobs.
A Yumi and a longbow. They are both bows, but they do different jobs.
I always find these comparisons so asinine. If the English could have used something better, I'm sure they would have. But they didn't, and that speaks volumes for the value of longbows. I doubt that given the chance, an Englishman or Welshman would trade his longbow for a Yumi at Agincourt.
P.S. I have no sense of humor.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Smoothrich on June 19, 2014, 09:44:51 am
Hammers and screwdrivers. They are both tools, but they do different jobs.
A Yumi and a longbow. They are both bows, but they do different jobs.
I always find these comparisons so asinine. If the English could have used something better, I'm sure they would have. But they didn't, and that speaks volumes for the value of longbows. I doubt that given the chance, an Englishman or Welshman would trade his longbow for a Yumi at Agincourt.
P.S. I have no sense of humor.
longbows had nothing to do with english success at agincourt, archers were just dirt cheap compared to knights so they hired a bunch, any arrow would fuck up unarmored horses (which is all they accomplished with ranged)
tho humorously I believe it was Agincourt where italian crossbow mercs tried to do a few volleys, but because of rain they had wet strings and couldn't shoot so they got scared off by the english archers. the french knights then immediately cav charged their own italian mercs for being cowardly ranged, and killed most of them themselves
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Gmnotutoo on June 19, 2014, 09:54:52 am
I logged in to post in this thread for the sole purposes of saying buff katanas.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Leesin on June 19, 2014, 10:34:18 am
longbows had nothing to do with english success at agincourt, archers were just dirt cheap compared to knights so they hired a bunch, any arrow would fuck up unarmored horses (which is all they accomplished with ranged)
tho humorously I believe it was Agincourt where italian crossbow mercs tried to do a few volleys, but because of rain they had wet strings and couldn't shoot so they got scared off by the english archers. the french knights then immediately cav charged their own italian mercs for being cowardly ranged, and killed most of them themselves
Perhaps not the direct reason for victory, but to say their unrivaled range on that battlefield and their hitting power had no effect on the outcome is ignorant. Sure, it could have been another European Bow or a Crossbow or something, but the former didn't hit as hard and the latter had a far slower rate of fire. Plus those "hired archers" you speak of, they come hand in hand with those Longbows, they probably spent hundreds of hours practicing with their Longbow. Sure, other bows and crossbows could have wounded and killed those Horses, but the Longbow would have done it better.
It was the Battle of Crecy where the stupid French killed the Genoese Crossbowmen that retreated from the English arrows. The English had unstrung their bows and kept the strings dry during the rain before the battle whilst the Genoese couldn't do that with their Crossbows without tools.
But yeah anyway on topic, INB4 Katana better than European swords.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Morris on June 19, 2014, 02:25:06 pm
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Unwilling_Villain on June 19, 2014, 02:33:07 pm
50 pounds of draw weight lol.
An english longbow in the medieval period had a draw weight typically between 120-150 pounds, though there was one instance of a man drawing one with 200 pounds. There are very very few people who can actually use a longbow today because of the skill and massive strength you need to draw it. Children would practice from a very young age to use this weapon and skeletons found from this period had disfigured joints on the right shoulder, because to use a longbow repeatedly for such long periods of time would cause this damage.
This test is crap because it talks about pound to pound draw weight. Why would this matter? The longbow has far higher draw weight irl than yumi (who have between 30-75 pound draw weight) so would shoot further and faster and with more damage to the target. No longbowman would use a bow with 50 pound draw weight so this test is completely irrelavant to which bow is superior.
TLDR: Americans trying to study European and Asian history is stupid 90% of the time. If you believe this video I think you would love - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1281313/
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Glyph on June 19, 2014, 03:29:03 pm
I couldn't agree more with Villain! The types of wood available in Japan and other parts of the world weren't good enough to make bows with draw weights above +- 80lbs not in that age atleast. The Yumi was made form laminated layers of bamboo, which is a very good woodtype for resisting tension, but not compression, so they made the best out of it by making the bow a recurve and making it very long so the load on the wood was less per amount of length. Another reason why the drawweight couldn't go over 80 lbs on a Yumi was because the glue wouldn't hold much more than that This man is one of the few still capable of shooting a real warbow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KR0pvYkZy7A
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: //saxon on June 19, 2014, 03:45:49 pm
Yumi is claimed better in the video but in cRPG atm longbow is best bow and proven irl id say to be one of the deadliest bows ever.
but back in the iron age the longbow was defiantly one of the keys to win battles, welsh long bowmen were considered the deadliest archers going. and the longbow was defiantly a fucking beast against any enemy.
like a medieval mortar or artillery gun, fuck the catapult and Trebuchet, longbow was the shit, raining down arrows from loooong distances.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Algarn on June 19, 2014, 03:52:10 pm
like a medieval mortar or artillery gun, fuck the catapult and Trebuchet, longbow was the shit, raining down arrows from loooong distances.
In this game, with 5 PD and a short bow, you actually shoot further than with 6PD and a longbow. Fuck logic.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Tomas_Miles_again on June 19, 2014, 04:09:33 pm
Something to do with longbow using heavier arrows...
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Herezy92 on June 19, 2014, 04:14:08 pm
Quote
LongBow VS Yumi
Chuck Norris VS Silverster Stalone Fixed
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: woody on June 19, 2014, 04:43:07 pm
Longbows had nothing to do with victory at Agincourt? Fucking idiot.
Read some proper history books before talking such utter bollocks.
Crecy, Poitiers, Agincourt would all have been English defeats without the longbow. Armies comprised of foot knights protecting longbowmen didnt win one offs in weird conditions they consistently won engagements.
