cRPG

cRPG => Beginner's Help and Guides => Topic started by: Bobthehero on January 08, 2011, 09:27:33 am

Title: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on January 08, 2011, 09:27:33 am
For all people here who would like a little bit of a challenge here is a playstyle that isnt seen often on the field.

SWASHBUCKLIN'
(aka using a 1 handed weapon without a shield)

First thing first this require skill in manual blocking, go practise it with a 2 hander if you must but practise first, you can try to go after peasant to get the hang of it, helped me a lot on my way there. You can keep a shield at the beginning to help agaisnt better players if you want, its up to you.


Well it is pretty close to fighting with a 2 handed weapon but on paper you will de toast'd agaisnt everything.

So keep these things in mind:

Generally you'll have the speed advantage, makes spamming easier, but you shouldnt relay on it too much. This allows you to pump a bit more in str to compensate for the lower damage output of your weapon. You wont need shield skill, at least not as much (I get 3-4 points in shield/athletics/weapon master). The rest goes in str since you will bounce a lot more often otherwise.

However your weapon is also lighter which mean than you well feel some sort of ''stun lock'' every once in a while when you parry an attack. After getting stun locked, you shouldnt try to attack as most of the time your enemy will be faster, having his (or her!) attack ready while you were busy being stunned.

More of a general tip really but getting used to your weapon range helps a lot! Go use it in single player a bit if you aren't sure.

Since you wont need a super shield and that 1 handers are cheaper than 2 handers, you will be able to afford a better armor, use that to your advantage. I personally prefer to go in plate with that but its quite hard right now. (Y'know... upkeep and all that crap bla bla bal :wink:)

Feinting is your friend too, with your high speed you may be able to sneak a hit or two. Dont abuse it however, as an impatient one might just smash through your wiggling.

Well I think I covered all that was needed for this, good luck to you and maybe the Swashbucklin' spirit be with you.


Your grand Swashbucklere'
Bobthehero
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Useful tip from other users

1-on-1, fighting without a shield is still superior. In addition to the weapon stun, your weapon length allows the polearm or large 2hander user to kite you. Bob mentioned this, but I think it needs to be emphasized. You have to be aware of how far away the enemy is at all times. If they're out of reach or at an angle where their longer weapon will hit you first despite your faster weapon speed, you're going to have to block or dodge multiple times. Going on the defensive and lulling them into a sense of security is often advisable, unless you're facing a skilled player.

By Kalam
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Poetrydog on January 08, 2011, 05:51:07 pm
Is swashbuckling using 1h without shield?
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Gristle on January 09, 2011, 12:10:07 am
I expected a guide on which items look the most piratey. Personally, I can't decide on a hat.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Kalam on January 09, 2011, 12:12:17 am
A lot of these points can be easily applied to those who use short 2h weapons. That said, I fully intend to try this on for size once my 1-hander is levelled up. Sans armour, of course!
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: zagibu on January 09, 2011, 12:25:28 am
A lot of these points can be easily applied to those who use short 2h weapons. That said, I fully intend to try this on for size once my 1-hander is levelled up. Sans armour, of course!

Dead meat is not a valid build. If you don't use armor, AND don't use a shield, you can try to sneak around, but you will still get shot many many times.

Also, I think that only 3-4 in WM combined with heavy armor will make your swings very slow.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Gristle on January 09, 2011, 12:27:33 am
swashbucklers were not known for having heavy armor.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: ShinySpoons on January 09, 2011, 01:52:15 am
Whenever I'm in for a bit of adventure (i.e underleveled) I'll run around in a tunic with only my nordic sword. Ambushes and sneak attacks are the norm at that point. For example, if facing multiple opponents ample use of the tilde key while feigning retreats will lead to kills, or at least hits. Occasionally, I run through the group following me and either cause team wounding or get some kills myself. Of course, good blocking ability is neccesary but not as much as the ability to dodge/situational awareness.

Ignoring poorly armed opponents is good as well, they get in the way of those with better weapons who have to be killed first.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on January 09, 2011, 05:56:47 am
Its SWASHBUCKLIN' not swashbuckling!

Details man, details, and oh... made the small text, should be clear now


Sans armour, of course!

Silly man  :)
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Socrates on January 09, 2011, 06:37:03 am
Ye ain't no pirate landblubber.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on January 09, 2011, 07:13:52 am
This is Swashbucklin' you sea dog! You best be paying goddamn respect!
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Socrates on January 09, 2011, 08:22:20 am
I'll pay with me keg full of powder on ye ship here.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Dunecat on January 09, 2011, 08:26:17 am
Dem, pirates...
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Formless on January 09, 2011, 08:30:37 am
I am thinking of becoming a swashbuckler myself.  I am debating which sword to get:

Long Espada Eslavona   8026   
weight 1.25
requirement 10
spd rtng 98
weapon length 103  <-- Longer reach
swing damage 29, cut
thrust damage 28 pierce

or

Side Sword   8922   
weight 1.3
requirement 8
spd rtng 101  <--Faster speed
weapon length 95
swing damage 32, cut  <--Better cut
thrust damage 26 pierce

Which one would you recommend and why?
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Kalam on January 09, 2011, 08:56:48 am
Long espada. Without a shield, length means everything- if you're agility based. Side sword if you're going to be a tank.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Formless on January 09, 2011, 09:16:09 am
Long espada. Without a shield, length means everything- if you're agility based. Side sword if you're going to be a tank.

