cRPG

cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Tibe on June 12, 2013, 06:08:17 am

Title: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Tibe on June 12, 2013, 06:08:17 am

You know I always woundered how does Grellenort always run around the server in full plate and plated charger without going broke. Im just sorta suprised I didnt figure it sooner. The dude can run on constant x5 for atleast 3 hours straight during the morning, granted if there is enough players around. The full plated charger is an indestructible tool of ultimate destruction during the morning cause there is nothing that can stop it. Occasionally we do take it down....once every 15 rounds or so. :rolleyes:

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Zlisch_The_Butcher on June 12, 2013, 08:07:33 am

Or... ....he whores the marketplace...

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Akynos on June 12, 2013, 08:36:35 am

or....he sells his loompoints...

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Chris_the_Animal on June 12, 2013, 08:38:52 am

Or...he us supressing his clan and telling them if they dont give him the gold he need he will kill a kitten

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Akynos on June 12, 2013, 08:51:25 am

Quote from: Chris_the_Animal on June 12, 2013, 08:38:52 am

Or...he us supressing his clan and telling them if they dont give him the gold he need he will kill a kitten

that is the most likely and realistic scenario.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Riddaren on June 12, 2013, 08:55:45 am

Even with x5 all the time he will lose lots of gold.

You should be grateful there are some people who can afford equipping really expensive stuff.
They only make the game more fun by adding more variety.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Akynos on June 12, 2013, 09:00:41 am

Quote from: Riddaren on June 12, 2013, 08:55:45 am

Even with x5 all the time he will lose lots of gold.

You should be grateful there are some people who can afford equipping really expensive stuff.
They only make the game more fun by adding more variety.

I fully agree with Riddy. People using plates all the time are the most entertaining (and often best) players in this game.

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Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Grumpy_Nic on June 12, 2013, 09:37:01 am

Heavy equip ftw. Wish I could use heavy stuff all the time with melee and cav chars. Even the regular warhorse is so expensive that I sometimes start as infantry with my cav char and try to loot a horse during each round.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Chris_the_Animal on June 12, 2013, 09:47:52 am

btw. i am rolling x5 all morning too  :mrgreen:

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Grumpy_Nic on June 12, 2013, 10:15:03 am

Quote from: Chris_the_Animal on June 12, 2013, 09:47:52 am

btw. i am rolling x5 all morning too  :mrgreen:

HartzIV makes it possible

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Herkkutatti666 on June 12, 2013, 10:16:02 am

So how is this "abooze"?

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Tibe on June 12, 2013, 10:47:21 am

Quote from: Morso on June 12, 2013, 10:16:02 am

So how is this "abooze"?

i dunno. Give me a break ive gotten like 4 hours of sleep per day for the last 3 weeks.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Teeth on June 12, 2013, 10:49:00 am

Stop the plated charger = free valour. I love armoured horses.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Dexxtaa on June 12, 2013, 11:49:07 am

Quote from: TiberiusX on June 12, 2013, 06:08:17 am

You know I always woundered how does Grellenort always run around the server in full plate and plated charger without going broke. Im just sorta suprised I didnt figure it sooner. The dude can run on constant x5 for atleast 3 hours straight during the morning, granted if there is enough players around. The full plated charger is an indestructible tool of ultimate destruction during the morning cause there is nothing that can stop it. Occasionally we do take it down....once every 15 rounds or so. :rolleyes:

I'll be back in a couple months. I'll grab Keyarna for counter puutiisms. I like mammoth hunting.  (http://forum.meleegaming.com/suggestions-corner/(game-type)-mammoth-hunt/msg205563/#msg205563)

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Haboe on June 12, 2013, 12:04:30 pm

Xbow shoots him down, spears take him down, i no see no problem  :mrgreen:

Better way, and always works for me, become pro, go eu2, endless wins/ valours.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Kafein on June 12, 2013, 02:27:03 pm

Quote from: Haboe on June 12, 2013, 12:04:30 pm

Xbow shoots him down, spears take him down, i no see no problem  :mrgreen:

Better way, and always works for me, become pro, go eu2, endless wins/ valours.

Playing as Kafein I get like 7,5k gold per hour on EU_2 quite easily. As Kodein provided we aren't too many and there's no absolutely better player than me in the other team (aka in the morning) it's constant x5 and I think I may get even more gold, even though that's with heavy armor and shit)

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: bavvoz on June 12, 2013, 03:18:57 pm

Quote from: Akynos on June 12, 2013, 09:00:41 am

I fully agree with Riddy. People using plates all the time are the most entertaining (and often best) players in this game.

