cRPG
cRPG => Beginner's Help and Guides => Topic started by: TheAppleSauceMan on October 24, 2013, 02:56:12 am
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Currently level 32 going to be 33 in about an hour. 21/18 build pure 2h atm.
7 IF
7 PS
6 ATH
6 WM
At 33 I will have 2 Attribute points, and 2 skill points free. The options I have before me as I see it is either, convert all attribute points, get 6 riding or 6 shield. Obviously I wouldn't have enough WPF to support 6 PD or PT. Or I can wait it out and try to eventually hit 35 or 36 and go 21/21. I don't plan on ever retiring this character but realistically I doubt I'll hit 35 or 36.
I'm personally leaning towards 6 riding. Any opinions or input from anyone? Maybe someone's been in a similar position and could provide some first-hand advice or just provide any options I'm maybe not realizing I have.
Thanks in advance guys.
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the shield option seems quite useless, the riding might be fun. Latvian used to play 2h cav quite good as far as I remember.
Ofcourse you can always increase the amount of dicks you take up your ass by adding 3 STR so you can get 8 IF and 8 PS at lvl 34.
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You can get a 21/21 or 24/18 at level 34, level 34 is not that hard to reach with a good dose of Strat. With a nice 7/7/7/7 build and 1 point to spare. Put the attributes into Agility or Strength now, as it does give slight advantages.
Of course 6 riding is pretty nice as well, but I find two handed cavalry is crap compared to 1 hand or lance cavalry, so I would personally never really use a horse with this build. The way I see it you should just level another character if you want to play cav, with the ability to switch Strat heroes it doesn't take long.
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Minmax buils is for my old friendettas, go riding morningstar wrecks shit up on HB
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Apple, add variation to your build somewhat. You can add riding now, and shield later or vice versa. Adding variation definitely extends the longevity of your build and most likely the fun you'll have in certain situations.
Add riding: Congrats, you are two handed cav. Very fun class to play, but also hard because arrows hurt and you will be friendly with arrows. (And throwing lances... throwing lances seem to be popular as of late)
Add shield: Annoying arrows and throwing stuff(lances) begone. You can arrive to fights at 100% hp, most of the time, and also have access to a regenerative health bar. (picking up more shields after they break) Bring any sort of dagger with the shield, they are cheap, 0 slots, and you don't need wpf to use them. I recommend knife, or rondel, but any dagger works. To a smart player if you walk up to them with the shield and switch too late, they get a free hit. They also don't expect 2 handers to have a weapon behind the shield or the fact that you will stab them in the face if they try and get that free hit.
If you had any wpf, I would recommend throwing without a doubt. Throwing sucks when you start, but once you get used to it, it will be deadly. No need for throwing lances, that is excessive. 4 PT is enough to carry around heavy throwing axes, 5 for jarids. I recommend an absolute minimum of 4, a recommended dose of 5, and an even higher recommendation for 6. At 4 you hit people with good weapons, at 5 you hurt people with those weapons, at 6 you unleash the murder. (7 is overkill, but f- does it hurt to get hit by 7pt)
Either way, add something that will get more longevity to your build. You do not need to powergame and min-max all that, 21/18 is fine. Hell, 18/18 is fine.
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Honestly surprised that you are even staying the same build this long Apple. Usually you retire right at 31 very quickly. I love the level 34 build I currently use:
Str 22
Agi 21
7 PS
6 IF
7 ATH
7 WM
167 WPF Polearm
I am going for 35 (very slowly considering I barely have time to play anymore), I plan on adding another point into STR and one into IF. Very solid build, works very well for pikers and other polearms.
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You can get a 21/21 or 24/18 at level 34, level 34 is not that hard to reach with a good dose of Strat. With a nice 7/7/7/7 build and 1 point to spare. Put the attributes into Agility or Strength now, as it does give slight advantages.
Of course 6 riding is pretty nice as well, but I find two handed cavalry is crap compared to 1 hand or lance cavalry, so I would personally never really use a horse with this build. The way I see it you should just level another character if you want to play cav, with the ability to switch Strat heroes it doesn't take long.
This. It all depends on what you want to do with that character. If you're in it for the long haul I suggest saving up for full on 21/18 8if/ps or going 21/21. If you plan on retiring then spend those points now for utility (cav/whatever). I went for 21/18 (shoulda went for 21/21) on my main and when I got there, I felt like there was no point in playing anymore (100M xp to 35) and am now working on alts :lol:
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Short term adding 6 riding and using a 5 riding horse (I wouldn't recommend courser for 2h cav personally) seems like a decent idea. I think that would be more fun for you than converting skills to attributes, having 24/18 until you hit 34 (which wouldn't be too bad, maybe 6 months tops) and then having 8 PS.
I think it would be a good idea personally. I'd take riding over having shield as a 2h. But if you have the patience, you're probably better off going 24/18 at 33 and then at 34 putting the skill point into having 8 PS. It's a more "useful" build (IMO) than having riding as a 2h. 2h's can do very well with riding however, especially with a morningstar.
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Morningstar can be good for 2h cav but I think it is a waste when you can use it in the same effectiveness with 1h+shield. In fact the latter is more effective due to being able to use a shield. Same for longsword as it is very similiar to arabian cav sword in many ways. Maybe it is a better idea to use Persian Battle Axe or Great Axe; or not playing 2h cav at all, unless you want to fight with the effectiveness of a 2hander on foot which requires playing on the ground or getting dismounted.
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KAP10 and a couple other NA players have done very well with a 5 riding horse and a longsword (maybe it was HBS). But they had 8 PS. I've seen others ride an arabian with 7 or 6 PS using 2h (longsword) and also do very well.
2h may not be as good as 1h on horse, but he's already a 2h'er. So it's pointless to bring up 1h or polearm from horse in this discussion. Is 2h viable as cavalry? Certainly.