Kalam, thanks for the answer, I have seen you play and I know that you are very good.  I am going for a 15/21 build with medium armour.  I was thinking of going shieldless during none peek hours with a few players on and with shield when there is a full 120 server. What would you suggest? 
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Socrates on January 09, 2011, 10:03:20 am
The Sarranid Cavalry Sword is a good choice too. It's also a cheap alternative to the long espada. It has 33c damage and 105 length. This makes it the longest 1h available and does more damage than the side sword and long espada on swings. The only downer is 95 speed, but it doesn't matter if you can block/feint and know how to time hits and not just spam.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on January 09, 2011, 09:54:17 pm
Long espada. Without a shield, length means everything- if you're agility based. Side sword if you're going to be a tank.

You sure know what you are talking about right there  :)

Tho I personally use a masterwork long espada with a str build.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Kalam on January 10, 2011, 08:01:54 pm
After putting in some serious play time on my 1-hander alt, I've come to these conclusions. Keep in mind that I'm playing a lightly armoured strength build.

1-on-1, fighting without a shield is still superior. In addition to the weapon stun, your weapon length allows the polearm or large 2hander user to kite you. Bob mentioned this, but I think it needs to be emphasized. You have to be aware of how far away the enemy is at all times. If they're out of reach or at an angle where their longer weapon will hit you first despite your faster weapon speed, you're going to have to block or dodge multiple times. Going on the defensive and lulling them into a sense of security is often advisable, unless you're facing a skilled player.

And that's that.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on January 10, 2011, 11:07:04 pm

1-on-1, fighting without a shield is still superior. In addition to the weapon stun, your weapon length allows the polearm or large 2hander user to kite you. Bob mentioned this, but I think it needs to be emphasized. You have to be aware of how far away the enemy is at all times. If they're out of reach or at an angle where their longer weapon will hit you first despite your faster weapon speed, you're going to have to block or dodge multiple times. Going on the defensive and lulling them into a sense of security is often advisable, unless you're facing a skilled player.



Added that in the new ''additional practiser experience'' box i just created
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on May 19, 2011, 05:07:16 am
Le epic bump
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Rangerbob on May 19, 2011, 05:42:56 am
I see some nekkid peasent walk around with a MW steel pick destroying people on the siege server.  I think he's probably 24/15 but yea he's fast as hell and that pick hurts.  Trick is block first then attack and get in their face. 
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on May 19, 2011, 05:49:25 am
I will say this, you shouldnt be blocking first if he got such a short weapon, try to fight him outside of the range of his pick,
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Vibe on May 19, 2011, 08:19:56 am
Also learn to chamber. 1h overhead chambers - deadly
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Shinimas on May 19, 2011, 08:47:37 am
swashbucklers were not known for having heavy armor.

They were also known for using a buckler, hence the name...

But anyway, include the usual pointers used by shielders, as they apply here as well, even though I expect swachbucklers to already have some experience with the game, since it's a guide, why not:

Basic facehugging - get close and circle to the left side of your enemy. That will make it possible to easily circle-strafe and left-strike them as you rotate the camera, shielders will often miss their left strike as you're running circles around them.

Left strike, your main attack, while aiming at solar plexus, will almost always hit the head, it's also faster and doesn't whiff as easily at extreme angles. However, it's arc is dislocated to the right, meaning it's not directly ahead of you, so you might barely miss targets that are close to your left even if it seems like the swords passed right through them. It also means you can hit people that are behind your right flank, so be careful.
Right strike is your "long range" attack, I don't have the numbers, but it sports a huge increase in range, however, whiffs a lot, if the enemy is close to your right, and it's slow.
Overhead is slow and short, however, from their experience with shielders, many people simply don't expect an overhead from a one-hander, waiting for the left strike instead, so that can get them.
Thrust with a 1H is long (a few points longer than the right strike even) and many one-handers have great thrusting damage, but using it is difficult, since it whiffs even at medium range. Most shielders use it only when they close in and forget about it during facehugging, but it's still possible to utilize, if you master spin-thrust. Remember that the thrust is the only attack that lets you rotate while executing the strike, which makes for some interesting combat options.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Sayton on May 19, 2011, 04:48:45 pm
Any real swashbuckler knows that the key to winning a sword fight is to throw your opponent off with clever insults.

You fight like a dairy farmer!
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: AlbaTiger on May 21, 2011, 03:08:24 am
Pirates my arse!