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+1 for Bud Spencer clip

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 04:59:32 pm

I just think if there would not be this completely fucked up upkeep system, but something which allows people to freely choose their equipment and still putting limitations on it to keep it balanced, which would not be impossible at all, there would be no need for topics like these. But since the devs decided to somehow abolish top tier armours and horses from the game, people who want to play a plated knight for reenactment purposes or something like that can only do from time to time, but when they do it they are as OP as they were pre-upkeep.

The day they announced the upkeep system I started getting involved into the forums more, as I saw the enormous bullshit factor, and up to this date I can still see that my first reaction was right.

The devs have made a lot of incredibly awesome changes, for me the game runs even better than vanilla, and there is so much cool stuff, I don't know where to start. Even the item balance is pretty good right now. Not flawless, but really good.

The upkeep on the other hand will always remain a black dot on the dev's white development vest (especially when they released a marketplace to finally screw up the entire system, I facepalmed so hard, I look like Quasimodo now). Really a lot of problems in the game origin(ed) from the upkeep system itself.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: BlueKnight on June 12, 2013, 08:26:57 pm

(click to show/hide)

Quote from: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 04:59:32 pm

I just think if there would not be this completely fucked up upkeep system, but something which allows people to freely choose their equipment and still putting limitations on it to keep it balanced, which would not be impossible at all, there would be no need for topics like these. But since the devs decided to somehow abolish top tier armours and horses from the game, people who want to play a plated knight for reenactment purposes or something like that can only do from time to time, but when they do it they are as OP as they were pre-upkeep.

The day they announced the upkeep system I started getting involved into the forums more, as I saw the enormous bullshit factor, and up to this date I can still see that my first reaction was right.

The devs have made a lot of incredibly awesome changes, for me the game runs even better than vanilla, and there is so much cool stuff, I don't know where to start. Even the item balance is pretty good right now. Not flawless, but really good.

The upkeep on the other hand will always remain a black dot on the dev's white development vest (especially when they released a marketplace to finally screw up the entire system, I facepalmed so hard, I look like Quasimodo now). Really a lot of problems in the game origin(ed) from the upkeep system itself.

I agree that marketplace doesn't solve any problem. I agree that upkeep is weird and unbalanced (see heavy lance etc.). I don't agree that heavy horses are op lol. I'd prefer courser, destrier over heavy horse when it comes to stats but deep inside I'd like to roll around on a heavy horse because of how badass it looks. Same with plate. It's heavy as fuck and costs shitload of gold just to be shiny :-(

To all of those saying "sell a loompoint" - I'd feel like regressing if I started selling them for gold and we all want to proceed right?

About the marketplace... I had an idea about loompoint respec which could be like skill respec but with bigger cooldown (like 3 weeks), but it would have to be followed by marketplace removal & current_gold removal. Each char would be granted the amount of loompoints from his generations and would be given some amount of gold depending on generation or something. There could also be the place on the crpg website where you would be able to sell your loom for a set price. Devs could adjust the price to as much as they want. Armoury and transfering option between alts&main could stay like it's now.

pros:
+less raging people
+lack of barriers when you want to switch class (except for cooldown -> the only barrier)
+no scammers -> fair&square -> you've got what you worked for
+more variety
+more dev influence on amount of gold among players (by adjusting selling price etc.) -> inflation under control
+no fear of losing your items and getting worse or having to pay more to regain old ones
+Devs have bigger field of mistake/change so players like Bars aren't fucked (RIP Long Voulge, Heavy Lance) and all 4stratloomrs

cons:
-genius market whoresmerchants lose the results of their hard scamwork
-Can't go high amount of looms & low gen unless in the clan or have alts

I guess people who have way more looms than generations could be given a few bonus loompoints for their the amount of life they have spent trading. All in all some active dev (khy Paul (cuz u awsum Paul)) could at least try to think how to balance it all, then 1 of the cons would disappear. [Ex. (amout of lps over generations)/2or3 = bonus, but cap would be needed]

Imho if you satisfy the marketwhoresmerchants somehow, then by introducing this to crpg you would basically change the game to better one.

Dunno but maybe adding an option to buy a loompoint in that place on c-rpg website would be a good idea as well? It would remove the 2nd con.