What is it with septics spouting so confidently on things they know nothing about?
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Switchtense on June 19, 2014, 04:46:57 pm
What is it with septics spouting so confidently on things they know nothing about?
That is 99% of all posts on the internet or not?
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Thryn on June 19, 2014, 07:43:39 pm
Just another thread where people see one thing and blow it out of proportion
10/10 you're all masters of medieval weaponry and are qualified to teach the world with your experience
/thread
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Teeth on June 19, 2014, 08:39:12 pm
Well the test is telling to the extend that this particular yumi is more efficient than this particular longbow, which isn't very significant.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Nehvar on June 19, 2014, 09:23:36 pm
Hold on here. There seems to be an assumption that all longbows had one of the infamous English longbowmen behind them. That's definitely not the case. Longbows were used all over Europe by many cultures but only the English had the freakshows. The vast majority of them had nowhere near the 150-lb draw talked about here.
The video in the OP is a comparison of bow design and, I guess, technique at equal draw strength. In those regards the Yumi is superior because it is both more accurate and hits harder. If you compare a yumi with a 150-lb draw to a longbow with a 150-lb draw it's still going to beat it. Now if they were talking about the "ultimate archer of the middle ages" then your points would have more validity.
I can't believe I'm arguing on the side of a Japanese weapon on these forums but there it is.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Glyph on June 19, 2014, 10:03:27 pm
Hold on here. There seems to be an assumption that all longbows had one of the infamous English longbowmen behind them. That's definitely not the case. Longbows were used all over Europe by many cultures but only the English had the freakshows. The vast majority of them had nowhere near the 150-lb draw talked about here.
The video in the OP is a comparison of bow design and, I guess, technique at equal draw strength. In those regards the Yumi is superior because it is both more accurate and hits harder. If you compare a yumi with a 150-lb draw to a longbow with a 150-lb draw it's still going to beat it. Now if they were talking about the "ultimate archer of the middle ages" then your points would have more validity.
I can't believe I'm arguing on the side of a Japanese weapon on these forums but there it is.c
We want to find out what the best bow is, don't we? If we want to do that it isn't very clever to use the meditative Yumi(wchich it was used for) and compare it to a longbow whih was used to practice target shooting. Looking for the best bow we would have to look at the best bows available within the categories Yumi and longbow, not the average or most widely used ones. And like I pointed out before, you can't make a Yumi with 150lbs of draw weight. Arguing about accuracy, I don't know whether the Yumi was more accurate, yes the arrow does leave the bow with more accuracy, but a fully powered warbow would propel the arrow faster, which in turn would give it a more straight flight. Another thing about the accuracy though is the difference in sides of the bow on which to place the arrow, I shoot both types of bows(Yumi just a couple of times yet though) and I would say the arrow isn't as stable on the side of the bow as it is with a longbow, but that ofc. could be because I learned to shoot with a longbow instead of a Yumi. BTW Another reason why the Yumi gets a + on accuracy is because when you release the string, you twist the bow itself away from the arrow, so the arrow barely touches the bow once it is propelled so the arrow doesn't drift off as much.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Thryn on June 19, 2014, 11:12:35 pm
tho humorously I believe it was Agincourt where italian crossbow mercs tried to do a few volleys, but because of rain they had wet strings and couldn't shoot so they got scared off by the english archers. the french knights then immediately cav charged their own italian mercs for being cowardly ranged, and killed most of them themselves
longbows had nothing to do with english success at agincourt, archers were just dirt cheap compared to knights so they hired a bunch, any arrow would fuck up unarmored horses (which is all they accomplished with ranged)
I wasn't arguing the longbow won Agincourt; I was saying it would likely have been preferred by the English and Welsh due to the way High Middle Age warfare was fought, which was incredibly different than Japanese warfare.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Smoothrich on June 20, 2014, 06:40:38 am
Longbows had nothing to do with victory at Agincourt? Fucking idiot.
Read some proper history books before talking such utter bollocks.
Crecy, Poitiers, Agincourt would all have been English defeats without the longbow. Armies comprised of foot knights protecting longbowmen didnt win one offs in weird conditions they consistently won engagements.
What is it with septics spouting so confidently on things they know nothing about?
sorry man reading a few wikipedia articles and playing medieval 2 total war instead of going to your senior highschool prom doesn't make you an expert in anything
I bet you think the french's armor was penetrated by the Mighty, 1xx Draw Weight Super Longbow Action penetrationg shots too right
oh and all the casualties caused by the Legendary English Bowmen were them stabbing unarmed prisoners in the neck out of cowardice and fear instead of any actual military accomplishment
The french were defeated by mud and a brazen war crime, the English were shit, and if they actually had anything going on for them with the Superior Longbowmen, you'd think they wouldn't of lost the 100 years war so completely and pathetically..
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Thryn on June 20, 2014, 07:01:32 am
sorry man reading a few wikipedia articles and playing medieval 2 total war instead of going to your senior highschool prom doesn't make you an expert in anything
I bet you think the french's armor was penetrated by the Mighty, 1xx Draw Weight Super Longbow Action penetrationg shots too right
oh and all the casualties caused by the Legendary English Bowmen were them stabbing unarmed prisoners in the neck out of cowardice and fear instead of any actual military accomplishment
The french were defeated by mud and a brazen war crime, the English were shit, and if they actually had anything going on for them with the Superior Longbowmen, you'd think they wouldn't of lost the 100 years war so completely and pathetically..
Whoa, before you go sperging all over these guys, just remember:
England's greatest accomplishment isn't the longbowman. It's 'Murica.
Title: Re: Long Bow vs Yumi
Post by: Lactating Vegetables on June 20, 2014, 01:08:26 pm