REAL Swashbucklers are people like the Three Musketeers and Zorro, not stinking pirates with their no skill and axe like cutlasses.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Dravic on May 21, 2011, 12:02:33 pm
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 (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/mb323.jpg/)


Pirate Style. Any suggestions how to improve my outfit? I have 4 str only!
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on May 22, 2011, 01:51:13 am
For the last time, this is swashbucklin' not swashbuckling, know ze difference
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: AlbaTiger on May 22, 2011, 07:17:27 pm
For the last time, this is swashbucklin' not swashbuckling, know ze difference

Doesnae change the fact ya cannae swashbuckle wi a cutlass.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on May 26, 2011, 01:31:47 am
Nay, since there aint no cutlasses :(
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Casimir on May 26, 2011, 10:15:14 am
I played abit of 1h no shield.

I duels its really effective. The speed and manouverability you have easily make up for the lower damage.

Things become very interesti.g when you begin taking maces amd no shield. Playing defensive until your opponent closes and realeasing a quick left swing followed by a right jas a tendency to catch the dpammers.

Back hugging a 2h and overheading is also effective but be ready to upblock if u try it on poleusers.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: MrShine on May 26, 2011, 10:42:01 pm
This seems like it would be fun every now and then.  I probably wouldn't retire and spec this, but maybe as a swashbucklin' alt it could give some chuckles.

What about this as a possible build?

Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)

    Strength: 21
    Agility: 21
    Hit points: 56

    Skills to attributes: 14

    Ironflesh: 0
    Power Strike: 7
    Shield: 0
    Athletics: 7
    Riding: 0
    Horse Archery: 0
    Power Draw: 0
    Power Throw: 0
    Weapon Master: 3

    One Handed: 132
    Two Handed: 1
    Polearm: 1
    Archery: 1
    Crossbow: 1
    Throwing: 1

Pros: 7 ps and ath, the two most important parts of a swashbuckler
Cons: less wm, no IF, no shield.  Super squishy.  Obviously a lot to lose, but it's the most maneuverable yet hard hitting build I can think of.

The next best build I'm thinking would be 21 str 18 agi.  Basically a trade off between 1 more ath and 3 more agility VS 3 more wm 4 IF.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on May 27, 2011, 12:36:19 am
Level 30, going to put that last point of str next level. I currently have 87 hp, hitting 90 next level as well as 10 ps.

Strength    29    
Agility    9    



One Handed    130    
Two Handed       
Polearm    1    
Archery    1    
Crossbow    1    
Throwing    1    


Iron Flesh    9    
Power Strike    9    
Shield    0
Athletics    3    
Riding    0    
Horse Archery    0    
Power Draw    0    
Power Throw    0    
Weapon Master    3
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Banok on May 27, 2011, 12:57:39 am
playing 1h no shield = same as playing with katana tbh
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Casimir on May 27, 2011, 01:17:20 am
Showing yourself not to understand what your talking about banok.

1h animations ae very different to 2h and the weapons are also. Lemgth damage speed and weight. As such they are very different playstyles.

@Bob are you not super slow / getting flanked n spammed easily?
Doesnt look like you'd fair to well in duels with that litlle agility.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Dravic on May 27, 2011, 11:11:23 pm
Try 6str/33agi 2ps 11athletics 10wm build with Yanmaodao (or a Falchion, but Yanmaodao is better in every single stat).

Running will never be the same.

And I am not bouncing off that much if i have full speed.

As for mace/noshield build:

Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)

Strength: 13
Agility: 27
Hit points: 48
Skills to attributes: 10
Ironflesh: 0
Power Strike: 4
Shield: 0
Athletics: 9
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 8
One Handed: 173
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

With Iberian mace

or

Level 30 (4 420 577 xp)

Strength: 15
Agility: 24
Hit points: 54
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 2
Power Strike: 5
Shield: 0
Athletics: 8
Riding: 0
Horse Archery: 0
Power Draw: 0
Power Throw: 0
Weapon Master: 8
One Handed: 173
Two Handed: 1
Polearm: 1
Archery: 1
Crossbow: 1
Throwing: 1

with Warhammer


Both effective and causing a lot of drama: if you knockdown enemy, in 85% of cases he won't get up ;D
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Kafein on May 27, 2011, 11:41:41 pm
This build is for noobs. You don't even have to chamberblock with an usual 1hander. Take a dagger or something like that and feel the masochist inside you.

Also, some people do really good with 1h no shield agi builds, like MrTurtle. I think it's better to go 18 str / 21 agi, then you can run fast and you hit hard enough.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: Bobthehero on May 28, 2011, 04:57:10 am
@Bob are you not super slow / getting flanked n spammed easily?
Doesnt look like you'd fair to well in duels with that litlle agility.

The fact that 1 handed weapons are faster compensates, and with my powerstrike I usually kill people first.
Title: Re: AH AH! A guide to swashbucklin'
Post by: MountedRhader on May 28, 2011, 05:01:12 am
I swear I was just going to write a guide on the fine art of the Rogue :evil:

Nice guide though.