I never forced myself to write it b4 because people never read tl;drs, also maybe somebody suggested it before, who knows.

Tell me what ya think (I just derailed topic lul)

I guess somebody should start new topic about it so we can discuss it.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 08:48:12 pm

Quote from: BlueKnight on June 12, 2013, 08:26:57 pm

I don't agree that heavy horses are op lol. I'd prefer courser, destrier over heavy horse when it comes to stats but deep inside I'd like to roll around on a heavy horse because of how badass it looks. Same with plate. It's heavy as fuck and costs shitload of gold just to be shiny :-(

No, heavy horses are UP right now, but this is a result of the upkeep. Because it is only a soft restriction, instead of a hard one, the devs needed something to support the upkeep restriction to prevent everyone (who has the money) from riding around too OP, and their solution was to tweak the viability of those horses. You see the same thing with armours: the most viable ones are not top tier, but the tier below. It's to further discourage the use of those items.

I had an alternative proposal for the upkeep system long long time ago, and when compared you can clearly see how the upkeep system is inferior.

The idea was to introduce a certain limit on equipment value which everyone is allowed to use. Like in native basically, with your budget. Once you go over it, the budget turns red you won't spawn with one or more items. That limit grows according to your levels, but you can also raise it by spending skill points into your budget. I can even imagine having to spend skill points into unlocking more slots, and starting with 3 slots by default and having like 6 as maximum. Of course the level cap should be raised a bit to lower the loss of skill points compared to the current state, but it shouldn't make up for it completely. When spent no points at all, you will be able to wield a mid tier weapon and almost no armour at all on lvl 30.

That way you can either have good skills and bad equipment, bad skills and good equipment, or be rather balanced about it.

Advantages:
- Your equipment is not depending on external factors (course of the round, marketplace, clan, etc.)
- OP skill/equipment combinations (e.g. lvl 33 full plated cavalry) are not limited by time (once a week being able to afford that loadout means being OP once a week), but dealt with entirely (wanna play full plate on plated charger? Your skills will suck!)
- You can use your favourite equipment all the time
- Items can be balanced much better, since potentially powerfull items don't need to be nerfed to make the upkeep work a bit... (= buff for top tier weapons, horses and armours)
- More diversity in certain builds, as for now many classes often have a single "best" build (e.g. 18 STR archer). Now we would have builds moving along an additional axis, the equipment axis.
- Upkeep is gone. No need any more for many people to "semi-leech" in cheap or peasant gear.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: BlueKnight on June 12, 2013, 08:56:32 pm

(click to show/hide)

Quote from: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 08:48:12 pm

No, heavy horses are UP right now, but this is a result of the upkeep. Because it is only a soft restriction, instead of a hard one, the devs needed something to support the upkeep restriction to prevent everyone (who has the money) from riding around too OP, and their solution was to tweak the viability of those horses. You see the same thing with armours: the most viable ones are not top tier, but the tier below. It's to further discourage the use of those items.

I had an alternative proposal for the upkeep system long long time ago, and when compared you can clearly see how the upkeep system is inferior.

The idea was to introduce a certain limit on equipment value which everyone is allowed to use. Like in native basically, with your budget. Once you go over it, the budget turns red you won't spawn with one or more items. That limit grows according to your levels, but you can also raise it by spending skill points into your budget. I can even imagine having to spend skill points into unlocking more slots, and starting with 3 slots by default and having like 6 as maximum. Of course the level cap should be raised a bit to lower the loss of skill points compared to the current state, but it shouldn't make up for it completely. When spent no points at all, you will be able to wield a mid tier weapon and almost no armour at all on lvl 30.

That way you can either have good skills and bad equipment, bad skills and good equipment, or be rather balanced about it.

Advantages:
- Your equipment is not depending on external factors (course of the round, marketplace, clan, etc.)
- OP skill/equipment combinations (e.g. lvl 33 full plated cavalry) are not limited by time (once a week being able to afford that loadout means being OP once a week), but dealt with entirely (wanna play full plate on plated charger? Your skills will suck!)
- You can use your favourite equipment all the time
- Items can be balanced much better, since potentially powerfull items don't need to be nerfed to make the upkeep work a bit... (= buff for top tier weapons, horses and armours)
- More diversity in certain builds, as for now many classes often have a single "best" build (e.g. 18 STR archer). Now we would have builds moving along an additional axis, the equipment axis.
- Upkeep is gone. No need any more for many people to "semi-leech" in cheap or peasant gear.