And I'd never want to use morningstar/shield as a 1h'er because when you get dismounted you're boned. As a 2h you're still deadly. Morningstar is a beast from horse.
That being said, if you go the riding route, I don't think you'll have any benefit of getting to 34. At least if you go pure 2h build (24/18 at 33) you'll have something to benefit from at 34.
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Depends on whether you want to lessen your weaknesses (hybridizing) or accentuate your strengths (pure). After trying both a high level super hybrid and pure build, both are great. It's hard to go wrong
I DO recommend having some sort of plan for level 34-36 regardless. I made a mistake years ago by only planning my build to level 33 since I never saw myself getting any higher and didn't care at that time.
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Wow thanks for all the input guys. I've read through and considered all the different options you guys have presented me with and I really appreciate it.
I've decided I definitely am not interested in just converting and putting the points into shield. Riding would be fun, but as a few have said I would have no protection from ranged which could be a large problem, plus if I put all into riding, I really have nowhere to go if I hit 34 and beyond so that would be pretty counter-productive. I guess I'm leaning towards hopefully making it to 34, my only question now being if I should go 21/21 or 24/18. This is something that I'm not very sure on. Does 1 point in IF and PS or 1 point in ATH and WM do more? Hmmm.
Honestly surprised that you are even staying the same build this long Apple. Usually you retire right at 31 very quickly. I love the level 34 build I currently use:
Str 22
Agi 21
7 PS
6 IF
7 ATH
7 WM
167 WPF Polearm
I am going for 35 (very slowly considering I barely have time to play anymore), I plan on adding another point into STR and one into IF. Very solid build, works very well for pikers and other polearms.
Would you say the difference from 6 WM/ATH to 7 was very noticeable?
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Would you say the difference from 6 WM/ATH to 7 was very noticeable?
I noticed a speed increase from 6 to 7 ATH. I rely completely on speed so it was big for me.
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I personally think you having 6 WM and all into 2h is already a big advantage on the battlefield. I don't think that little extra will be noticeable on swing speed or damage. Having 1 more athletics would certainly be "nice", but I think having 8 power strike is going to be much more beneficial than having 7 athletics. 6 athletics is just fine on the field, you don't need 7 (but you'd likely be faster than most if you did). I'd rather hit hard than get somewhere a tit faster.
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Yeah I don't think the extra WPF will be worth much of anything, I'm more worried about the ATH. Though to be fair I don't really have any problems with my ATH as it is now. But at the same time I just feel like the difference between 7 and 8 IF/PS would be minimal. I'll have to test it out in the calculator and see what I get though.
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Just like athletics is noticeable, I seem to notice (or at least I do in my head) the difference between each level going from 5 to 6 to 7 to 8 PS.
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I notice it a lot with 1h, but with 2h I start to not realize the difference after 6 or so PS. Unless we're talking like 12 lol.
So I mucked around a bit in the calculator and the difference in damage would be very minimal it seems. And IF only adds 2 HP, though with the strength it would be 5 HP total. I am still rather torn. Maybe I'll just make a STF and see if I notice any difference between the different levels of PS/IF and WM/ATH.
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The higher the base damage of your weapon, the more PS adds to damage. If you're 2shotting or 3shotting anyways despite theoretically increasing your PS, it's just better to increase ATH, since each level of ath is pretty noticeable. It's as if you decreased a whole tier in gear weight (~7.5kg). Having above average ath is a decent advantage compared to only having average ath.
WM is actually quite useful, too, and having >20wpf over an enemy is better than it appears (every millisecond counts), but a lot gets taken away from armor. For melee, the higher wpf you have above the average, the better; therefore, WM would help for you, even if the effective value only increases by 5-6 points. Most people are around 120-130, so 140-150 is quite good.
Testing STF builds for a while is the best thing you can do. That's what made me decide that I liked 8+ath and shy away from 21/21.
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Yeah I seem to 2-3 hit people on average, the few exceptions of course being high STR plate crutch but that's not too bad usually I can outspeed them easily. Yeah I'm leaning towards 21/21. The ATH and WM definitely seems like it'll be a bit more noticeable then the IF/PS. Plus then eventually I could get 7 riding! Thanks for all the input guys. Much appreciated.
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Would you say the difference from 6 WM/ATH to 7 was very noticeable?
With the armor I wear, it was definitely noticeable. With the armor you wear (my armor) it may not be nearly as pronounced.
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Not sure why you have so much wpm with a specialized build.
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You'd be surprised how much of a difference it makes. As lame (gay) as it is, that much WPF in 2h can really let one abuse hilt-slash and double-swings.
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The higher the base damage of your weapon, the more PS adds to damage. If you're 2shotting or 3shotting anyways despite theoretically increasing your PS, it's just better to increase ATH, since each level of ath is pretty noticeable. It's as if you decreased a whole tier in gear weight (~7.5kg). Having above average ath is a decent advantage compared to only having average ath.
WM is actually quite useful, too, and having >20wpf over an enemy is better than it appears (every millisecond counts), but a lot gets taken away from armor. For melee, the higher wpf you have above the average, the better; therefore, WM would help for you, even if the effective value only increases by 5-6 points. Most people are around 120-130, so 140-150 is quite good.
Testing STF builds for a while is the best thing you can do. That's what made me decide that I liked 8+ath and shy away from 21/21.
@San,
How do you manage to work in riding and have +8 athletics? I'm assuming you're running a 18/24 split but the build would be more fleshed out at 15/24 but that would seem painful running around with 5 PS.
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I didn't. I had a 25/15 with 5 riding and then I respec to 18/27 pure 1h with no riding. 5PS is also more damaging than you think (at least with 8WM), even with cut only weapons.