I was once thinking that there is enough space between 30 and 31 to insert 1 more level so current 31 would be 32 and the rest could be kept like it's now with the exception that you would have to hit new_lvl32 = old_lvl31 to retire for 1lp. Would make building characters more sophisticated and original.

I think your idea is great except for the fact that all of the HX who have enough free skillpoints would be riding plated chargers all the time and delaying like crazy.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 09:01:09 pm

Quote from: BlueKnight on June 12, 2013, 08:56:32 pm

I think your idea is great except for the fact that all of the HX who have enough free skillpoints would be riding plated chargers all the time and delaying like crazy.

Yes, of course it has its downsides as well, but I think in this special case it's more about the HX as a class and the needed requirements for it, than the equipment system.

But just do give a quick shot towards a solution: I suggested one time to nerf HX's by making all crossbows unable to use on horseback (this is where most people would stop and call the solution finished, I guess  :lol: ), but to create some "horseback" copies with adjusted stats. Making those remarkably more expensive and/or using more slot would fix the problem, I guess.


Edit: I just noticed Panos minused my upkeep rant. Would you care to elaborate what is to be defended about that pile of crap?

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: karasu on June 12, 2013, 09:07:06 pm

Or he does all of those accusations at the same time...

uh oh D: (http://www.dramabutton.com/)

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: BlueKnight on June 12, 2013, 09:17:43 pm

(click to show/hide)

Quote from: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 09:01:09 pm

Yes, of course it has its downsides as well, but I think in this special case it's more about the HX as a class and the needed requirements for it, than the equipment system.

But just do give a quick shot towards a solution: I suggested one time to nerf HX's by making all crossbows unable to use on horseback (this is where most people would stop and call the solution finished, I guess  :lol: ), but to create some "horseback" copies with adjusted stats. Making those remarkably more expensive and/or using more slot would fix the problem, I guess.


Edit: I just noticed Panos minused my upkeep rant. Would you care to elaborate what is to be defended about that pile of crap?

Maybe separating horses to light and heavy and making some crossbows unusable on heavy horses could solve the problem but I don't know if it's even possible.

Also you included a few statements in your post Joker so it doesn't have to be upkeep-talk that got minused, dunno.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Falka on August 03, 2013, 09:31:43 pm

Quote from: BlueKnight on June 12, 2013, 08:26:57 pm

I don't agree that heavy horses are op lol.
Same with plate. It's heavy as fuck and costs shitload of gold just to be shiny :-(

Quote from: Joker86 on June 12, 2013, 08:48:12 pm

No, heavy horses are UP right now,

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Damn, how did I find this thread?  :rolleyes:

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Prpavi on August 04, 2013, 02:10:10 pm

Without the upkeep it would be a plate fest again, do you really want that?

It's easier than ever in the post upkeep era to play a tincan now,  marketplace makes this possible, also clan armories and banks help. I used to have fun with full Milanese and Flamburger and it cost me about 100-150k per gen. So retire once and you have 3 gens of full plate and meat cutter.

BUT, you all know you (same as me) like to sit on cash, play in lighter gear and see gold it pile up saving for loompoints to loom a new piece of armor or a nice new weapon. nothing wrong with that. What is wrong you want to have it all, pile of cash and a plate. Sacrifice 100k gold and have a blast for one gen, you'll see the plate only helps so much, I stopped using plate it because it did nothing against ranged and I couldn't run away from them. It's still great in melee.
 
Another problem is half of the people stopped retiring, unvilling to retire their lvl 34/35 builds they can't ware plate because it would bankrupt them and grinding with an alt is slow plus playing a vanilla build is not cool anymore.

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Latvian on August 04, 2013, 02:44:45 pm

i know how to abuse multi during all day, all you got to do is 

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

but for real always win rounds or get valour

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Nordwolf on August 04, 2013, 07:34:19 pm

I think I can remember him with his all +3 plated set from like 2 years ago or so.
Also all looms from his inactive clanmates go to him :D

Also do you remember that funny moment when all T's were in full plated gear with that glitch? I guess no, but that was a fun glitch.
Though After that abuse he got his looms back in no time :(

Title: Re: A way to abooze multi during the mornings
Post by: Tibe on August 04, 2013, 08:42:50 pm

You have necrod my baby....